Author Topic: Building Quick-Strikes  (Read 12203 times)

Offline Auger

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Building Quick-Strikes
« on: Oct 24, 2005, 12:20 PM »
I had good fishing with the biggest smelt I could find under tip-ups last season.  I'm thinking about building some more quick-strike rigs this week as I have most of the materials lying around and I need to do something ice fishing related.

I'm wondering if any of you have any preferences when building quick-strikes for big baits.  I have some Tyger Wire brand tieable wire that I use for tippet when fly fishing for pike.  I'm thinking about trying a few rigs made out of that.  Have any of you ever build quick-strikes out of tieable wire of any brand?  What about bare sevenstrand vs. nylon coated.  I have some #6 and #8 triple grip trebles that I'd like to use.  Keeping in mind the size of the bait (9-12") do you think those would be the appropiate sizes?

Lastly, anyone ever try those Partridge hooks with the 2 points.  I think thy're European or something.  I'm assuming you put the smaller of the 2 points in the bait and leave the bigger exposed, right?  Opinions?

Thanks
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Offline Water Wolf

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #1 on: Oct 24, 2005, 02:26 PM »
  Last winter I purchased a premade quick-strike rig, it has a swivel at the top, and is V shaped, the two hooks are on each end of the V.They are the partrage hooks and the smaller hook does hook into the fish. This type of quick-strike is nice as you can flex the wire V and hook the bait fish so it hangs horizontal,more natural. Since then I have make my own. On way I have made them is to take two steel leader and tie them to your line, attach the hook of choice on the leaders and add the bait.You may also need a small weight above the hooks just to keep the bait down.
Since you already have the tyger wire you could ti two equal lengths of it to a 3-way swivel, and add the hook of choice to the end. It would be the same design as my first one but all one piece. I hope this helped, good luck with your rigs. :)

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Offline akdg

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #2 on: Oct 24, 2005, 06:38 PM »
Auger, last year I made some with Cortland toothy critter, a tie-able leader, but instead of tying it I used the smallest crimps I could find and 1/8 inch surgical tubing to hold the sliding hook in place.  I made up a bunch with different size hooks to match the size bait I was using.  I was very happy with the results and never had any breakoffs and only one crimp that didn't hold.  As far as hook sizes go I think I would go a bit bigger for the baits you are talking about.

Offline Auger

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #3 on: Oct 25, 2005, 08:12 AM »
Thanks, akdg.  I'll keep that in mind.  I tried to assemble a couple last night but I need to get smaller crimps.
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Offline iceintheveins

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #4 on: Oct 25, 2005, 09:16 PM »
Do yourself a favor and do not use wire. Use heavy P - Line fluorocarbon leader of at least 15 pound test. The heavy stuff is better even.
For baits in the 4 - 8" range, use a pair of #6 gamakatsu trebles. Tie a swivel on the end of your tip up line and then tie a 3 foot section of heavy fluorocarbon to the end of the swivel. Slip on one treble and don't even tie it, just leave it free sliding. Then tie another treble on the end of the line. Place one treble near the tail and one near the head. Smaller hooks and no wire means MORE PIKE!!! I guarantee you this will increase your number of flags.
You can get bit off fishing this way though, but not often at all. Just don't horse the pike too much. When he wants to run, let him. Pike will tire themselves out eventually.
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Offline northdease

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #5 on: Oct 26, 2005, 02:26 PM »
i started using the malin no-kink wire and am very happy with it so far. they say it is tieable as well but i felt it was a major pain and started crimping which is much faster and easier. the stuff is very small diameter and invisible in the water, i checked it out down a spearing hole in about 15 FOW and couldnt see it, with crystal clear water. i have made both types in the above replies the single line wuth two trebles and the v-type and like the singe leader with the second hook sliding free, i always make sure i put the secured hook in the baits head. i have had equal success with both rigs though. i think i have the 25lb version. i do use a 4 ft. flourocarbon leader on top of the steel tied to my main tip up line. with this combo in clear water all you see is the swivel between the wire and the flouro. as far as no-kink it has gotten twisted up a couple times but not like the wire leaders you buy wich are usually twisted up after the first fish. i have been using them for about a year now and have had good sucess. hope that helps a little.

Offline iceintheveins

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #6 on: Oct 26, 2005, 09:22 PM »
I use mono - no wire.  I have never used wire.
Been doing so since seeing the quick strike rig on an InFisherman show back in the early 80's or so.
I have never been bit off by a pike on a tipup.
This includes chain pickeral and walleyes.
Gotta be hundreds of fish that coulda bit me off but didn't.
Now I have switched to a low vis mono, I believe it was only 10 lb.
About a dozen pike last year and at least a dozen chain pickeral.
No bite offs.
But, then again, YMMV.
Mac

I bet you got a lot more flags too on mono instead of wire. My flags tripled or quadrupled for pike after ditching the wire. Had one bite off last year.
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Offline Water Wolf

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #7 on: Oct 27, 2005, 02:37 AM »
One advantage I have found with the steel wire is that it is usually heavy enough to sink the bait. What do you guys use to keep the bait near the bottom, split shot, rubber core sinkers?

