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Author Topic: questions on making leaders  (Read 517 times)

Offline dodgetech4

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questions on making leaders
« on: Jan 10, 2019, 06:43 PM »
I want to make my own fluro leaders this year. So i bought the tool and a bag of aluminum sleeves size k(.7mm). It says size k for 40lb mono on the website, There is no way the line is going to be able to go through twice to make a loop. Do i have to double the size of the sleeve. Or do I have to find mini double barrel sleeves to loop it. Im so confused lol. HELP PLEASE!!

Offline EyERipLip

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #1 on: Jan 11, 2019, 09:06 AM »
Ive never used crimps for that exact reason.... i dont know what goes with what lol. Let me know what u figure out tho bc i have been wanting to try them. Good luck!!

Offline PikeKing23

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #2 on: Jan 11, 2019, 09:10 AM »
I tie up to 60lb flouro.  No crimps.  I use a clinch knot and wrap it 3 times.  You can put a dab of super glue for extra strength.

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #3 on: Jan 11, 2019, 09:19 AM »
Aluminum crimps - perfect. Proper crimping tool, as long as it's a sized cup to cup tool - Perfect.

On crimp size: Guessing you've got Jinkai or High Seas and those are good quality crimps in the right design. What line are you looking to crimp? 40# or heavier? Jinkai size K are advertised as 50# and smaller/max line diameter of .62mm or .024", High Seas is .70mm or .028". Seaguar fluoro leader in 50# is advertised as .024"in diameter. Should fit... Look carefully at the crimp and I believe that is an oval design so the line will go through but really only side by side and if you're maxed with the line diameter limit it can be tight but not impossible. Do trim the end so it's not crushed or widened in any way or it may not fit.

If you're new to crimping here's a good resource on methods to get the best reliability from your crimps: http://www.leadertec.com/tipsandtechniques/crimp_techniques.html It's solid info from guys that stake their saltwater reps on proper crimps.

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Offline pikeaddict

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #4 on: Jan 11, 2019, 09:26 AM »
I save the crimps for wire and tie 40lb fluorocarbon with Palomar knots.

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #5 on: Jan 11, 2019, 09:40 AM »
I'll tie up to 40# but after that it becomes progressively more difficult to get a neat looking knot and control leader length. Tip o' the hat to you guys that tie 50#+, my buddy does and I know guys that are tying 130# for other uses. I won't, crimping is too easy and 100% reliable if done correctly. Plus I'm not wasting several inches of fluoro leader to tie a knot vs. crimping (no waste). BTW, if you're tying the heavy stuff a little lube goes a long way (think KY and the like, serious). No, that's not Kentucky...  ;)2

If you've tied a proper knot shouldn't need glue. Glue is a security blanket for folks that are unsure of their knot tying skills. Not picking but just think about that. There's a leader manufacturer that makes heavy fluoro leaders and they are advertised as knotted, crimped and glued. I don't get that, pick one and learn to do it right. That's like wearing a belt, suspenders and stapling your jeans to your waist just to keep your pants up. It's more of a fashion/marketing thing than any reality of "extra strength" or "added insurance". Again, if you're doing that, there's no harm in it but I can't see that there's anything gained by it. Remember, it's only my opinion and you may not agree .
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Offline PikeKing23

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #6 on: Jan 11, 2019, 09:52 AM »
If you've tied a proper knot shouldn't need glue. Glue is a security blanket for folks that are unsure of their knot tying skills. Not picking but just think about that. There's a leader manufacturer that makes heavy fluoro leaders and they are advertised as knotted, crimped and glued. I don't get that, pick one and learn to do it right. That's like wearing a belt, suspenders and stapling your jeans to your waist just to keep your pants up. It's more of a fashion/marketing thing than any reality of "extra strength" or "added insurance". Again, if you're doing that, there's no harm in it but I can't see that there's anything gained by it. Remember, it's only my opinion and you may not agree .

Just for clarity, I don't use glue, but just gave it as a suggestion if a new user didn't have confidence in his knot.  When using a clinch knot, if the wire gauge of the hook is too large or if inadequate numbers of wraps are used, the tag end can pull thru.  So a little super glue can ensure that this doesn't happen.  As stated, I don't glue, but probably should.  I do sometimes melt the end of the flouro and mushroom it out, like crimping.  I definitely like the idea of a little lube when tying the knot.  They can be a pain to "clinch" down.

Offline dodgetech4

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #7 on: Jan 11, 2019, 10:41 AM »
I orderd some double barrel crimps last night. I dont think that the line will make it through twice on the others ones. Once it all comes in ill update yall.




