manure question?

[gaffer]

whats the best manure for the garden?this site and fishfinder are pretty much all i do on the computer so i thought i would ask even though its not in the text here!thanks.carp are spawning soon i do know they help!

[rgfixit]

Don't use carp. Contrary to popular opinion, rotting fish flesh is not a good fertilizer. To really find out what the soil needs, buy a little test kit from your garden store and add what the results indicate. Don't kill the carp because you think you can grow bigger cucumbers.

RG

[Got Ice?]

You might need to add other stuff to get the soil structure correct if its to sandy or has to much clay.

[Raquettedacker]

Don't use fresh manure, it will burn your plants..Find some real old stuff... And don't bury fish in your garden, or you will have every critter in the area digging it up..Believe me I know..

[5watchman5]

Don't use fresh manure, it will burn your plants..Find some real old stuff... And don't bury fish in your garden, or you will have every critter in the area digging it up..Believe me I know..

[deweyicefish]

put some lime & 5-10 -5 on it. remember different plants need different nutrients.

[moose464]

well rotted cow is best for your vegi garden.horse is good for flowers and goat is awsome for your lawn .

[cold_feet]

This is a question like whats the best lure. Every species of vegtable you plant requires diffrent soil conditions. There is not a 1 does all here. Some plants require acidic ground some don't. Some plants like wet soils some don't. You get the idea . Get a book about vegtables and read up. Amend the soils accordingly and you will reap a huge harvest. One thing to start doing though that works well for all conditions is get a compost heap going. I did organic gardening for years. My dad and I ran a landscaping business for as long as I can remember and with the spoils came the rewards. We would collect grass clippings leaves and anything else that decomposed and created a compost heap that was immense in size. After a short time when it would break down back to rich dirt we spread it out and started a garden. No need for any fertilizers Plants grew without any problems and the harvests were huge. Getting 2 to 3 plantings of some vegtables a year. One word of caution when using a manure be very carefull of it. All manures also contain the urine. With that the ammonia will be high Ammonia will either kill or shock the plants If the manure isn't decomposed enough and basically look like pete moss you Will encounter this. Lime will neutralize the ammonia but too much lime also takes away nutrients for some plants.

 With all that has been said here if you are just starting a garden. Tilling a grassy area and amending the soils my best advise to you would be call your local AG society see what they charge for a soil test and get their advice on how to take a sample. Send them the sample of your soils in a week or so they will send back the results with advice on the amendments to give you a baseline to work off from. From this point you should by now know what the nutrients each of the plants you are planting requires and can adjust the areas for each species. Sounds like a lot of work doesn't it. Well to be honest it isn't. And the end results will be a garden of envy of the neighborhood. A little footwork at the beginning will go a long way come harvest time. It will be not a trial and error but 1st time success each and every time. Don't waist 4 month growing plants with 1/8 of the suspected harvest when 2 days reading testing and amending can give you all the plant can give in fruits. Basically its corny to say but keep your plants happy and you will smile in the end they will give back to you 100% in the harvest.

 Adding fertilizers to the ground doest account for a successful garden all the time. You need to understand all the aspects to be successful. Some soils are called heavy. Heavy soils are soils that compact easily and for the most contain high levels of clay. Bottom lands are useally high in silts. Silts are as the word appears high in fine particulates in other words runoff lots of topsoil loamy organics materails. Usually the best to grow in very high in nutrients. Advice to you is if you have heavy ground ground that packs hard drys out like concrete so to speak. A mixture of sand with fine stones like a filter sand used in septic systems will loosin the soils and keep them from packing tight. Not much is needed but doing this will allow root vegetables to grow better. In other words Carrots wont become short and fat the root itself will be able to grow deeper into the soil. Much the same can be said with all the plants the more the roots can spread out the more the plant will get the nutrition it need to grow properly. Buying some compost to add to the garden while tilling will help immensely too blend it in well. If your town collects leaves most likely it has a compost center and you can get it either for a small cost or free. Best of luck with this I hope I didn't scare you with all this information Like I said its really easy to get going I just want to see you get off an the right foot here. PM me if you wish for anything else you might need help on.
Coldfeet

[adkRoy]

You can use rabbit manure with out having to let it "age". I use it in my garden I have very sandy soil. it works great.

[Got Ice?]

