Author Topic: Which line material  (Read 1753 times)

Offline Chris338378

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Which line material
« on: Nov 02, 2016, 07:36 PM »
I primarily jig for pan fish and have always used some brand of Mono in three or four pound test for my jigging reels and stared wondering about the other line materials such as Nanofil, Flourocarbon, and the Superlines.  Last year I tired Trilene Micro Ice and wasn't a fan of it.  I can't say any reason why but I just wasn't a fan.  I've used Trilene's  Cold Water line for a long time and don't have any major complaints about it and caught lots of fish on it so I've gotten into the habit of using it.  What is your experiences with these other line materials and are they really worth the extra money? 

Offline Old Goat

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #1 on: Nov 02, 2016, 07:45 PM »
Give the Asso line a try I know they make .5lb  1 lb.  1.5 lb. and up

Offline Chris338378

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #2 on: Nov 02, 2016, 07:48 PM »
I've never heard of the Asso line before, who makes it and what material is it made from?

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #3 on: Nov 02, 2016, 07:49 PM »
Hey Chris, I've played with a few but sway toward the superline field. Lotsa Berkeley Ice Mono, Silver Thread and Sufix. Now I'm basically a Nanofil guy. OK, I bought  giant spool of 10#, diameter of 4# or something like that. I like the durability, no memory and zero stretch. The no stretch is a two way street. Everything you can feel the fish can feel back so you gotta be extremely diligent. Other than that it's a no brainer for me.

Remember, you can use rope if you wanna as long as your leader is right. Stick with high profile brands and you'll not be disappointed (often). Not saying it won't happen but not as often as the dark horses.
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Offline Old Goat

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #4 on: Nov 02, 2016, 08:01 PM »
I've never heard of the Asso line before, who makes it and what material is it made from?

Asso Invisable Ultralight    100% Fluorocarbon     Looks like Your Bobbers Down carries it.

Offline SALMONEMIA

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #5 on: Nov 02, 2016, 08:13 PM »
Interesting you don't like the trilene micro ice I use it almost exclusively on my jigging rods in 4lb test. Never had a problem with knots, line failure etc, and it stays soft in the cold. I also use Pline CX premium it works very well in cold water applications and has virtually no memory I use the 2lb test though I'm sure they have it in 3-4 lb test
Salmonemia

Offline Chris338378

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #6 on: Nov 02, 2016, 08:25 PM »
I didn't have any problems with knots, line failure, or any thing else for that matter just for whatever reason I didn't like it.  I don't know why maybe because I was trying something new or I didn't catch as many fish on it as I did with the Trilene Cold Water.  Either way it got me thinking about these other lines.

Offline perch_stalker

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #7 on: Nov 02, 2016, 08:32 PM »
I've always been a fan of Fireline, but after reading a bunch of threads and reviews last fall, I switched all my panfish rods to 3# PLine Floroice. Also used 4# PLine Floroclear. Had awesome luck with both. Didn't have a problem with memory or line strength. Caught lots of fish and knots held up great! I would highly recommend it. And no need to run a leader being it's already invisible to the fish.

Offline Old Goat

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #8 on: Nov 02, 2016, 08:33 PM »
look for slipbobs asso testing post with break strengths he brought in a sturgeon on 3 lb. need I say more

Offline SALMONEMIA

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #9 on: Nov 03, 2016, 12:09 PM »
I didn't have any problems with knots, line failure, or any thing else for that matter just for whatever reason I didn't like it.  I don't know why maybe because I was trying something new or I didn't catch as many fish on it as I did with the Trilene Cold Water.  Either way it got me thinking about these other lines.
Im glad you asked the ? as I was  reading the specs for pline vs trilene the pline 4lb is thinner than the micro ice.  ;D guess I need to spend more money
Salmonemia

Offline bigstorm

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #10 on: Nov 03, 2016, 05:48 PM »
Last year I tried the Sufic FluoroIce and the 3lb and 4lb, I am not a fan. It seems pretty stiff in the cold. I will be going back to the Sufix Ice Magic mono this year

Offline Van_Cleaver

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #11 on: Nov 15, 2016, 09:41 AM »
I've been using P-Line Floroclear for a few seasons with good results. No problem with knots and it is hard to see so I always have several rods rigged and ready for jigging. Pretty sure it's coated and not solid floro, but it is also less expensive.

