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Author Topic: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer  (Read 1992 times)

Offline George_B

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Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« on: Dec 06, 2018, 04:11 AM »
Would you think the Mud Mixer would be a good choice if I wanted the confidence of stability like I would get with a Clam Plate in a slightly smaller profile for transporting and weight? I read that it does not have the RPM's of the drill, but I have no faith in that side handle it has for control if again I wanted the smaller stance without the Clam setup.

Offline Deal Ninja

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #1 on: Dec 06, 2018, 04:33 AM »
The Mud Mixer with a 9ah battery weighs 8.5 lbs.  The Milwaukee 2704 with 9ah battery and Clam Plate weighs 10.75 lbs.  Depending on the auger you have, the Mud Mixer will cut plenty fast at top speed (550 rpm).  lol  I would still give the drill/Clam Plate combo better marks for stability and safety, but if your auger catches the ice with either, its still going to hurt - one of the main reasons I chose the Nils 8 Power Point to run on my Mud Mixer.  They have an excellent reputation for not catching or grabbing the ice at the bottom of the hole.

DN
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Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #2 on: Dec 06, 2018, 06:59 AM »
Going on a second season with the MM/K-Drill combo, I haven't found anything to not like yet. The handle adjustability is a plus and so far seems extremely sturdy. RPMs are plenty for driving the K and though it is maxed does not heat up drilling a dozen holes at a time. Additionally, the K does not catch at the bottom of the hole so from a stability standpoint the combo is also pretty safe. That centering point absolutely prevents drill walking and always gets your hole right where you wanted it.

Based on DN's comments I am curious what the criteria might be for "stable" and "safe". Or perhaps it's more auger choice than the driver.

Direct drive simplifies the equation. I know, one trick pony, but I've already got a coupla perfectly good drills/drivers for home use and a dedicated tool for ice seemed right. I have mixed a couple buckets of cement though. Did a nice job and made quick work of it.
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Offline Gunflint

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #3 on: Dec 06, 2018, 07:04 AM »
Going on a second season with the MM/K-Drill combo, I haven't found anything to not like yet. The handle adjustability is a plus and so far seems extremely sturdy. RPMs are plenty for driving the K and though it is maxed does not heat up drilling a dozen holes at a time. Additionally, the K does not catch at the bottom of the hole so from a stability standpoint the combo is also pretty safe. That centering point absolutely prevents drill walking and always gets your hole right where you wanted it.

Based on DN's comments I am curious what the criteria might be for "stable" and "safe". Or perhaps it's more auger choice than the driver.

Direct drive simplifies the equation. I know, one trick pony, but I've already got a coupla perfectly good drills/drivers for home use and a dedicated tool for ice seemed right. I have mixed a couple buckets of cement though. Did a nice job and made quick work of it.

I think, however, that it really is not "direct drive" in that there is likely a gearbox that reduces the RPMs to make more torque at slower speeds, something that Clam did a rotten job at. IMO the lower RPMs are an advantage that Clam was striving for but failed.
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Offline George_B

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #4 on: Dec 06, 2018, 08:01 AM »
Excellent post to the Mud Mixer idea. I ll be using a 8 Nils Trekker model that has sections so I believe I will be able to tailor the length to the thickness of the ice, and reduce more drag weight for the pull. Also the 1 piece 8 Nils I have along with the Treakker do not have the power point. Back when I originally purchased the 1 piece manual model years ago it was and still is a great tool, so I didnt give the power point a thought. This idea could be my new conversation piece on the ice.

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #5 on: Dec 06, 2018, 08:09 AM »
Of course you're correct GF. I should have said integral gearbox. Direct only in the sense there is no 3rd party transition between power and auger. Really one less thing to go wrong.

I also like that the gearbox is built much stronger than any drill/driver. Another plus is no clutch which we have zero use for on the ice.
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Offline Deal Ninja

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #6 on: Dec 06, 2018, 08:31 AM »
exox_xtm - "Based on DN's comments I am curious what the criteria might be for "stable" and "safe". Or perhaps it's more auger choice than the driver."

What I mean by stable and safe in that context is that I would much prefer to grasp an auger the way you do the Clam Plate, as if you were using a rototiller...  It's more comfortable for me than the way you have to hold the Mud Mixer handles like a jackhammer.  I think it's safer too.  I'm sure all of the power augers were designed with ergonomics in mind when they decided to go with loop handles instead of pogo stick type handles.  Does that make more sense?