WW
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Offline kerosenecounty17

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #8 on: Oct 27, 2005, 01:59 PM »
I tried the Tiger-leader a few years ago and didn't like it.  The knot strength wasn't very good.  It might have been my knots, but I don't think so.

Now I use braided stainless wire (uncoated).  I use the Surfstrand brand in 12# test.  It's thin and can be tied - with a couple sets of pliers - and the knot strength is very good.  It's more visible than mono, but about the best thing I've found that can't be bitten off.  Only problem with it is it kinks very easily.  I just tie extras and put on a new leader when one gets kinked.  I'm thinking of trying flourocarbon this year. 

WW - If you're talking dead bait like smelt, just shove a couple finishing nails down the bait's throat and it'll sink like a rock.

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Offline iceintheveins

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #9 on: Oct 27, 2005, 02:49 PM »
One advantage I have found with the steel wire is that it is usually heavy enough to sink the bait. What do you guys use to keep the bait near the bottom, split shot, rubber core sinkers?

WW

I used split shot but I found it better to stuff a split shot in the mouth of my anchovy. Also using pointed nail type sinkers work really well. I think having weight further up the line might cause pike to drop the bait more.
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Offline Barleydog

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #10 on: Oct 27, 2005, 04:09 PM »
I use nails w/dead baits without the splitshot.  Anything attached to the braided line other than a swivel takes away from it's stealthiness.  Bad in really clear H20.  Like WW said, steel is usually heavy enough to assist in submarining your bait, nails just balance out the lifeless offering for picky pike. 
Tied most of my rigs with sevenstrand.  Crimp the bottom and top hooks, use 2 ft. of leader to a swivel, and tie to the main line.  Used Mason tie able leader, but couldn't keep the kinks out, + the thickness was a hindrance.  Sevenstrand (I think 50 lb. but I'd have to check.) was pretty thin. 8)  Didn't notice a real difference in hookups until late season when fluorocarbon leaders always work better, (for me anyways.)
I snell tie pike leaders using 40 lb. Fluorocarbon, (nothing below 40 lb.!!! 40 lb. works for both bitter weather, and kids!), attached to a 3/0 or 4/0 octopus hook for easy release of both hammerhandles and pigs alike.  It's a real pain unhooking two trebles at 20 below! :tipup:
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Offline Auger

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #11 on: Nov 09, 2005, 03:43 PM »
Thanks for all the advice, guys.  I tied up 15 quick-strikes last night over a few cold one's and the first of this year's venison sausage.  Let me just sit a minute and revel in that last sentence......  Anyway, I tied a few of each combination.  P-line, wire, sliding hook, three-way swivel, big hooks, small hooks and two single circle hooks on 40# fluoro.  Hopefully I can catch enough pike this season to come to some sort of conclusion.  Not that I don't trust any of you.  I'd just like to decide for myself.  Thanks again.
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Offline Barleydog

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #12 on: Nov 09, 2005, 07:41 PM »
Auger,
Not circle hooks..... Try Octopus hooks!  I can tell you from experience, circles and pike don't mix.  There's been multiple discussions on IS concerning the use of circles for pike, I wouldn't use them MBOI.  ;)  Glad to see your deer season was successful!
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Offline Auger

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #13 on: Nov 10, 2005, 09:06 AM »
Auger,
Not circle hooks..... Try Octopus hooks!  I can tell you from experience, circles and pike don't mix.  There's been multiple discussions on IS concerning the use of circles for pike, I wouldn't use them MBOI.  ;)  Glad to see your deer season was successful!

Just out of couriosity, what was the problem with circle hooks?  I've had great success with them on smallies and cats.  Shouldn't be a problem to clip off the circles and tie on a couple octopus style hooks.  Thanks for the heads up.
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Offline Barleydog

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #14 on: Nov 10, 2005, 12:16 PM »
No problem!  ;D  Circles wouldn't set into the jaw of the fish.  Their jaws are much to tough and their tooth structure probably acted like speed bumps. ???  I had the same problem fishing for mackerel, barracuda and queenfish in the gulf.  Circles wouldn't allow for a good hookup due to their bony mouth structure.   Octopus hooks on the other hand, did a great job of limiting the amount of gut hooked fish, by setting up on the outer edge of the jaw.  If I'm meat fishing, (I love pike fillets cooked in oil), I'll use the quick strikes or single trebles, but otherwise, I'll stick with the snell tied octopuses.  Don't think I'm an advocate for not using circle hooks!  I use them for halibut, snapper, sea bass and other ocean bottom dwellers ... Oh yeah! even salmon.  They all have the same physical make-up that allows for a good corner mouth hook-up that eliminates the infamous gut hook.  Just won't use them on pike. ;)  Anyways, good luck and let us know how you do! -Jim
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Offline Auger

