creel limits

[dkfry]

I'm not blaming the law enforcement officers, I'm just stating the facts: they're not fisheries biologists.

I know you weren't.

[ducksnbucks36]

I'll just throw this out there.

I personally think every lake shold have a min of panfish length.  Crappeyes 10", perch 7" same for sunfish.  With the year prior having a push to keep gills of smaller size.  They should also allow say a week long permit to be bought to sink structure.  They'd be making money, and structure would be going into lakes.  Win win for everyone.   But PFBC will never change stuff isn't for the good of the animal anymore it's about getting that paycheck, and not doing common sense things. 

To think the PFBC doesn't do a poor job is laughable.  Along with some of the "biologist".  I've met very few fish commision that weren't DBAGS.  Flying around the lake motor full tilt at night no lights on. I've even had them run over my line at night while fishing...and guess what once again their lights weren't on.  Amazing they didn't catch my line in the prop.  They're arrogant, and etc etc.  Think about this if they were all for the bettering of the species why continue to stock trout in areas they won't survive?  For the $.  Systems can be implemented to catch slabs, and forage base can be added to benefit gills, crappies, and perch...but once again it would make way to much sense to do it. 

[Eddie Spaghetti]

The truth hurts. A lot of Canadian lakes see a lot of traffic(especially southern ones) and a sizeable portion of them have a dam.(like the one in my example) Regardless provinces like Ontario (used in my example) still have a lot more water and do a better job of managing them then the PFBC.(like actually adjusting limits) Lots of screw ups and inaction in PFBC past. One of the more noteable is the problems with the lower susquehanna, bass and water quality which they ignored for decades and admitted they dropped the ball on in a fairly recent publication. Now they expect the fisherman to step in, but buttons and etc to pump funds into fixing something they ignored. About all the PFBC wants to do is stock trout, musky fingerlings and wait to collect their pension. The lakes they do more closely "manage" with their "enhancement" programs end up full of mostly stunted fish. Yeah what a great job....

I was speaking specifically about lakes I fished. "I've experienced the boom on these lakes, and I've seen the bust. Lakes that used to produce numbers of fish, lately, have yielded very few. These lakes are tough to get to, and not fished as hard as our local lakes. Why the decline?". Next time, if you want to bash my post, at least do me the courtesy and read it. 

You don't seem to get my point. Let me put it to you this way. The same farmer can farm good rich fields, and ground devoid of nutrients. He can have a bumper crop year after year on the rich ground. On the other plot, he can pump all kinds of money into it, but never get the same yield as the good ground. The problem isn't the farmer, it's what he has to work with. You have to agree that most Canadian lakes are rich fertile soil compared to the manmade lakes we have here in PA.


I'm not sure why, but you seem to enjoy bashing the PFBC. They are people, and people make mistakes. Then throw in the political aspect, and things can get even murkier. If there was an "easy button", life wouldn't be such a challenge. Like I said in my earlier post, if you think you can do better, put away your fishing rod, push yourself away from the computer, and "run for office".

[Eddie Spaghetti]

I'll just throw this out there.

I personally think every lake shold have a min of panfish length.  Crappeyes 10", perch 7" same for sunfish.  With the year prior having a push to keep gills of smaller size.  They should also allow say a week long permit to be bought to sink structure.  They'd be making money, and structure would be going into lakes.  Win win for everyone.   But PFBC will never change stuff isn't for the good of the animal anymore it's about getting that paycheck, and not doing common sense things. 

To think the PFBC doesn't do a poor job is laughable.  Along with some of the "biologist".  I've met very few fish commision that weren't DBAGS.  Flying around the lake motor full tilt at night no lights on. I've even had them run over my line at night while fishing...and guess what once again their lights weren't on.  Amazing they didn't catch my line in the prop.  They're arrogant, and etc etc.  Think about this if they were all for the bettering of the species why continue to stock trout in areas they won't survive?  For the $.  Systems can be implemented to catch slabs, and forage base can be added to benefit gills, crappies, and perch...but once again it would make way to much sense to do it.

