Eskimo Z51 8" Auger Issue

[ocburg17]

I purchased a Z51 Shark 8" Ice Auger this year and the first time I got to fish with it this year, I experienced issues with it.  I'm wondering if anyone had any suggestions or similar experiences.  I do have an email out to Eskimo but I plan on fishing this Saturday.

The issue is that the pull cord/recoil gets caught up on something 4-5 times during a full pull.  Basically I can't make a good smooth pull to start the motor because it feels like something is catching.  I followed the quick start guide exactly and also ran a break-in period on the auger in my garage.  Everything was fine then.  However, during my first fishing trip, I started to have this pull cord/recoil starting issue after drilling about a dozen holes.  I let the auger sit for a week and it still has the same issue.

Any ideas?

[lefty2053]

I purchased a Z51 Shark 8" Ice Auger this year and the first time I got to fish with it this year, I experienced issues with it.  I'm wondering if anyone had any suggestions or similar experiences.  I do have an email out to Eskimo but I plan on fishing this Saturday.

The issue is that the pull cord/recoil gets caught up on something 4-5 times during a full pull.  Basically I can't make a good smooth pull to start the motor because it feels like something is catching.  I followed the quick start guide exactly and also ran a break-in period on the auger in my garage.  Everything was fine then.  However, during my first fishing trip, I started to have this pull cord/recoil starting issue after drilling about a dozen holes.  I let the auger sit for a week and it still has the same issue.

Any ideas?

I would take it back where you bought it. Sounds like the recoil is messed up.

[ocburg17]

I'm not yet convinced it is the recoil, but I'm also lacking in my small engine knowledge...

[ocburg17]

I just pulled the spark plug and the recoil is now more smooth.  I still get some small hesitations. My understanding is that pulling the spark plug means there is no compression.  So now where does this put me?

[jopes]

you may just be pulling it too slow.  Your supposed to have fast short pulls.  It is a new engine and it will be tight with high compression. 

you may also be flooding the engine out.  Something I found out is your not supposed to keep the vent closed on the tank when not in use.

[lefty2053]

  Something I found out is your not supposed to keep the vent closed on the tank when not in use.

I have the same model with the 10" auger. I always close my vent when not in use. You only open it when you want to start it. Mine starts on the first pull every time. 3 Years old. No hesitation on the pull rope. I just grab it and pull hard and fast. Just don't pull it too far.

[jopes]

I have the same model with the 10" auger. I always close my vent when not in use. You only open it when you want to start it. Mine starts on the first pull every time. 3 Years old. No hesitation on the pull rope. I just grab it and pull hard and fast. Just don't pull it too far.

The owners manual says to leave the vent open.

[Hesperus]

Sounds like you need to visit a small engine shop and have it checked out.  Either you are confusing normal compression with drag on the recoil or there is something mechanically wrong with your unit.  Long distance troubleshooting won't likely resolve this.

[mealworm]

whats happening is its not firing on the first few pulls witch is putting gas in the cylinder,you basicly building so much pressure in the cylinder that it makes it tough to pull over,by pulling the spark plug you releasing the pressure built up in the cylinder witch will make it pull over easy.i wouldnt worry to much about it my 1 year old z71 and my original shark (13 years old)  still does this, at times it feels like its ripping the skin off my fingers when it binds up.the best thing to do is short fast pulls on the cord and it wont bind so bad if at all.good luck

[ocburg17]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone.  Lots of good information.  Eskimo is sending me a recoil free of charge to determine if that fixes the issue.  I should have it by Tuesday.  I started this engine about 25 times before this new issue started and the recoil did not feel like this before.  I'll be sure to follow up and report if replacing the recoil worked.

However to some of the comments...

I'm sure I'm not pulling it too slow.  The faster I pull, the harder it catches.  This makes me still believe the recoil is at fault.

I removed the gas cap and allowed pressure relief and then re-installed and vented the gas cap after letting it sit for a week.  Same issue (I don't think I'm flooding the engine).

I cleaned the intake filter and re-applied oil.  The intake filter is new and wasn't dirty/didn't have an excess amount of oil.  Same issue.

I've felt normal compression.  I've used power augers for 3 years (Eskimo augers at that).  I don't think this is normal compression.  Is there anything that could lead to high compression?