DN   
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8" K-Drill, 8" Nils Arctic Trekker, Milwaukee Mud Mixer, Milwaukee 2704-22, Clam Plate, Adapters to make everything work with everything. lol
Marcum LX-7s (2) Dakota Lithium powered

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #7 on: Dec 06, 2018, 08:51 AM »
Got it DN.  I'll surmise that part of the "loop handle" design was to support and control a 2 - 3hp gas powerhead. Honestly,  despite the diminutive form of the MM handles it's been easy to handle and control, at least for me. And you can adjust the angle of the handle(s) to accommodate what is comfortable to you. Might not be full rototiller style but you do have the ability to get the handles more in front of you if you wish. Maybe I'm comfortable with it because I ran a jackhammer for a few years waaaay back.
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Offline Deal Ninja

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #8 on: Dec 06, 2018, 09:28 AM »
Lets just say I have a healthy respect for the power these tools have after my 2704 nearly ripped my thumb off and wrenched my wrist last February.  It was very sore for months.  I was unscrewing the nuts from the 5/16" X 3" bolts that held the railing in place on the deck of my pontoon at the beginning of the refurb.  The bolts and nuts were all stainless and coming off with a breeze; all but one regular steel one that must have got mixed in with the stainless when the boat was assembled.  The nut had rusted on the bolt and I had also forgotten to switch the drill from drill mode to screw mode.  As soon as I hit the trigger on the drill, it was ripped out of my hand with force that I couldn't have before imagined and that had grotesquely contorted my thumb and wrist in the process.  lol  I am very careful when I use the drill and Mud Mixer now. hahaha
DON'T DILLY DALLY!!!   ;D

Polar Bird 3T, Eskimo EVO 1it
8" K-Drill, 8" Nils Arctic Trekker, Milwaukee Mud Mixer, Milwaukee 2704-22, Clam Plate, Adapters to make everything work with everything. lol
Marcum LX-7s (2) Dakota Lithium powered

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #9 on: Dec 06, 2018, 09:33 AM »
Ouch! Worst part is none of us are gettin' any younger. Now it takes 3 months for me to heal from something that used to take maybe a week.

Your experience and caution is duly noted and will reside in the back of my brain every time I pull the trigger. Thanks DN!
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Offline Gunflint

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #10 on: Dec 06, 2018, 09:51 AM »
I am still waffling on getting a Milwaukee Hole Hawg or Super Hawg.  They are the true Big Mamas when it comes to drilling.

https://www.milwaukeetool.com/Products/Power-Tools/Drilling/Right-Angle-Drills

The Hole Hawg is about $250 but I have seen it for much less.  I am sure it is already overkill. But, speaking of overkill, the Super Hawg is even more powerful - designed to cut 6 inch holes in wood all day long on batteries.  Same internal gearbox for more torque and lower RPMs.

Probably won't pull the trigger this year because I probably don't need it anyways - just the bragging rights.

There is one practical side, it is long and slim once you remove the handle so it is easy to pack and transport.
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Offline prospector

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #11 on: Dec 18, 2018, 08:12 PM »
I am still waffling on getting a Milwaukee Hole Hawg or Super Hawg.  They are the true Big Mamas when it comes to drilling.

https://www.milwaukeetool.com/Products/Power-Tools/Drilling/Right-Angle-Drills

The Hole Hawg is about $250 but I have seen it for much less.  I am sure it is already overkill. But, speaking of overkill, the Super Hawg is even more powerful - designed to cut 6 inch holes in wood all day long on batteries.  Same internal gearbox for more torque and lower RPMs.

Probably won't pull the trigger this year because I probably don't need it anyways - just the bragging rights.

There is one practical side, it is long and slim once you remove the handle so it is easy to pack and transport.
Get the Super Hawg. The regular one spins too fast and will shut off on larger bits. I own both machines.

Offline prospector

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #12 on: Dec 18, 2018, 08:16 PM »
Warning, my MM was shutting down the other day after my sixth hole in 6 of hard clear ice the other day. I am not sure what to think about that? 8 orange Nills.

Offline Deal Ninja

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #13 on: Jan 05, 2019, 11:54 AM »
Sound like the overload protection circuit in the battery is activating.  Maybe faulty circuit or not calibrated properly and is kicking on before there is really a need to?  Try a different battery and see if you have similar troubles with a different battery.  Was the battery getting abnormally warm?

DN
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Offline WIcrappieguy

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #14 on: Jan 09, 2019, 06:49 AM »
Warning, my MM was shutting down the other day after my sixth hole in 6 of hard clear ice the other day. I am not sure what to think about that? 8 orange Nills.

Make sure the rpm dial is set to max.

Offline prospector

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #15 on: Jan 09, 2019, 08:58 AM »
Make sure the rpm dial is set to max.
I did. I am going to try out a different battery next time. If the problem persists, the drill will be exchanged. Thanks for chiming in on my dilemma.