Do us all a favor, and join the board. Implement the common sense changes you feel are overlooked, and let us all catch the bounty we so desire.

[ducksnbucks36]

Do us all a favor, and join the board. Implement the common sense changes you feel are overlooked, and let us all catch the bounty we so desire.

Will do.  Then maybe something beneficial may get done instead of having jokers run the show.

Your farmer allegory wasn't the right choice either.  A farmer pumping money into poor ground like you said will turn out same if not better yield of crops than the rest.  Same can be said for a lake. 

[dkfry]

God forbid someone go against the PFBC way of doing things and point out their past screw ups and current failures. Just send in your money and shut it.

[Eddie Spaghetti]

Your farmer allegory wasn't the right choice either.  A farmer pumping money into poor ground like you said will turn out same if not better yield of crops than the rest.  Same can be said for a lake. 

Sure. 

There is a vacancy in District Six of the PFBC BOC. You'd have to move to Adams County, but it'll give you a platform to implement your changes.

[Eddie Spaghetti]

God forbid someone go against the PFBC way of doing things and point out their past screw ups and current failures. Just send in your money and shut it.

Or, try and help facilitate change. You live in District Six? Maybe you could be our man on the BOC!

[ducksnbucks36]

Sure. 

There is a vacancy in District Six of the PFBC BOC. You'd have to move to Adams County, but it'll give you a platform to implement your changes.

It's the truth. 

Adams County lol.  I'll pass on that too far

[Kov619]

Creel limits are a joke    Trout limits used to be 8  stocking was great to a lot of streams and lakes ...now the limit is 5  and they ciut the stockings in 1/2,, in the same streams and lake...took a lot of winter stockings to lakes...so tell me.  If they do a good job. Just saying

[clayboy]

What is the purpose of stocking fish?  For me it has become a personal interest in making a better place to fish. I have put hundreds of perch and crappies in a lake that has only had stunted bass and mixed size gills. I spent hours on a creek picking crayfish and my money on gas travles. I took Christmas trees there and blocks and had the commission take them away. They have done nothing on the free lake given to us by a gravel company. I and a few other ice men have made a fishery. We need or ask for no help and can't set a few piles of cover. Got to love pa commish

[Eddie Spaghetti]

It's the truth. 

Adams County lol.  I'll pass on that too far

Not every plot of ground can produce. Eventually, the farmer cuts his losses and decides to stop propping up the poor producing ground. The point is this. You have to have something to work with. Our neighbors to the north started out with fertile waters, they do what man can do, and mother nature will allow. To think we have the same situation here in PA is very misguided. All water (and the infrastructure it provides) is not the same.

[Eddie Spaghetti]

Creel limits are a joke    Trout limits used to be 8  stocking was great to a lot of streams ans lakes ...now the limit is 5  and they cit the stockings in 1/2,, in the same streams and lake...took a lot of winter stockings to lakes...so tell me.  If they do a good job. Just saying

Let's see, they stock less fish in a put-n-take fishery. Yet you are wondering why they lowered the limit? You know the answer to the question.

[clayboy]

What do you feel creates more revenue. A thee month ice season or a three week trout season? Take away the trout stamp( joke) then how much does the four good months of open water create. Why can't we the people get the ok to help? Are we the people or are we the dollar? The Pyme hatchery has all the equipment and don't feed the lake with eyes but nurse stripers. He'll let me buy 500 fingerlings or a bag of ten thousand Frey. I just want to help my water. Sorry I rambled. But we do have a lot of money going in And not much coming back out

[Icemole]

 As for the creel limits - Sayers Lake has a 9"min on crappies and you are allowed 20 fish per day. The problem is that the lake is full of 8" fish and the 9"ers that do get caught are kept making them rare. So you are left with high numbers of sub - legal fish(the same thing happens here in the SE with "big bass" lakes).

