Milwaukee vs. Dewalt - New stuff and new approach

[Gunflint]

I was at a Home Depot yesterday and they were having BATTERY DAYS with the local sales reps from Milwaukee and Dewalt.

For those who are unfamiliar, there is a big war going on in the portable tool market with Milwaukee and Dewalt at the center of it claiming the best portable power tools, including drills. Milwaukee has their new M18 High Output battery and Dewalt developed 20/60V Flexvolt batteries. Drills from both brands are the driving force behind the majority of electric augers. Both companies have new 12AH batteries that are amazing.

INTERESTING DISCUSSION:
I spoke at length with the Dewalt person about their new Flexvolt battery and drill. I asked him about the torque output of their new Flexvolt Drill and he replied,"We do not specify torque any more, we measure power in UNIT WATTS OUT (UWO)." They are the only company to measure drills this way.  The rep said that the new drill actually has LESS torque and more speed than the older Dewalt model. This Unit Watts approach may be great for construction and highlight what they think is a perceived advantage for Dewalt, but I think it is worse for ice augers. Ice augers need raw torque. With the newest generation of battery powered drills Milwaukee wins hands down on torque.

In general, I am suspicious when a manufacturer changes the rules (from torque to UWO) and then uses their own new rules to prove they are better.

For the Dewalt guys in this forum, you might want to look into the older style drills.

[lefty2053]

Thanks for sharing that. I always wondered why they didn't use Torque values. Most likely they are great for the everyday drill but not with the Augers.

[Ice Scratcher]

DeWalt had always used watts for their specs..

This battle of which you speak, is for second place, since the new Ridgid Octane (top torque dog) has been available.

<°)))>{

[Gunflint]

Thank you,  Ice Scratcher.  Rigid's sales rep was not at the Home Depot, which is odd because they are a Home Depot brand.

In my handyman life I am a "Rigid" person with an arsenal of tools and batteries/chargers.

I just checked out the Rigid "Octane" products and their drill has 1,300 lbs of torque and seems less expensive than the guys mentioned above. However, the largest Octane battery they have is a 9AH, but I hope they introduce a 12 AH like their competitors.

Nice to know my guys are keeping up and even surpassing the competition.

[mboss13]

I thought most of the augers like k-drill or mora require around 750lbs. for 8" auger.....the dewalt 996 hammer drill (can be purchased for around $75 as bare tool if one already has plenty of 20v batteries) should have no problem putting out that torque....even if measured in Dewalt's own "make belief" units....


I have no doubt the M18 is the more powerful tool and would jump all over it. However I own all the other dewalt tools already so getting the 996 with a little nero 8" seems like the best option for me. As far as the 12ah flexvolt battery, at $250 i'll pass and just carry two 5ah with me that came from one of my kits.

[Gunflint]

MBOSS,

I looked online and was able to find the new M18 12AH battery at less than $130 for battery only.

I understand your Dewalt heritage/investment. I would rather have stuck with my Rigid family (especially with the info above that Ice Scratcher provided). But I want a 12AH battery...

[hookset81]

Good info and conversations.

A couple of points on this battle between Dewalt, Milwaukee and Rigid.   

-Milwaukee and Rigid are made by the same parent company
-Rigid is typically about one step behind Milwaukee, this is on purpose
-Dewalt seems to be "catching up" in the follow the leader sort of way but their batteries are nowhere near as affordable as the Milwaukee's
-Warranty with Milwaukee (and Rigid) is hands down better than Dewalt(my opinion based on my personal experience)
-The other tools you can use the M18 batteries on are much better than the selection from Dewalt
-I like red better than yellow, so there is that too...

In the end for me, I have Milwaukee and don't regret it a bit.  I have seen the Dewalt drills break down on the ice, I have yet to see a Milwaukee break.

[Ice Scratcher]

Thank you,  Ice Scratcher.  Rigid's sales rep was not at the Home Depot, which is odd because they are a Home Depot brand.

In my handyman life I am a "Rigid" person with an arsenal of tools and batteries/chargers.

I just checked out the Rigid "Octane" products and their drill has 1,300 lbs of torque and seems less expensive than the guys mentioned above. However, the largest Octane battery they have is a 9AH, but I hope they introduce a 12 AH like their competitors.

Nice to know my guys are keeping up and even surpassing the competition.

Yeah all three mentioned are actually awesome. But I'm partial to Ridgid tools myself. Some of them are used every day year round..

I have no need for these monster batteries either, I have plenty of 4 amp to get me through anything. Not sure why everyone needs the mega batteries, it's not like we're flying to Mars and only allowed to bring one battery.. I would actually rather have two 4 amp, than one 9 amp. On the job, I can use one while the other is charging. I actually prefer 2 amps for all day type of jobs because they're lighter, which makes a difference at the end of a long day..

Everyone is different though, thank God..

<°)))>{

[lefty2053]

I used my Ridgid last year with the 4 ah battery and never had to change out . I only drilled 30 holes from 12"-20" last year but still had 2 lights left out of 4 on the charge. 9 Ah will weigh a lot more than the 4 or 5 ah.

[mboss13]

MBOSS,

I looked online and was able to find the new M18 12AH battery at less than $130 for battery only.

I understand your Dewalt heritage/investment. I would rather have stuck with my Rigid family (especially with the info above that Ice Scratcher provided). But I want a 12AH battery...