Offline Fordtough150

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #16 on: Jan 13, 2019, 06:09 PM »
I too have had issues with my mud mixer shutting down. Running a 12.0 or 9.0 battery Im having the same problem.  Saturday I drilled 17 holes in a row with my 6 k drill through 11.5 of ice. By the time I got to the 10th hole it cut out the first time.  By the time I got to the last hole it cut out 4 different times.  Very frustrating.  The motor did feel a little warm, but I didnt expect this at all. 

Offline prospector

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #17 on: Jan 13, 2019, 06:12 PM »
I too have had issues with my mud mixer shutting down. Running a 12.0 or 9.0 battery Im having the same problem.  Saturday I drilled 17 holes in a row with my 6 k drill through 11.5 of ice. By the time I got to the 10th hole it cut out the first time.  By the time I got to the last hole it cut out 4 different times.  Very frustrating.  The motor did feel a little warm, but I didnt expect this at all.
Sorry to hear that, but it is nice to have company. I have decided to dedicate it to my 4.5 auger for now. That is my run and gun bit and the two handles on the mixer are hard to beat.

Offline Fordtough150

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #18 on: Jan 13, 2019, 06:19 PM »
Sorry to hear that, but it is nice to have company. I have decided to dedicate it to my 4.5 auger for now. That is my run and gun bit and the two handles on the mixer are hard to beat.

Definitely sucks.  Thinking about ordering a normal fuel drill and selling the mud mixer.  Cutting out 4 times in one hole sure makes it easy to pull out the gasser for the rest of the season. 

Offline kayl

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #19 on: Jan 13, 2019, 07:58 PM »
I'm surprised to hear about the mud mixer cutting out. I used esox_xtm's and it flew with an 8" K-Drill. Granted, we only had 4-5" at the time.

Offline prospector

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #20 on: Jan 13, 2019, 08:01 PM »
I will add that the ice I was cutting was rock hard.

Offline doctorgee

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #21 on: Jan 14, 2019, 09:46 AM »
I am a new owner of the mud mixer and it's cutting out with a fresh 9ah battery if I drill lots of holes at once. After about 6 or 8 holes it will start cutting out. Never happened with my Fuel drill. I would send it for repair but with the other reports here, it's pretty clear that it's just not designed for high torque, extended drilling. Mud Mixer fails the test.
Quote- fishslap: I use a variety:  whistlin' bungholes, spleen splitters, whisker biscuits, honkey lighters, hoosker doos, hoosker don'ts, cherry bombs, nipsy daisers, with or without the scooter stick, or one single whistlin' kitty chaser

Ice safety link: http://lakeice.squarespace.com/

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #22 on: Jan 14, 2019, 10:00 AM »
This is curious. Last year I drilled 25 holes, one after another through 22" with a fresh 5Ah battery just to see what I'd get out of it. Never cut out once until the battery was empty. I'd suspect the BMS in the battery before the mixer but I'm no expert, just a consumer.

You did get a real MKE Fuel battery and not a knockoff? Gotta ask...
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Offline Fordtough150

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #23 on: Jan 14, 2019, 12:06 PM »
When it "cuts" out have you checked the battery to see how much charge is remaining?
Make sure the speed control dial is "full" speed.
If you tried 2 different batteries on the tool when it was cutting out (you mentioned running a 12 and 9) I would surmise it's the tool.
Normally when a cordless tool cuts out there's a reason. Overuse, battery issue or tool issue.
They have a 5 year warranty and haven't even been out for 5 years, sooooo get it in for repair.
I was out Saturday and drilled over 60 8" holes using a 9 amp/hr battery in 12 inches of ice with no problems and 2 bars left on battery.
If anything is wrong internally with that tool all the electrical/electronics are replaced as a unit.
Good luck.

Both batteries are actually Milwaukee brand batteries and were fully charged when used. The dial has been set on max rpm and it cuts out worse if it had less rpm.  Im going to take it into a Milwaukee authorized repair shop tomorrow.  I will post back results

Offline doctorgee

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #24 on: Jan 14, 2019, 01:20 PM »
Seriously the tool is designed for mixing drywall, stucco and concrete with very large mixers bits, not many applications require more torque as well as long run times!

But those uses don't produce that little jolt/grab when the augers break through the bottom. Sometimes it binds pretty hard, sometimes it's just a little bit, but I know every single K-Drill owner out there knows exactly what I am talking about. It's a good deal of force when it's just breaking through the bottom of the ice (chipper blade). The mud mixer is likely designed to have long run times with what is a good amount of torque, but that extreme torque when the auger breaks through is what I'm telling myself the problem must be (could very well have it all wrong). I imagine it's got some fancy circuitry to guard against excess heat in the motor which is probably a fine line, because it's made to mix mud which would be demanding work on any motor, although not any sharp torque forces being applied.