 The PFBC is proposing to allow you to keep 5 fish under 9" and 5 over 9" in their new plan with a lowered creel limit of 10 fish. This plan does nothing to relieve the pressure on those 9" fish about the only thing it allows is for guys to harvest 5 smaller fish.

 A better plan would be to make a slot limit say you can keep 20 fish but only those up to 8" maybe allow 1 fish over 12". This would protect anything over 8" allowing your bigger fish to spawn. After a few years you may need to tweak the limit at which time a 5 under + 5 over might work.

 As for the employees of the PFBC I've dealt with many from the Susky  up to the Poconoe's as well as here in the SE . Never met a rude or arrogant one yet..... even the few times I screwed up LOL.

 And yes Eddie I do get involved with the PFBC's policies - I was very outspoken about opening bass year round and supplied my input to the musky plan a year or so ago. I have no interest in Sayers Lake but they got my e-mail about that too.

[Chute82]

If you want to make a difference start a local organization or join one.  3cu, Sons of Lake Erie, trout unlimited, FFA, PA Steelhead Association, walleye club of different lakes, Gem City Fly Tiers, Pymatuning Lake Organization the list goes on and on.  Sitting behind your computer and crying is not going to make a difference. 

[ducksnbucks36]

Not every plot of ground can produce. Eventually, the farmer cuts his losses and decides to stop propping up the poor producing ground. The point is this. You have to have something to work with. Our neighbors to the north started out with fertile waters, they do what man can do, and mother nature will allow. To think we have the same situation here in PA is very misguided. All water (and the infrastructure it provides) is not the same.

Every plot of ground can produce no matter what when money is allocated to the correct areas. 5 keys to plant growth no matter where youre at OM, N, P, K, PH.  Same can be said for a fishery.  Proper allocation of funds and knowledge result in an amazing fishery.

[SuperX2Nut]

What do you feel creates more revenue. A thee month ice season or a three week trout season? Take away the trout stamp( joke) then how much does the four good months of open water create. Why can't we the people get the ok to help? Are we the people or are we the dollar? The Pyme hatchery has all the equipment and don't feed the lake with eyes but nurse stripers. He'll let me buy 500 fingerlings or a bag of ten thousand Frey. I just want to help my water. Sorry I rambled. But we do have a lot of money going in And not much coming back out

Could anyone explian what this says. I'm so confused.

[Chute82]

What do you feel creates more revenue. A thee month ice season or a three week trout season? Take away the trout stamp( joke) then how much does the four good months of open water create. Why can't we the people get the ok to help? Are we the people or are we the dollar? The Pyme hatchery has all the equipment and don't feed the lake with eyes but nurse stripers. He'll let me buy 500 fingerlings or a bag of ten thousand Frey. I just want to help my water. Sorry I rambled. But we do have a lot of money going in And not much coming back out

You  can volunteer at the hatchery, my father for years clipped Salmon and steelhead at the hatcheries.  You can also start up a club and raise fish.  Here is the info
http://fishandboat.com/stocking/coop/statement_policy.pdf

[Eddie Spaghetti]

Every plot of ground can produce no matter what when money is allocated to the correct areas. 5 keys to plant growth no matter where youre at OM, N, P, K, PH.  Same can be said for a fishery.  Proper allocation of funds and knowledge result in an amazing fishery.

I'm not talking a food plot or garden. Go to the northern tier, and see how long you pump money into some of that ground. I have helped out on a farming operation for about 30 years, and fully understand the process. Better yet, go try and farm some of the rocky ridges in WV. My point is lost with you and your dislike of the PFBC.

I'm not sure what it is with some of you guys and the PFBC. I'm not here standing up for them (although you might think that is the case). In some regards, I believe life is about balance, respect and the common good. The PFBC has many stakeholders in this game - not just the fishermen.  They make decisions daily that impact today, tomorrow, and the future. They need to make decisions that support their mission. Do they make mistakes, sure. I've not met many perfect people in my life. Man's been screwing things up since the beginning of time. Some of you act like the PFBC goes to work every day with the sole purpose of putting it to the sportsmen. Have you ever read their mission -  "to protect, conserve, and enhance the Commonwealth’s aquatic resources and provide fishing and boating opportunities." You notice it mentions nothing about slab crappie, hog perch, or whopper bass. Those are expectations man's greed inserts the mix.