Right, at that price I'd jump at it for the dewalt line....there is always next year

And of course when I got started with cordless dewalt tools I got a few sets as gifts.....and I kept them and expanded the line......never once thinking I'd use any of it on the ice......if a guy had a crystal ball......

[Lsranger406]

So why the big deal over a 12ah battery? Do you really plan on drilling that many holes. I drilled over 100 holes through 12 inches of ice on a 5ah battery.  Don't really see the need for more. Just means carrying more weight.  Don't get me wrong it is cool to have but really don't see the need.

[Gunflint]

So why the big deal over a 12ah battery? Do you really plan on drilling that many holes. I drilled over 100 holes through 12 inches of ice on a 5ah battery.  Don't really see the need for more. Just means carrying more weight.  Don't get me wrong it is cool to have but really don't see the need.

The big deal on 12AH batteries for me is that I plan on powering my Garmin Livescope with the M18 battery and not a 12V lead acid or Lithium. The Livescope is power-hungry and even the 9AH isn't enough. Once I power my Livescope on the M18, whatever I use on the Drill/Auger is able to use the same redundant battery.

[MT204]

My take on batteries is two are always better than one!
If you only have one and it goes dead your out of batteries.
If you get where your going and one is dead sorry. With two odds are you still have one.
In the case of the 12 ah batteries "I" would rather have 4 of the 4,5 or 9 ah than 2 of the 12 ah.
I have 2-9 ah Milwaukees to run my Milwaukee Mudmixer with K drill and 1 M18 compact battery to run my Vex and have never even came close to running out of batteries.

[Gunflint]

I agree. I bought 2 of the 12AH for the reasons you described.

[rundrave]

So why the big deal over a 12ah battery? Do you really plan on drilling that many holes. I drilled over 100 holes through 12 inches of ice on a 5ah battery.  Don't really see the need for more. Just means carrying more weight.  Don't get me wrong it is cool to have but really don't see the need.

Some people run larger diameter augers, I use an 8", and the ice can get to be 30+ inches. When you run and gun like some of us do, its completely justifiable to have a high amp battery.  Id rather carry that battery than lug a jiffy model 30 around 

[winterbuddy]

My take on batteries is two are always better than one!

Pretty sure 99.95% of the folks buying 12ah batteries for ice fishing have plenty of smaller sizes available too. 

[luv2fish2]

all the drills pretty much beat manufactures recommendation on torque values i always had craftsmen 19.2 loved them but their not even close. I switched 2 years ago to a milwaukee 750in lb drill (2604) and a clam plate & k drill ( 8" ) i started with two 4 ah batteries and blew threw them out on erie in about an hour one day . So this last year i bought a 7 1/4 circular saw with a 9ah better but still wanted bigger so i just bought a milwaukee chainsaw kit with a 12ah and free 12ah haven't used chainsaw much but i'm impressed so far  . To me like everyone said it's whatever your tool of choice is , they all rock !But i'm loving all milwaukee's so far . alot of guys fish big water and move to follow the fish. I do so batteries are important and i try to keep everything to bare minimum easier not to loose off of sled .seems like everyone cheerleads for their choice,  but i love that their competitive , makes better tools  and forces better prices ,plus i get to buy more tools                
So yeah i definately need as big a battery as i can get like  rundrave

[tbern]

Sorry for the hyjack, but where did you get your chainsaw kit with free extra battery from?

[DTro]

It looks like this one might come with (2) 12ah batteries? 

 https://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwaukee-M18-FUEL-16-in-18-Volt-Lithium-Ion-Battery-Brushless-Cordless-Chainsaw-Kit-with-Free-High-Output-12-0Ah-Battery-2727-21HD-48-11-1812/306638555?cm_mmc=Shopping%7CG%7CBase%7CD28I%7C28-32_PORTABLE%7CNA%7CPLA%7CFixed%7c71700000041074945%7c58700004387938466%7c92700037075007633&gclid=CjwKCAiAt4rfBRBKEiwAC678KXkg8ZGTFxMPfrXpLm4wD6_rpU97o3lF0C94Zc6oxOfTsKcMEJTBRRoCzYgQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

[tbern]

tnx for the link.

[luv2fish2]

yeah home depot online

[Peccavi18]

I wouldn't mind a 12ah or 2 I have a pile of batteries, but 2 or 3 of the big ones is easier to keep an eye on, store and keep dry than 3 or 4 or 5 small ones.

[DTro]

Does anyone know if the DeWalt 12ah batteries have been bundled with any tool packages?  From what I can find you only can buy it on it's own.  Sometimes it's a better value to get it bundled such as the MW Chainsaw deal above.

[Seamonkey84]

I’m beginning to wonder, when is one of these tool companies going to put out an ice auger/package themselves?!?

[Lsranger406]

I’m beginning to wonder, when is one of these tool companies going to put out an ice auger/package themselves?!?

Now that is a good idea!

[Seamonkey84]

Now that is a good idea!

Home Depot already sells ice gear and have everything listed as “suggestions” to put it together. For the electric power heads augers, these tool companies can really give strikemaster and ion a real run for their money and show it how it’s done lol, and still make it multi use probably.  The mud mixer comes close with the shape and torque, maybe that with new handle to look more auger like lol. Or if they made an adaptable head unit for a M18 drill press, power tool for the garage or work place, heavy duty auger for the ice.