This is a question like whats the best lure. Every species of vegtable you plant requires diffrent soil conditions. There is not a 1 does all here. Some plants require acidic ground some don't. Some plants like wet soils some don't. You get the idea . Get a book about vegtables and read up. Amend the soils accordingly and you will reap a huge harvest. One thing to start doing though that works well for all conditions is get a compost heap going. I did organic gardening for years. My dad and I ran a landscaping business for as long as I can remember and with the spoils came the rewards. We would collect grass clippings leaves and anything else that decomposed and created a compost heap that was immense in size. After a short time when it would break down back to rich dirt we spread it out and started a garden. No need for any fertilizers Plants grew without any problems and the harvests were huge. Getting 2 to 3 plantings of some vegtables a year. One word of caution when using a manure be very carefull of it. All manures also contain the urine. With that the ammonia will be high Ammonia will either kill or shock the plants If the manure isn't decomposed enough and basically look like pete moss you Will encounter this. Lime will neutralize the ammonia but too much lime also takes away nutrients for some plants.

 With all that has been said here if you are just starting a garden. Tilling a grassy area and amending the soils my best advise to you would be call your local AG society see what they charge for a soil test and get their advice on how to take a sample. Send them the sample of your soils in a week or so they will send back the results with advice on the amendments to give you a baseline to work off from. From this point you should by now know what the nutrients each of the plants you are planting requires and can adjust the areas for each species. Sounds like a lot of work doesn't it. Well to be honest it isn't. And the end results will be a garden of envy of the neighborhood. A little footwork at the beginning will go a long way come harvest time.  It will be not a trial and error but 1st time success each and every time. Don't waist 4 month growing plants with 1/8 of the suspected harvest when 2 days reading testing and amending can give you all the plant can give in fruits. Basically its corny to say but keep your plants happy and you will smile in the end they will give back to you 100% in the harvest.

By adding lime you are raising the pH of the soil not really neutralizing soil since every plant grows better at certian pH levels(dirt is what you sweep up off your floor).When the pH is to high or to low the nutrients become locked and cation exchange can't take place, and plants won't be able uptake the nutrients. Also when stuff decomposes it doesn't turn to soil, it turns to organic matter, soil has sand, clay, and silt in it, even organic soils have some amount of these. You can add all the nutrients you want but if the soil structure isn't right for what you won't to grow it won't grow very well.

[dukhnter8]

Contact cornell cooperative extension about a soil test as you may need different nutrients. Adding a general fertilizer maybe wasting money as you may just need lime or phosphorus or whatever the soil test tells you. I've heard horse is best for flowers and gardens.

[cold_feet]

Got Ice
You are absolutly correct.  My bad when I stated compst turned back to dirt. Organics is the proper term. As far as adding lime goes I agree too. I basicly stated without argument soil samples are need first. Manure can be for the most also high in the amonia from the urine Lime will "sweeten" that so to speak but tossing a bag or two without knowing what you are doing is not going to help anything. We are on the same page here and stand corrected with your input and thanks.
ColdFeet

[fingerlaker]

If you have a woodstove or fireplace the ashes go well in the garden as well.  They suppliment the soil with calcium and potash.   Manure should be at least a year old before it is placed in the garden....and never used the poopy from dogs, cats or  :ohumans in your garden.

[Got Ice?]

Got Ice
You are absolutly correct.  My bad when I stated compst turned back to dirt. Organics is the proper term. As far as adding lime goes I agree too. I basicly stated without argument soil samples are need first. Manure can be for the most also high in the amonia from the urine Lime will "sweeten" that so to speak but tossing a bag or two without knowing what you are doing is not going to help anything. We are on the same page here and stand corrected with your input and thanks.
ColdFeet

My wife loves to grow fruits and vegatables and the only way to get the best from each plant is to have a spot catered to the specific plant you want to grow. So to make it easy we use raised beds and containers to grow in mostly(some great books on the subject). The containers are nice for moving the plant around to get more sun or put in the garage when it might frost. It takes a little work at the start constructing growing structures and at the begining of each year checking the soil in each growing spot but the wife gets some excellent products in the end.

[Mainehazmt]

here ya go!    from what I have seen   evidently....elephant manure!     At our shrine circus a few years back we had a dumpster for the manure   and local nurserys always bought it     that year somebody stole a dumpster full of manure!!      911   Id like to report a theft of Sh--      lol    to bad we didnt have 911 till just a few years ago    suprised it didnt end up on americas most wanted    it did make the weekly rag (gossip paper) they call the news paper  lol

[brace]

Contact cornell cooperative extension about a soil test as you may need different nutrients. Adding a general fertilizer maybe wasting money as you may just need lime or phosphorus or whatever the soil test tells you. I've heard horse is best for flowers and gardens.