I'd like to believe the vast majority of the staff at the PFBC go to work to achieve their mission. I appreciate their efforts, and thank them for their service. If something happens and I disagree with them, I'll do the responsible thing and tell them what I think. Way too many "experts" on here think they have all the answers, but don't really understand the problem.

[clayboy]

What my post says is a three week trout season get too much money for a sht fish that dies in two months. And I don't know many guys that keep stripers. So what does it matter nothing changes in state organizations. I know that first hand.

[SuperX2Nut]

Do you realize how many walleye the state stocks every year?

[clayboy]

Are we talking fry or fingerlings?  I know they put lots of millions of fry. But they buy the trout from Ohio in this part of Pa then they sell the walleye fry to
Ohio from pyme

[ducksnbucks36]

I'm not talking a food plot or garden. Go to the northern tier, and see how long you pump money into some of that ground. I have helped out on a farming operation for about 30 years, and fully understand the process. Better yet, go try and farm some of the rocky ridges in WV. My point is lost with you and your dislike of the PFBC.

I'm not sure what it is with some of you guys and the PFBC. I'm not here standing up for them (although you might think that is the case). In some regards, I believe life is about balance, respect and the common good. The PFBC has many stakeholders in this game - not just the fishermen.  They make decisions daily that impact today, tomorrow, and the future. They need to make decisions that support their mission. Do they make mistakes, sure. I've not met many perfect people in my life. Man's been screwing things up since the beginning of time. Some of you act like the PFBC goes to work every day with the sole purpose of putting it to the sportsmen. Have you ever read their mission -  "to protect, conserve, and enhance the Commonwealth’s aquatic resources and provide fishing and boating opportunities." You notice it mentions nothing about slab crappie, hog perch, or whopper bass. Those are expectations man's greed inserts the mix.

Once again your ex is a proper allocation of funds and knowledge.  And once again proper allocation of funds in a lake can produce slabs like you say.  Can't prove a point if the point isn't valid lol.

One of the keywords from their statement...enhance...

[SuperX2Nut]

It is a massive undertaking to get walleye to a fingerling size. Most warmwater fish do not feed train well, and many variables can make or break a production year of fish. Walleye can turn cannibalistic very quickly and can result in the loss of fish. Spikes or drops in phytoplankton and zoo plankton levels can also cause havoc on warmwater fish culture.   

[ducksnbucks36]

What my post says is a three week trout season get too much money for a sht fish that dies in two months. And I don't know many guys that keep stripers. So what does it matter nothing changes in state organizations. I know that first hand.

Just saying there's a ton of people who keep stripers

[clayboy]

Ok I am just hoping for a turn around in the size of panfish at shenango the eyes to come back at Pyme and a Rebirth or moraine st park. There is no help for whilhelm.  Good fishing guys

[Chute82]

Are we talking fry or fingerlings?  I know they put lots of millions of fry. But they buy the trout from Ohio in this part of Pa then they sell the walleye fry to
Ohio from pyme

Oh Clayboy you have a lot to learn...  Here are the PA state hatchery across the state
http://fishandboat.com/dir_sfh.htm
Some of the trout come from North Carolina not Ohio and they only stock certain lakes with the NC trout. 

For Lawrence county our trout come from the Corry, PA or Bellfonte, pa state hatcheries. Here is the evidence
http://fbweb.pa.gov/stocking/TroutStockingDetails_GIS.aspx

[SuperX2Nut]

The state no longer purchases trout from North Carolina.

[clayboy]

Do I have to explain chute. Pa does t stock the fish they raise they sell them to other states and private clubs and organizations. Remember a license just gives you the legal opertunity to fish that's all.