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #15 on: Nov 10, 2005, 12:23 PM »
Thanks Barleydog.  One more question.  I'm assuming I should use the normal hookset when using octopus hooks, not the slow, steady pull employed with circles.  Is that correct?
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Offline Barleydog

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #16 on: Nov 10, 2005, 11:28 PM »
Right on Auger!  Set away... 
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Offline GAMBELL

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #17 on: Nov 12, 2005, 05:22 AM »
I USED MONO AT THE BEGINNING OF THE SEASON LAST YEAR AND HAD MORE FLAGS.  I WENT BACK TO LEADERS FOR THE REMAINDER OF THE SEASON (WAS AFRAID OF BREAKING OFF BIG PIKE).  THIS SEASON I WILL USE 20-30LB. SEAGAR FLOROCARBON LEADER WITH A TREBLE HOOK / OCTOPUS QUICK STRIKE RIG.  LAST YEAR I LANDED A 41" AND 38" PIKE ON 15 LB. SEAGAR, BUT GOT A LITTLE NERVOUS ABOUT LOOSING FISH OF THIS QUALITY.

Offline Water Wolf

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #18 on: Nov 18, 2005, 02:42 PM »
I read about another way to build a rig similar to a quick-strike, here is how they say to do it.
1.Materials: Herring or smelt, gorge hook and threading needle.
2.Thread the gorge hook cable to the needle.
3.Thread the needle through the bait, mouth first to tale end.
4.Pull tight so the 2 prong of the hook line up with sides of the mouth.
5.Place a single prong hook through tail end of bait, then loop cable through the eye of the hook twice.
6.Make at least 6 of these set-ups and store in freezer bags.

If anyone tries this rig, let me know how you do with it. :tipup: ;)

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Offline meatman

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #19 on: Nov 21, 2005, 04:25 PM »
there is a really good article in this months IN-FISERMAN on quick rigs... i was using 15# spiderwire for my rigs last year, had a few bite offs went to 50# no bite offs but fewer flags gonna use both this year and see if i can draw a conclusion.  any help would be apreciated. out. :tipup: :tipup: :tipup: :tipup: :tipup:

Offline Reel Wet Ride

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #20 on: Nov 30, 2005, 02:26 PM »
I just finished reading the article in In-Fisherman. It actully prompted me to tie some quick-strike rigs. Let me tell you what is NOT a good idea. Nylon covered wire. I'd rather use 20lb mono than that stuff again. I think I'm with the masses on this topic, USE HEAVY FLOROCARBON!
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Offline iceintheveins

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #21 on: Nov 30, 2005, 05:44 PM »
I just finished reading the article in In-Fisherman. It actully prompted me to tie some quick-strike rigs. Let me tell you what is NOT a good idea. Nylon covered wire. I'd rather use 20lb mono than that stuff again. I think I'm with the masses on this topic, USE HEAVY FLOROCARBON!

Doug Stange is wrong on this one, wire will almost always greatly reduce strikes. However, I was glad to see in that article that they are at least contemplating using fluorocarbon this year. I guarantee more flags if you use fluoro, maybe a great deal more flags.
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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #22 on: Nov 30, 2005, 06:44 PM »
Doug Stange is wrong on this one, wire will almost always greatly reduce strikes. However, I was glad to see in that article that they are at least contemplating using fluorocarbon this year. I guarantee more flags if you use fluoro, maybe a great deal more flags.
....are you saying that Doug Stange doesn't know what he's talking about??.....gimme and everyone else here a break....please....Gru mp

Offline akdg

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #23 on: Nov 30, 2005, 07:10 PM »
I have to agree that mono/floro is better at getting pike to strike, but if you're fishing for big pike (10-20+lbs) in heavy cover (weeds/logs) and you want to have a decent chance at landing them, you need to use wire of some sort imo. Even more so when using quick-strikes because the line is going across their mouths most the time when hooked, not swallowed and out the corner like with english hooks, etc.  You get a bunch of weeds on your line and a 20lb pike and your chances of landing her on mono/floro are not very good.  Guess what I'm trying to say is that no one way is the right way, you need to use what works best for the conditions you are facing at the time. ;)