Offline dkfry

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #12 on: Nov 15, 2016, 04:58 PM »
I like Flurocarbon but there is nothing wrong with a good mono. Fluroclear works too and the flurocarbon coating helps prevent water absorbtion. Super lines like Nanofil, Fusion or braids are too visible under the water for my taste, plus they do absorb water. It doesn't hurt to have a little line stretch on a jig pole.

Offline conesuscrab

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #13 on: Nov 27, 2016, 02:05 PM »
I like Seaguar Red Label Fluorocarbon.  I've had good success with it and been very happy with the way it holds up.

Offline Sandcountrylivin

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #14 on: Nov 27, 2016, 02:23 PM »
Berkeley trilene 100% fluorocarbon. Big fan!!

Offline Bout-Time

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #15 on: Nov 30, 2016, 09:47 PM »
ASSO Ice Heavy floro in brown color has been great to me for 5 years.
"Many fish their entire lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after."-Henry David Thoreau

Offline Iceassin

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #16 on: Dec 02, 2018, 04:13 AM »
I just read a short article by an ice "pro" by the name of Rod Woten who put the whole mono vs. fluoro thing into a perspective that is short and simple (it applies primarily to pan fishing):

Mono : * stretches more than fuoro but isn't a big issue in 20 FOW or less
                     * lower memory = less coil = less jig spin than fluoro
                     * better jig presentation than fluoro especially when using smaller jigs...going down to 1# test (1)

Fluoro : * lower stretch than mono-better in deeper waters and when using larger jigs (1)
                      * more sensitive than mono
                      * less visible than mono allowing you to go to a higher # line rating
                      * more abrasive resistant
                      * does not absorb water-less ice build up

(1) I'm assuming that when he is referring to jig size that "smaller" means 4mm and less and "larger" is 5mm and above...at least that's what I consider it to mean.
 
He did say that  most of the time he prefers mono in the above scenarios. He also wrote about using braids and copolymers but wasn't real high on them.

Anyway, most of us had/have a pretty good idea on "which lines did what" and what our preferences were, but just wanted to share a quick reference that broke it down quick and to the point.

Also found this...which basically but a little more what the above says. Kinda changing my approach...I think  ;D

http://www.berkley-fishing.com/Berkley-ae-monofilament-vs-fluorocarbon-infographic.html
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Offline stinkyfingers

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #17 on: Dec 02, 2018, 06:11 AM »
Maybe you guys can help me understand something that puzzles me. Many of you use very light fluoro leaders for your fish species, down to 1# and 2#. Fluoro is touted as invisible

to fish in the water. Why choose those gossamer lines when a heavier line, say 4#, would also be invisible? There can't be gradients of invisibility. Either it is or it isn't. Is it lure or

jig action that mandates the lightest lines or some other factor?
"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man".

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #18 on: Dec 02, 2018, 06:22 AM »
Maybe you guys can help me understand something that puzzles me. Many of you use very light fluoro leaders for your fish species, down to 1# and 2#. Fluoro is touted as invisible

to fish in the water. Why choose those gossamer lines when a heavier line, say 4#, would also be invisible? There can't be gradients of invisibility. Either it is or it isn't. Is it lure or

jig action that mandates the lightest lines or some other factor?

That's because it isn't. Ain't nothin' invisible. C'mon, if you can see it in the water certainly those fishies that feed on near microscopic zooplankton can see it too. Same with anything red. Marketing has this one going both ways. It's either invisible OR the red looks like blood and excites fish.

Now I do know that thinner line has less resistance in the water and makes it easier to inhale a tiny jig. May contribute to a different action as well.

Despite the fact my standing line is Nano, they are all leadered with either fluoro or fluoro coated line.
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Offline Iceassin

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #19 on: Dec 02, 2018, 07:01 AM »

That's because it isn't. Ain't nothin' invisible. C'mon, if you can see it in the water certainly those fishies that feed on near microscopic zooplankton can see it too. Same with anything red. Marketing has this one going both ways. It's either invisible OR the red looks like blood and excites fish.

Now I do know that thinner line has less resistance in the water and makes it easier to inhale a tiny jig. May contribute to a different action as well.

Despite the fact my standing line is Nano, they are all leadered with either fluoro or fluoro coated line.