I can get it started on the first pull if I get in between the few hesitation points and give it a short quick pull.  I tested this by starting it, letting it run for 5 minutes then turning it off for an hour.  I went back and did this three times.  Started on first pull and ran like a top. 

[lefty2053]

From the Manual.

Using The Screw Type, Manual Venting Gas
Cap
Your power ice auger is equipped with a screw type, manual venting
gas cap.
1. Before starting the engine, turn the screw in the top of the gas
cap all the way open (counterclockwise) to its venting position.
To ensure that gas will not spill during use, check that the gas
cap is screwed on tightly and the gas cap screw is in the venting
position.
2. After using the power ice auger and before putting away or
transporting it in a vehicle, screw the gas cap screw on (clock-
wise) tightly. This will prevent gas from leaking during
storage. The gas cap will not leak gas during storage if
the gas cap is tight and the screw at the top is tight.

I never store my Auger during the summer with fuel in it. I at times will open the vent to release pressure as I live in high altitude.

[jopes]

lefty I am not going to argue with you.  But 2 week or so ago I called  customer service because my z71 was not running good, they told me the vent should remain open so the tank can breathe, you can close it during transport.

I am leaving mine open now.

[lefty2053]

lefty I am not going to argue with you.  But 2 week or so ago I called  customer service because my z71 was not running good, they told me the vent should remain open so the tank can breathe, you can close it during transport.

I am leaving mine open now.

No arguing here. I just posted what my Manual said. I never leave the vent open and have never had a problem with my 3 year old.

Like I said I open it up after a long trip for a few seconds to release pressure since I live at 5400 Ft and travel up to 10500 feet.
 either way open or closed as long as you place it so the gas doesn't leak out you should be fine.

[yank0073]

There is a post on ice fishing saskatchewan page 3 about a similar issue with some screws behind the fuel tank coming loose and binding with the cooling fins on the flywheel.  Have a look at this post for more info.  I think it is "Just fyi eskimo augers"   Its on page 3

[ocburg17]

I used the auger this Saturday and for the most part it pulled pretty smooth.  However, when I went to start it Sunday morning, the recoil again caught really hard (this time the handle got pulled away from my hand).  I pulled it steady and still felt something catch 4-5 times.  Then I went to try one last time and the recoil cord broke.

So good thing that Eskimo sent me a recoil.  I replaced the recoil tonight and I still have the same issue.  I can't even get the auger to start now.  I checked everything else and nothing is missing or appears broken.  Looks like I'll be pretty soon taking this thing to an engine shop unless Eskimo can provide some help.

[ocburg17]

There is a post on ice fishing saskatchewan page 3 about a similar issue with some screws behind the fuel tank coming loose and binding with the cooling fins on the flywheel.  Have a look at this post for more info.  I think it is "Just fyi eskimo augers"   Its on page 3

Thanks.  I don't believe that there is anything binding with the flywheel since I can somewhat see in there. 

I did remove the recoil and try and spin the recoil clutch with my fingers.  I get the same "catch" feeling so my issue is not the recoil.  However, it seems its possible that the flywheel isn't spinning normal or the flywheel key isn't a good fit.  Anyone see this before?

[lefty2053]

Sorry to hear your bad luck with the auger. I hope you get it going soon.

[Hesperus]

Thanks.  I don't believe that there is anything binding with the flywheel since I can somewhat see in there. 

I did remove the recoil and try and spin the recoil clutch with my fingers.  I get the same "catch" feeling so my issue is not the recoil.  However, it seems its possible that the flywheel isn't spinning normal or the flywheel key isn't a good fit.  Anyone see this before?

Are you saying the flywheel maybe wobbles?  This could be making contact with the mag.

I think when you get down to the bottom of this we'll find it's good old Asian QC issue...

[ocburg17]

I don't see the flywheel wobbling, but I'm also not yet ruling it out. 

I know it's not the recoil...
The auger runs awesome after being started...
The issue isn't constant...

[ocburg17]

Dropped the powerhead at the nearest authorized engine shop after a phone call with Eskimo.  Now the painful wait.  This 53 deg Wisconsin weather is making the wait extra irritating. 

[Hesperus]

Dropped the powerhead at the nearest authorized engine shop after a phone call with Eskimo.  Now the painful wait.  This 53 deg Wisconsin weather is making the wait extra irritating.