X2 -- I used the University of Maine to test my garden and food plots last year.  Cost me $15.00 and I got a full report within 2 weeks. Best money I've ever spent.

[BJSClamMan]

I use this stuff called Natures Harvest .. It comes in a gallon jug.  You can get it at Agways and better Landscape places . Also on line..  At Lowes or Home Depot I have found qaurt bottles of  Alaska Fish Food.   Neither of these are "cheap dates" . They consist of  fish and aqautic plant materials. If you can dial in the contents of the aforementioned I think you will have it licked.   I use this stuff and my gardens rock !!!PM me if you want more info .

[moose464]

holly sh_t  what happened to putting a garden in and growing vegies .way to high tech for a yard garden .till your soil ,put your vegies in ,water,weed when needed you'll have a great garden .

[Got Ice?]

holly sh_t  what happened to putting a garden in and growing vegies .way to high tech for a yard garden .till your soil ,put your vegies in ,water,weed when needed you'll have a great garden .

a soil sample is high tech

[Oldtimer]

If it is not beach sand, it is amazing what just dirt will grow..  If it grows weeds it will grow vegetables...

[gregod]

compost, compost, and more compost!

I started gardening about 6 years ago. The first year I thought everything was growing great. My tomato plants were about 3 feet high and producing well. After adding compost a few times every year, I now get plants that are 6 feet high and loaded with toamtoes.

By the way, isn't it time to plant the peas?

[gaffer]

thanks for all the tips and advice,i live in fultonville-anybody know the rule of thumb date,to drop veggies in the ground?i got 54 tomato plants and 70 peppers growing downstairs,hope my girl is interested in canning this year ;Dthat is if the garden produces!virgin soil,going to get it tested.

[Got Ice?]

thanks for all the tips and advice,i live in fultonville-anybody know the rule of thumb date,to drop veggies in the ground?i got 54 tomato plants and 70 peppers growing downstairs,hope my girl is interested in canning this year ;Dthat is if the garden produces!virgin soil,going to get it tested.

A farmer's almanac is a good place to look for dates and such. I know tomatoes like warm weather to grow well.

[sled-in]

I live on what was once a farm, I burned down the barn and turned what was once the chicken coop into a garden, that is the best garden I have ever seen, it is on the top of a gravel ridge so the soil is loose and somewhat sandy with years of composted chicken manure. After I buried the barn I used the skid steer to move the old manure pile from behind the barn to behind the garden, I still have the pile there, its too rich of soil already, I can't grow my potato's in there, they get whats called "scabs" they look like cantaloupe with the rough skin.

I think its funny that it was mentioned that if the soil is too heavy to add sand. My inlaws have that problem, they have been putting manure in their garden for 25+ years and still have heavy concrete like soil, I think I have suggested it to them before to add sand.

[SNAGGER]

thanks for all the tips and advice,i live in fultonville-anybody know the rule of thumb date,to drop veggies in the ground?i got 54 tomato plants and 70 peppers growing downstairs,hope my girl is interested in canning this year ;Dthat is if the garden produces!virgin soil,going to get it tested.

 Already got them going,they could get leggy by early June, transplant them a couple times and get them outside under plastic as soon as allowable... I start mine in early April.....Heres a tip on watering your garden, water vigorously and less often and in the morning, not lightly and often, this will give the roots water deep down and the plants time to dry during the day avoiding any fuguses..  If the water runs off your garden after a rain, you need to condition the soil next season..  PH is key...  Pests are my biggest challenge evey year... good thread..

[Hardwaternubie53]

thanks for all the tips and advice,i live in fultonville-anybody know the rule of thumb date,to drop veggies in the ground?i got 54 tomato plants and 70 peppers growing downstairs,hope my girl is interested in canning this year ;Dthat is if the garden produces!virgin soil,going to get it tested.

Hey Paul!
How are you doing? How did you make out the rest of the season? I got one dink pike and a 22", 2.25lb. keeper in the Fuel & food Tourney. No prize for it, of course, but they were my first pike ever out of 'Daga. Can't wait for bass season. Maybe we can hook up for a day of bass? Or, if I get my act together and get my son's boat in the water, we could go striper fishing in the Hudson. They will be coming up river soon.............

I just bought a soil test kit from Lowes. It was in the section with all of the seeds. It cost $4.00 with tax. It is simple to use and should get you started. Then, Like the others said, look up what your soil needs (library or internet, or ask at a Hewits / garden center) what to add for your specific plants.

