some hyalite brook trout

[Mr. iceman]

[Ice Freek]

They look yummy...yeah I said yummy!

[thebasicfisherman]

nice! where you catch?

[fisherman 4 life]

what did you use

[mtgrant]

I think Brookies are pretty tasty! They are actually char and not trout. The cutties tend to have a fishy flavor and smell. Even a small brookie is great eating.

[justatrout]

Great looking fish

[fishonice]

I think Brookies are pretty tasty! They are actually char and not trout. The cutties tend to have a fishy flavor and smell. Even a small brookie is great eating.

not to be rude but, brook trout are trout, Salvelinus fontinalis to be exact. and charr are a different species, Salvelinus alpinus, although they are closely related. i hope you aren't offended by the correction.

[MeadowPikeman]

nope bookies are in the charr family just like lake trout, not a trout despite their name

[PROMO]

thats a big 10-4 on brookies bein char. i think lake trout are a type of char too.

[RobG]

not to be rude but, brook trout are trout, Salvelinus fontinalis to be exact. and charr are a different species, Salvelinus alpinus, although they are closely related. i hope you aren't offended by the correction.

Alpinus is an Arctic Char.

The easy way tell the difference between a char and a trout:
1) trout have dark spots on light background
2) char have light spots on dark background.

So brook, bull, lake "trout" are actually char... cuts, rainbow, browns are trout.

[Nerka]

RobG is mostly right, just to validate... I used to work in a molecular genetics lab for trout, (char) and salmon, at the U in Missoula.  They are all salmonids, identified in the family salmonidae (id by the adipose fin, among other moprphological and genetic traits).  Lake trout/macs, Brookies (non-native), and Bull trout, and arctic grayling (native) are all considered char (even though the genera are different among the group).  Unfortunately, taxonomy has changed in the last 20 years from primarily using physical (morphological) traitsmolecular techniques (PCR).  With this being said, evolutionary knowledge of these fish changed where they belong in the family tree (dendrogram) while their names have stayed the same.  or they have changed the name and the tree placement in the case of rainbow trout vs Redband trout, vs Kamloop, and Coastal Rainbow trout vs Steelhead.  sorry this is probably TMI.

Basicly it's pretty confusing and speciation is often disciussed in two languages common names and latin which adds to the confusion.    When discussing family, genus, and species groupings in common names vs latin, even the experts make mistakes...I've seen it happen in a room of PhD's. I guess when it comes down to it, they're all fish and we like to catch them, but without a genetic id it might be really tough to tell if you have a rainbow, a cutbow, or a cutthroat trout...depending on where you are.


More info at: http://fieldguide.mt.gov/displaySpecies.aspx?family=Salmonidae

[Nerka]

Robert J. Behnke wrote several good books on this stuff: Native Trout of North America is one of 'em.  He's one of the 20th century pioneers of fish taxonomy. I saw him speak at a native trout symposium in 2003, he sort of has the same voice as the pastor from 'The Princess Bride.'  His books also include some very cool and morphologically accurate fish paintings by Joe Tomerilli (I believe his artwork is featured in the MTFWP regs as well).

[RobG]

Basicly it's pretty confusing and speciation is often disciussed in two languages common names and latin which adds to the confusion.    When discussing family, genus, and species groupings in common names vs latin, even the experts make mistakes...I've seen it happen in a room of PhD's. I guess when it comes down to it, they're all fish and we like to catch them, but without a genetic id it might be really tough to tell if you have a rainbow, a cutbow, or a cutthroat trout...depending on where you are.

Well my excuse is that I have a PhD (engineering)
Are you sure grayling is a char though? I've heard of lumpers, but... how did it wind up there?

FWIW, Behnke's "Native Trout..." dates you, as is out of print, like last century but his newer book "Trout and Salmon of North America" is available (http://www.amazon.com/Trout-Salmon-America-Robert-Behnke/dp/0743222202). It is very informative, but some of the maps showing the native ranges had printing errors.

It is amazing how many different kinds of trout there are in America, isn't it? If you were to look at most books you'd only think there was brook, rainbow, and brown trout. Mexican golden trout, who would have thunk it.

[.45-75WCF]

Nerka,
I'm glad you posted here, because when I looked up both sub groups, Fontinalis and Alpinus, I found two conflicting or at the very least, confusing explanations as to which side of the pond the Brookie comes from; ie. trout or char.  It is interesting, but as you also said, it really doesn't make any difference when we're having so much fun catching them.  

[jimmerjammer]

So if i am understanding what you are saying Nerka... Brookies are actually a type of trout, or did you just confuse yourself, along with the rest of us? lol, just kidding, but your explanation was great, but your conclusion wasn't clearly stated. Thank you for the education and the post, i love learning something new, i have always been told that a brookie was a type of char, so this discussion has definately sparked my curiousity, and i will have to do some of my own research!!! good luck out there everyone!!!

[RobG]

FWIW, I've worked with many fishery professionals and they say brook trout, bull trout, lake trout, etc. If they said char everyone would wonder how the conversation shifted to barbecue or that 70's singer with the long straight hair. With the exception of the arctic char mentioned earlier, I've never heard "char" in conversion except when a layman is trying to sound like they are especially knowledgeable by pointing out that "actually it is a char, not a trout." It is kind of a phase we all go through, like pointing out that it is the stop, not the fall that kills you. 

[Nerka]

Well put RobG.   

It would be like adding that the drummer from Def Leopard only had one arm, during a conversation about the drummer from Def Leopard. 

And btw don't go telling people grayling are char either 'cause you'll be wrong like me; had to set the record straight after some research.

[MeadowPikeman]

in some regions in Canada lakers are refered to as lake char even by layman, not to mention the dolly varden char, a 1st cousin to the bull trout
lets just say brookies and arctic char are very closely related enough so that up here we have what they call a spar a brookie/artic hybrid
heres a pic
very charish

[RobG]

in some regions in Canada lakers are refered to as lake char even by layman,...

Cool. To add to the confusion, in Western Canada they refer to them as Lake Troot or just "Trote."  

[Rghnrdy_mt]

Robert J. Behnke wrote several good books on this stuff: Native Trout of North America is one of 'em.  He's one of the 20th century pioneers of fish taxonomy. I saw him speak at a native trout symposium in 2003, he sort of has the same voice as the pastor from 'The Princess Bride.'  His books also include some very cool and morphologically accurate fish paintings by Joe Tomerilli (I believe his artwork is featured in the MTFWP regs as well).

'The Princess Bride'? Really? Where do I find that in the 2009 regs? Lol!

[fishinwithbrittanies]

wow I am really confused after all of that.  Its a little early but I think I need a beer.

[Mr. iceman]

wow I am really confused after all of that.  Its a little early but I think I need a beer.

Hey, you can't drink all day if you don't start in the morning, right?

[Ice Freek]

Hey, you can't drink all day if you don't start in the morning, right?

I had one this morning... why are they soo much better wen you are ouside?