I did try another battery right away and got the same results. When I let the drill cool down a bit, it worked fine again and I did not try to drill a bunch of holes one after another. I don't think it's the battery, I use the same battery with my Milwaukee table saw and that is a pretty intense application, I just ripped 20 sheets of 3/4" plywood with it this weekend.

I would have chalked it up to a bad battery or mixer but with all these other people having the same issue... well, it's pretty clear we are talking a fundamental mismatch here for drilling ice. For drilling mud? Probably perfect, as most all my Milwaukee gear has been. But something seems to not like how the drill is handling that extreme torque at the end of the hole is my guess.

I decided to remove my 8" bit and instead will use my 6" k-drill and see if the same problem presents itself. 
Quote- fishslap: I use a variety:  whistlin' bungholes, spleen splitters, whisker biscuits, honkey lighters, hoosker doos, hoosker don'ts, cherry bombs, nipsy daisers, with or without the scooter stick, or one single whistlin' kitty chaser

Ice safety link: http://lakeice.squarespace.com/

Offline doctorgee

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #25 on: Jan 14, 2019, 01:22 PM »
Was the "speed dial" at it's highest?

Mine has not been at the highest speed, I kept it at like 300 but you may be right, I might be better off running it at the max?

And yes, these were fairly new batteries. Certainly not brand new, but I don't use the 9ah battery that much on anything else.
Quote- fishslap: I use a variety:  whistlin' bungholes, spleen splitters, whisker biscuits, honkey lighters, hoosker doos, hoosker don'ts, cherry bombs, nipsy daisers, with or without the scooter stick, or one single whistlin' kitty chaser

Ice safety link: http://lakeice.squarespace.com/

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #26 on: Jan 14, 2019, 02:27 PM »
I always ran mine @ max RPM with 8" KD. Funny I never experienced the grabbing at the bottom of the hole. I have frequently noticed a pair of "half hole sized chips" that I assume are the breakthrough chips.

Not trying to be contrary doctorgee, it's just curious. I wonder if there some sort of flaw with your K that makes it grab like that.
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Offline tswoboda

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #27 on: Jan 14, 2019, 02:41 PM »
My son uses mine as well as many passerby's on on the ice that wanted to try it out.  Truth be told there's only a couple people on this forum having problems. ;)  Try letting the big girl work at her own speed.
Yeah, keep telling yourself that.
Below is a direct quote from the K-Drill website:

K-Drill Staff
October 24, 2018
"Milwaukee Mud Mixer was tried by several members of our field test staff with similar results by all. Final Results: The heavier Milwaukee Mud Mixer did not have a high enough current load or temp setting to work with the 8 inch K-Drill and would continuously shut down after 2-3 holes. The standard 2703-20 drill far out-performed the Mud Mixer in all of our testing. Until Milwaukee makes some changes to the control circuit in the the Mud Mixer I would be certain it could be returned for a standard 2703-20 or 2803-20 hand drill."

Why do people get their panties in a bunch when someone else has a problem with a product that they like?

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #28 on: Jan 14, 2019, 03:47 PM »
Not really in a bunch. It's just that what a few folks are saying does not fit with the experiences the rest have had so it's not easy to understand. It's never happy when you make an investment and it fails to live up to expectations.

Clearly there is some sort of issue but just as clearly it is not every single mixer that has it so to call the whole thing bad is not correct. Perhaps at some point there was a design change that either created the issue or got rid of it depending on whether the mixers were newer or older. My mixer came last year as a plain tool that was sold as "separated from a kit" for very reasonable. That bothered me a bit but I've gotten over it due to no issues.

Reading through some of the previous posts I see that some (maybe all) of the problem children are running hot. I haven't noticed unusual heat from mine even when I crank off 10 - 12 holes in a row. Something is different...wish there was an easy answer.
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Offline Fordtough150

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Re: Milwaukee Fuel Mud Mixer
« Reply #29 on: Jan 14, 2019, 03:50 PM »
Yeah, keep telling yourself that.
Below is a direct quote from the K-Drill website:

K-Drill Staff
October 24, 2018
"Milwaukee Mud Mixer was tried by several members of our field test staff with similar results by all. Final Results: The heavier Milwaukee Mud Mixer did not have a high enough current load or temp setting to work with the 8 inch K-Drill and would continuously shut down after 2-3 holes. The standard 2703-20 drill far out-performed the Mud Mixer in all of our testing. Until Milwaukee makes some changes to the control circuit in the the Mud Mixer I would be certain it could be returned for a standard 2703-20 or 2803-20 hand drill."

Why do people get their panties in a bunch when someone else has a problem with a product that they like?

This is very interesting!  Nice find.   I am really wishing I would have just ordered a normal m18 fuel drill with a clam plate now...

Do you guys think I should tell the Milwaukee repair shop that I am trying to drill through ice with mine?  or say I'm mixing crete...

 



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