Ok esox...gonna bend your ear a little more...if you don't mind talking ::)

First, are you talking your pannie rods and two...why are you choosing fluoro over mono?

So, my thought is this: Going forward...well, next season as I'm already spooled with 3# fluoro...is going to 1# mono. And here's why..

1) Most lines, regardless of "poundage" will break a little beyond it's rated strength and being mono does stretch more than fluoro, it has a bit of advantage there.

2) As you said, nothing is invisible so between the 2, it's a push.

3) Mono has less memory reducing, but certainly not eliminating line twist (other variables being the culprit), offers better jig presentation than fluoro especially with the smaller jigs and no distinct advantage of one over the other especially in shallower water...I rarely fish over 30'.

I had used 1# mono in the past and really had no trouble with it. Changed up with the "better safe than sorry" thought in mind...kind of a nervous thing...know what I mean?

Ok...you may speak now.  ;)
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Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #20 on: Dec 02, 2018, 07:31 AM »
Ok esox...gonna bend your ear a little more...if you don't mind talking ::)

First, are you talking your pannie rods and two...why are you choosing fluoro over mono?

Ok...you may speak now.  ;)

When are you going to learn not to poke the bear?  :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:

Actually all my jigs rods (except for pike) are variations of that. Why fluoro? I grew into ice fishing as a "trap watcher". Had a couple of jig rods I never used, heck, most times they weren't even in the sled. As I began to get serious about broadening my horizons I started to accumulate more serious tackle and it was about that time that fluoro was "latest/greatest". Yes, I fall victim to that too but mostly because I like to play and find out for myself.

Thing is, since jigging is still not my primary method of presentation, one of those dopey leader wheels lasts a long time. Even 30 feet (10M) is a lot for me so my "value gene" says I don't need to buy anything else like that just yet. Since I'm not a jigging expert (no expert at all really) I don't delve into the finer differences though I'm sure they exist. Maybe I'll get there...

What I do like is the Nano standing line. I really don't have a ton of problems with it freezing though it does from time to time. The big plus for me is it seems to resist untwisting. I can see it develop a twist over time. What is interesting to me is that it does not untwist at the same rate, it just holds the twist. Even when I take it out of the water and hold it up. It's weird. And it does not seem to weaken the line either. Toward that end I've been able to eliminate a swivel from my line/leader connection.

That would be my only real knock on mono or fluoro as the standing line: that they tend to untwist as much as they twist and that can be a presentation issue.
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Offline stinkyfingers

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #21 on: Dec 02, 2018, 09:03 AM »
  Ever loathe to leave well enough alone, I looked up the descriptions of various brands of fluoro leader material on the Bass Pro website. The qualifiers for invisibility ranged

from "virtually" for Yo-Zuri and XPS to "nearly" for Seaguar. Only Ande made the claim to "totally invisible". I had always understood invisibility to be a property of matter, not some

marketing language to be finessed. Reminds me of "somewhat pregnant".
"I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man".

Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #22 on: Dec 02, 2018, 09:43 AM »
  Ever loathe to leave well enough alone, I looked up the descriptions of various brands of fluoro leader material on the Bass Pro website. The qualifiers for invisibility ranged

from "virtually" for Yo-Zuri and XPS to "nearly" for Seaguar. Only Ande made the claim to "totally invisible". I had always understood invisibility to be a property of matter, not some

marketing language to be finessed. Reminds me of "somewhat pregnant".

Three words stinky: MAR, KET, ING.

It's interesting how many folks believe what they want to believe and blindly accept it without giving it any critical thought much less any substantive trial. And not just here, the general public as a whole has fallen victim to exaggerated marketing claims of all kinds. "Look, I cut this boat in half and fixed it with this stuff from a spray can!" Really? How much of that stuff has sold on the basis of that commercial? If you just stop and think about it for a minute (or even a second), in what galaxy might that claim actually be true?

That includes anyone that accepts my opinions as well because they think I know what I'm talking about. Sure, I have strong opinions. But they are based on my actual experiences, not marketing or promo hearsay. That's why I can seem a bit strident at times. If what I am reading or being told does not fit within the experiences I've had it becomes very difficult for me to accept. Will other have experiences that differ from mine? I'd be surprised if they didn't. And the acceptance of differing experiences applies to them just like it does to me. That's what makes the world go 'round and IS such a wonderfully diverse repository of viewpoints  ;).