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #24 on: Nov 30, 2005, 07:36 PM »
the great debate that I can't stay away from.....firstly.....I am going to state my own opinion about quick-strikes.....gorge hooks and other similar setups.....we fish barbless in Manitoba....and have for years....my home province still allows barbs....when I fish there....its barbless...just a matter of choice and sportsmanship.....alot of provinces and states have slot size regulations....and what irks me, is gorge hooks that fished as intended, will mostly deepthroat hook trophy fish that should be released.....not a good idea in my opinion.....quickstrik es guarantee more hooksets no doubt....but I choose to see the odd one throw the hook...its sportsmanship.....yeah .....I might cuss abit when I lose a good fish...but thats fishing.....just thought I would throw out a pic of what I use and tell me what the odds are of having a large fish slice through 2 strands of light mono????....floro????...or whatever else you might want to try.....when I land a nice northern or toothy that grinds abit of the line....I simply dump it for fresh.....take a look....Grump   (I'll fix that pic later                                                                                              

Offline akdg

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #25 on: Nov 30, 2005, 07:55 PM »
Hey Grump, are you saying that quick strikes=gorge hooks?  I have switched to quick strikes because if you fish them properly and are close to your tipups and hit them asap you hook them right in the tongue/jaw most the time making for a very easy release.  I agree on the gorge/english hook set up, not good if you want them to live to fight another day.  Where do you hook most of the fish you get with that rig?  I can see that being barbless would definitely make for easier removal if they swallow it.

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #26 on: Nov 30, 2005, 08:12 PM »
Hey Grump, are you saying that quick strikes=gorge hooks?  I have switched to quick strikes because if you fish them properly and are close to your tipups and hit them asap you hook them right in the tongue/jaw most the time making for a very easy release.  I agree on the gorge/english hook set up, not good if you want them to live to fight another day.  Where do you hook most of the fish you get with that rig?  I can see that being barbless would definitely make for easier removal if they swallow it.
you betcha...quickstrikes fished on tipups....and given the right fish (big) will inhale the presentation......gorg e hooks are sometimes rigged the same way.....stingers.....a ll I am stating is My Opinion.....I catch my fair share of keepers and trophies.....and when I can release them with no doubt about surviving.....makes for a better day on the water....the double mono or whatever combination you want to make of what I use...ensures one thing...even if throat hooked, I can remove the hook from behind the gill to live another day....its just my choice......and my opinion on sportsmanship.....Grum p

Offline Barleydog

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #27 on: Nov 30, 2005, 08:29 PM »
Grump ya ol' codger!  Looks like you were enjoying a couple Kokonees when you took that photo! ;D :D  I agree with you 100% concerning the use of single hooks vs. quick strikes!  I prefer the use of singles to quick strikes due to higher mortality rate.  This debate about quick strikes vs. other rigs will haunt us forever eh!  I can't think of a better way to catch a pike than with a quick strike, however, IMHO it can cause great harm to those hammer handles that un-intentionally bite our rigs.  I use 10" herring and still manage the occasional 15" pike!  Kinda like trapping, you really can't stop possums from staggering into your fox set, they gotta eat too...  If you use a large enough single hook, (in my case a 4/0 octogirlything), ya really can't hook up with these small fish.  Sportsmanship is something we should all ponder, good on ya Grump! ;)

Mackdaddy,  I agree, and will go one step farther!  Doug Stange is an idiot and should be banned from the fishing elite!  Are you serious? ???  He's correct in his assesment.  Never go into battle carrying a swiss army knife!  
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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #28 on: Nov 30, 2005, 08:43 PM »
Grump ya ol' codger!  Looks like you were enjoying a couple Kokonees when you took that photo! ;D :D  I agree with you 100% concerning the use of single hooks vs. quick strikes!  I prefer the use of singles to quick strikes due to higher mortality rate.  This debate about quick strikes vs. other rigs will haunt us forever eh!  I can't think of a better way to catch a pike than with a quick strike, however, IMHO it can cause great harm to those hammer handles that un-intentionally bite our rigs.  I use 10" herring and still manage the occasional 15" pike!  Kinda like trapping, you really can't stop possums from staggering into your fox set, they gotta eat too...  If you use a large enough single hook, (in my case a 4/0 octogirl thingy), ya really can't hook up with these small fish.  Sportsmanship is something we should all ponder, good on ya Grump! ;)

Mackdaddy,  I agree, and will go one step farther!  Doug Stange is an idiot and should be banned from the fishing elite!  Are you serious? ???  He's correct in his assesment.  Never go into battle carrying a swiss army knife!  
.....the auto focus must have been out of focus when I snapped the pic....Stange....I think he really likes some of the good work that our friend has provided him with.....actually...he really admires his bucket biology work.....great job these hillbillies do...Grump

Offline akdg

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Re: Building Quick-Strikes
« Reply #29 on: Nov 30, 2005, 09:17 PM »
So Grump,  You just let them swallow it and then deal with it, which is made easier by the barbless hook? 

 



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