Good choice.  Not the recoil. not rubbing the flywheel, runs good when started all that leaves is maybe something grabbing in the clutch/gearbox.

[PikeSticker]

I believe you hit the nail on the head way back at the beginning of your experimentation in your Jan. 26 post. When you pulled the spark plug and turned the engine over you stated that it pulled smooth with just some small hesitations. Those are from the rotation of the crank shaft and piston reaching the turnover limit to move the piston in the other direction. No compression = smooth rotation.

I've got a Z51 ten inch and two of my other fishing buddies have older 8" Eskimo augers. Every one of them exhibits the same "symptoms" you describe, including the jerking the recoil handle from your hand now and then. Its a sign of very good compression in your unit. (Wait until its drilled 10,000 holes and see how easy it pulls!)  You just need to get use to this quirk for these engines and make sure you are grabbing very firmly on the handle, pull the rope a rotation to get to the top of a compression cycle and then give it the short hard yank. And even then it will occasionally jerk the handle from your hand. All of our augers run like champs once they fire up (as yours probably does too) and have never had any problems with them other than general maintenance of a new gas cap, throttle trigger and new blades.

I don't think the small engine shop will find anything they can "fix" and not see these "symptoms" continue when you get it home.  You might consider selling the Z51 and downsizing to the 43cc or 33cc 8" augers which should be a little easier to pull with the smaller displacement.

Just my thoughts on the subject.  And I've been known to be wrong! 

[ocburg17]

I believe you hit the nail on the head way back at the beginning of your experimentation in your Jan. 26 post. When you pulled the spark plug and turned the engine over you stated that it pulled smooth with just some small hesitations. Those are from the rotation of the crank shaft and piston reaching the turnover limit to move the piston in the other direction. No compression = smooth rotation.

I've got a Z51 ten inch and two of my other fishing buddies have older 8" Eskimo augers. Every one of them exhibits the same "symptoms" you describe, including the jerking the recoil handle from your hand now and then. Its a sign of very good compression in your unit. (Wait until its drilled 10,000 holes and see how easy it pulls!)  You just need to get use to this quirk for these engines and make sure you are grabbing very firmly on the handle, pull the rope a rotation to get to the top of a compression cycle and then give it the short hard yank. And even then it will occasionally jerk the handle from your hand. All of our augers run like champs once they fire up (as yours probably does too) and have never had any problems with them other than general maintenance of a new gas cap, throttle trigger and new blades.

I don't think the small engine shop will find anything they can "fix" and not see these "symptoms" continue when you get it home.  You might consider selling the Z51 and downsizing to the 43cc or 33cc 8" augers which should be a little easier to pull with the smaller displacement.

Just my thoughts on the subject.  And I've been known to be wrong! 

Not even close!  Kidding.... you were right on.

I'll be picking it up tonight.  The engine shop said that there is nothing mechanically wrong with the powerhead, just that I'm probably feeling the high compression.  At first I thought it was high compression, but after the recoil handle was ripped from my hands and actually broke the recoil rope, I started to question everything. 

I have a friend that uses a 43cc so that was my basis.  The engine shop said that is has higher compression than normal, but I would assume that is because it is new.  I also now understand why the z71s have compression relief valves.

The engine shop also said that he normally starts the auger at full choke and also at full throttle and that seems to help with the high compression.  Does anyone have any similar experiences?

Or does anyone have any tips to start their Z51s with the high compression?  I was able to start it a couple times today, but I had to work for it and it is 30+ degrees out.  The first few times I used the auger, I didn't have this high compression issue and I was able to start the auger within 2 pulls.

[lefty2053]

My Z51 has always started first pull unless I forget to prime it or over prime it. A guy with a brand new Jiffy one day was pulling and pulling with no start. I went over and drilled him a couple of holes. He said it started real good the first day and this being the second time out it wont start.  I asked him if he primed it. He said yes I pushed the bulb 8 times. I told him 3 times is all he needed and that it must be flooded. I also told him wait a while and then try again without prime. Later it started right up for him. If you over prime any of these they wont start. If you remove the spark plug and clean it off then try again it should start. 

Don't know if any of this helps you but it is something to remember.