Doesn't make me right or someone else wrong. If it works for you, go for it. I do like to play with things to their breaking point. If I view that point as an unacceptable risk I modify or make another choice.

Do I like to share what I know? Sometimes too much...  :whistle: Geez, I gotta throw that soapbox in the firepit.
To fish or not to fish? That's a stupid question!




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Offline Iceassin

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #23 on: Dec 02, 2018, 10:23 AM »
Three words stinky: MAR, KET, ING.

It's interesting how many folks believe what they want to believe and blindly accept it without giving it any critical thought much less any substantive trial. And not just here, the general public as a whole has fallen victim to exaggerated marketing claims of all kinds. "Look, I cut this boat in half and fixed it with this stuff from a spray can!" Really? How much of that stuff has sold on the basis of that commercial? If you just stop and think about it for a minute (or even a second), in what galaxy might that claim actually be true?

That includes anyone that accepts my opinions as well because they think I know what I'm talking about. Sure, I have strong opinions. But they are based on my actual experiences, not marketing or promo hearsay. That's why I can seem a bit strident at times. If what I am reading or being told does not fit within the experiences I've had it becomes very difficult for me to accept. Will other have experiences that differ from mine? I'd be surprised if they didn't. And the acceptance of differing experiences applies to them just like it does to me. That's what makes the world go 'round and IS such a wonderfully diverse repository of viewpoints  ;).

Doesn't make me right or someone else wrong. If it works for you, go for it. I do like to play with things to their breaking point. If I view that point as an unacceptable risk I modify or make another choice.

Do I like to share what I know? Sometimes too much...  :whistle: Geez, I gotta throw that soapbox in the firepit.

I hear you esox...but I don't see you. Must be wrapped in that "totally invisible " fluorocarbon that's all the rage. No wonder I can't get it through the eye of this jig I'm holding.  :%$#!: :roflmao:
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Offline slipperybob

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Re: Which line material
« Reply #24 on: Dec 03, 2018, 02:49 AM »
I will answer to why I use fluorocarbon lines.

1. for it's heavier density than water.  The line will sink, so, so, so,...with a bead fly or plain hook.
2. for it's more abrasion resistance.  Yes, fish teeth or just rubbing up against whatever...like the clevis on a spinner rig.
3. for it's vibration transmission.  The harder material of flourocarbon, does a better job at bite detection, on a neutral line.  Especially on open water, lots of current or waves
4. for better line control on windy days.  Yes it's heavier so it's less likely to be carried by the wind on a cast.

I don't use fluorocarbon lines for any of the hyped up marketing...invisible or more like blinded by light or blocked by noise coloring - camouflage.
I don't use fluorocarbon for it's low stretch.  Um it does stretch, just lower resistance.  It has a plasticity stretch.  It's doesn't stretch with the elasticity you get with nylon fishing lines.  If you ever stretch fluorocarbon lines to it's limit, there is one characteristic that it goes into it's plasticity stretch limit.  It thins out and the bonds that holds the material stretches more unilaterally before it breaks.  Problem is if you're hooked and it happens, the entire line will acquire those stretch marks/rings throughout the entire line.  What do you do with that now?  Cut it all off or keep using a stretched out line with a different behavior now?
I don't use fluorocarbon for it's touted strength - marketing.  It has a weaker knot strength - since it was made into a spool-able line.  I also had to learn to tie a slightly different variation to my knots, once I found out how slick these lines were and slipping out of the knots.
I don't use fluorocarbon lines for running my cranks/spinners deeper.  No they don't, because the biggest factor is line diameter and cast distance.  The heavier fluorocarbon line my have more of an effect on the initial dive, that's all.  The reduced casting distance due to line weight, has some effect on the line angle to lure dive.

Keep in mind, things changes due to mfg always coming out with different formulations of the lines.  You then get different results that's getting more into the nylon polymer composition.  Best example is Yozuri Hybrid.  When I pullled and break this line, there are times I can see a few strands of fluorocarbon threads on the line break ends. 

Last of all, it also depends on your equipment.  My Ugly Sticks wouldn't tell me much.  However some high end graphite rods from St Croix Legend series really allowed me to perceive some of that differences along with higher end reels.  Everyone's perception is different.

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