Offline shiveringjoe

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #8 on: Jan 11, 2019, 11:11 AM »
I experimented with 60# fluoro and crimps for a season, also tried half my rigs with trebles that year. I never had any crimps fail but I also wasn't a fan of how the heavy line looked or felt in the water. On a related note, I have never again used trebles, too many bleeding fish and I lost my biggest pike ever because i buried a barb in the ice at the bottom of the hole. I now run 25# knot2kinky wire on all my pike rigs. Its around the same diameter as 2# mono, a lot more flexible than other wires I've seen and easy to tie once you get used to it. The knot either works on the first try or folds wrong and weakens the wire. After I tie on the hook and the barrel swivel I grab each with pliers and pull. If the knots are good they will cinch down and the wire will stretch a little (making a creaking sound). If either knot is bad the wire will break at around 10# of pull. Never had a bite off or a kinked leader. I keep my leaders to around 18" long because that wire would cut a finger off if you got wrapped up fighting a fish.

Offline EyERipLip

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #9 on: Jan 11, 2019, 04:42 PM »
If u wanna “glue” for knots loon outdors makes a product called knot sense. Uv activated by the sun or a light. I use it for connecting. My fly line to backing and things. Great stuff. As far as the fluro goes i dont use it dont like. I kniw weve had this convo b4 but tieable steel is the only way imo

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #10 on: Jan 11, 2019, 06:39 PM »
Just for clarity, I don't use glue, but just gave it as a suggestion if a new user didn't have confidence in his knot.

I figgered PK23, just thought I'd punctuate your suggestion only because it makes me a little crazy to do something half@$$ and then put a "fix" on it to call it good. I can do quick and dirty in a pinch better than most but it's just not my style. It's not that hard to learn the correct way and failures spur your improvement.

I experimented with 60# fluoro and crimps for a season, also tried half my rigs with trebles that year. I never had any crimps fail but I also wasn't a fan of how the heavy line looked or felt in the water. On a related note, I have never again used trebles, too many bleeding fish and I lost my biggest pike ever because i buried a barb in the ice at the bottom of the hole. I now run 25# knot2kinky wire on all my pike rigs. Its around the same diameter as 2# mono, a lot more flexible than other wires I've seen and easy to tie once you get used to it. The knot either works on the first try or folds wrong and weakens the wire. After I tie on the hook and the barrel swivel I grab each with pliers and pull. If the knots are good they will cinch down and the wire will stretch a little (making a creaking sound). If either knot is bad the wire will break at around 10# of pull. Never had a bite off or a kinked leader. I keep my leaders to around 18" long because that wire would cut a finger off if you got wrapped up fighting a fish.

I'm not a fan of the stiff and heavy fluoro either. By the time you use a #test that provide an amount of protection it's pretty stiff. Trebles aren't that destructive especially in the small sizes I prefer. #10 is plenty for 95% of the pike you'll catch and the other 5%, if your careful, can be landed just fine with minimal damage.

Either you've got really thick 2# or that's a typo. 25# KN2K is .014" (from their website) and 2# mono will range from .004 to .006", four or more times thinner. KN2K is OK but I don't like it's stretchiness. Sure, it's kinda fun. Even an 18" leader will stretch almost an inch right in your hands. The problem is that every time it stretches it weakens the leader and you can't see it. Fight a fish, it stretches, get snagged, it stretches, show your buddies how it stretches, it stretches. Pretty soon, the next stretch and "boink"! Gone. No warning. Can't see the weakness like regular wire or other plastic leaders. It's a risk. I do like they don't get curly and resist kinking but it costs so much compared to regular wire it's cheaper for me just to swap out leaders and recover components.

I don't expect to sway any opinions here. Folks put too much stock in marketing and believe what they've been told by the "pros" without looking at the choices critically and making their own decisions. Fluoro is not invisible nor is red leader material, titanium is no more effective at preventing biteoffs or flexible than steel as much as steel is not the whole answer.

I should know better than to even walk in this door. Thought I could offer some crimp help without getting my feet muddy with the usual stuff. Different strokes for different folks. I got all I can do to be master of my square foot and a half of planet...

@dodgetech4: What pound test you lookin' to crimp? 50# or less should just fit in the crimps you have.
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Offline marabou

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #11 on: Jan 12, 2019, 10:29 PM »
Berkley leader sleeves works fine for me with 40#  flouro I use them to add trailer hooks to my laker  jigs

Offline dodgetech4

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Re: questions on making leaders
« Reply #12 on: Jan 14, 2019, 06:00 AM »
i ended up buying 40lb fluoro. I have the double barrels coming in today and i see how it goes.

 



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