If you have an overabundance of produce this year, your local food pantry will be only too glad to take a donation of fresh produce.

God Bless!
HWN  (Neal)

[Hardwaternubie53]

Hey Paul!
How are you doing? How did you make out the rest of the season? I got one dink pike and a 22", 2.25lb. keeper in the Fuel & food Tourney. No prize for it, of course, but they were my first pike ever out of 'Daga. Can't wait for bass season. Maybe we can hook up for a day of bass? Or, if I get my act together and get my son's boat in the water, we could go striper fishing in the Hudson. They will be coming up river soon.............

I just bought a soil test kit from Lowes. It was in the section with all of the seeds. It cost $4.00 with tax. It is simple to use and should get you started. Then, Like the others said, look up what your soil needs (library or internet, or ask at a Hewits / garden center) what to add for your specific plants.

If you have an overabundance of produce this year, your local food pantry will be only too glad to take a donation of fresh produce.

God Bless!
HWN  (Neal)

Forgot to mention... Memorial Day weekend is usually a safe time to plant veggies outside in our general area.
Good Luck! N.

[cold_feet]

When Planting most above ground Veggies think of it this way. Vegtables are a annual plant which means they die off after frost. So with that Like stated before keep you planting till after frosts are a threat. Some areas of NY planting can be done earlier than others. If frost might become a threat after your planting just cover the plants.

Some things like Potato's, Onions, Parsnips Carrots Etc.. Things that are in the ground can take earlier planting as their leaves wont appear until later when Frost is not a factor. Seeds also can get a early start. But still protect them if need if frost in in the forcast if they sprout above the ground.

With Heavy soils Like i stated before adding sand fine stone etc. Add plenty of compost too or some topsoil or all above. You can not turn clay to sand nor a good growing soil you are just amending it. Adding the other ingredients will cut the percentage of clay making it easier to work and allowing root vegtables to grow deeper. And allowing plants to get a better root system sustaining higher yields of vegtables. One other thing too left over live night crawlers from fishing trips placed in the garden area gives that ground good aeration as they burrough in. And a good place to look next time you need them for fishing.

As far as pest controll goes. Some plants themselves make for pesticides. Garlic, Onions, Chives and even Marigolds deter pests. If placed in the right locations amongst the garden some spraying can be eliminated. O-Natural. Even some pests can be controlled with a spray of basic dish soaps. It won't Kill just deter them from chewing. Organic Gardening can be cool to do and for sure when your mowing the lawn you can walk over and swipe a few thing and eat them without washing first or waiting days for chemicals to break down before harvesting.

[Wellsy]

compost, compost, and more compost!

I started gardening about 6 years ago. The first year I thought everything was growing great. My tomato plants were about 3 feet high and producing well. After adding compost a few times every year, I now get plants that are 6 feet high and loaded with toamtoes.

By the way, isn't it time to plant the peas?

Ditto on the compost, I have very sandy soil and turn in 1 cubic yard to every 300-400 square feet of garden space once a year. And if your gardening on the smaller side you can lay out newspapers in between your rows and cover with a couple of inches of compost...makes life real easy on the weeding. just show a little caution on were you get compost from, if its leaf and limb that's not broken down well it will produce a lot of heat not to mention ph through the roof.

thanks for all the tips and advice,i live in fultonville-anybody know the rule of thumb date,to drop veggies in the ground?i got 54 tomato plants and 70 peppers growing downstairs,hope my girl is interested in canning this year ;Dthat is if the garden produces!virgin soil,going to get it tested.

"NOT YOUR PEPPERS" But for your tomatoes...if you can find wood chips broken down back to organic matter or even roughly close to that point. Bring it on heavy and deep. I have a local farmer who takes in grass, wood chips, etc. After turning the chips a couple of years I made an area with it just for tomatoes. Well the result was a four year run of plants averaging 10'-14' tall(my best was just over 16') with high yield per plant too. Nothing more than triple 10 and grass clippings were added during growth.
p.s if you start getting tomatoes plants that big I highly recommend 3/4" re-bar buried at least 36" deep for staking.   

[Meatball78]

Personally I use the straw that I use for bedding my animals. Just a thought on using manure there is always the chance that along with spreading the manure you will be spreading the seeds of whatever that animal has consumed. Neighbor ran into that problem one fall with thistle. His cows got into a bunch of it and in the spring everywhere he had spread the manure he now had a nice patch of the damn stuff growing. Since oats are a cultivated plant the straw is usually very clean and having a hollow stalk it breaks down very fast. Just my 2 cents on the subject.