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Maine => Ice Fishing Maine => Topic started by: GasBlaster on Feb 10, 2018, 07:24 AM

Title: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: GasBlaster on Feb 10, 2018, 07:24 AM
I have seen this topic discussed on this form and it looks like the abuse has closed down a good thing for the honest people .

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/02/09/584493046/l-l-bean-scraps-legendary-lifetime-return-policy
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: spoof on Feb 10, 2018, 07:48 AM
I think a year is More than generous.  Industry Leading.  Nothing lasts forever!  Great Products!!!
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 10, 2018, 08:00 AM
I have no problem with the change. But don't be fooled by them blaming people who took advantage of the policy. This is all about the bottom line and making the shareholders happy. See also Bean's recent Pension decision. Had this truly been about the "abusers" they would have changed the policy many, many, many moons ago (they did slighltly change the wording of the guarantee years ago).

LL Bean starts employee buyouts, ends pension plan http://bangordailynews.com/2018/02/05/business/ll-bean-starts-employee-buyouts-ends-pension-plan/ (http://LL Bean starts employee buyouts, ends pension plan http://bangordailynews.com/2018/02/05/business/ll-bean-starts-employee-buyouts-ends-pension-plan/)
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: cjg on Feb 10, 2018, 08:30 AM
Maybe their prices will go down  ::)
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Moosekill on Feb 10, 2018, 08:31 AM
Actually it is about staying in business.  LL Bean isn't doing well and they are trying to become more profitable.  Would you rather have them lay off even more people than they currently are planning to, or change their return policy?  Gone are the days that outdoor equipment drives their company.  It is now an afterthought and clothing sales is their main business.  Flat to down sales for years isn't a model of success for a company.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Moosekill on Feb 10, 2018, 08:33 AM
Plus you are right, screw LL Bean for wanting to be profitable.  I get sooooo tired of people hammering businesses for trying to make money. 
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 10, 2018, 08:54 AM
They should care about being profitable who wouldn't??? Just don't blame so called " abusers" for the change. Don't put up a smokescreen,  just tell it like it is. "Our  sales are flat and we want to ensure our barrels full of money keep coming in so we are doing away with pensions, lowering bonuses, ending our lifetime guarantee, cutting free shipping unless you spend more money and buying out long time employees who make way too much money" Sincerly S. Gorman
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Moosekill on Feb 10, 2018, 09:00 AM
If people didn't abuse the return policy it wouldn't be a cost issue, they do abuse it, as stated in the article, so away it goes.  I have bought stuff from beans forever, and I always figured, on gear anyways, I was paying a bit more for that guarantee.  But since now they are really a clothing company it is a different market. 
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: spoof on Feb 10, 2018, 09:02 AM
Indie

    Cabelas/Bassdoh  quality of clothing is laughable compared to Beans.  Granted it's a bit pricey.  I usually only by there products that are on sale.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Moosekill on Feb 10, 2018, 09:05 AM
Cabelas that has just been bought out by Bass Pro and both companies are having serious financial difficulties? 

LL Bean is a top heavy company that has people who have worked there for a long time.  They were successful enough for a long time to keep those employees and policies in place.  Over the last few years that success has gone away and they have to face hard realities.  Unless they can become more profitable they will go away.  So they are changing their compensation program, their return policies, and reducing their staffing. You can be jealous of them all you want, but there are an awful lot of people in Maine who have great jobs because of them, and if Bean goes away there aren't going to be many options for those people.

Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Trout Hound on Feb 10, 2018, 09:10 AM
I saw it several times on this forum...  people talking about returning their boots, shelter, auger, gloves... some people definitely used it as a buy once and keep returning for new gear...  that's not the spirit of the warranty. If you wore something out from use then you probably got your money's worth...  if it ripped/broke prematurely then bring it back...
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: fishercat on Feb 10, 2018, 09:16 AM
I saw it several times on this forum...  people talking about returning their boots, shelter, auger, gloves... some people definitely used it as a buy once and keep returning for new gear...  that's not the spirit of the warranty. If you wore something out from use then you probably got your money's worth...  if it ripped/broke prematurely then bring it back...

ditto that
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: FlagChasr on Feb 10, 2018, 09:43 AM
Now who’s talkin trash....
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Moosekill on Feb 10, 2018, 09:54 AM
Nope don't work there and no connection.  Just get tired of the liberal crap from people who constantly rip companies for trying to stay in business.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 10, 2018, 10:18 AM
Thank you to all of you for understanding our current difficulties, our 1.6 billion dollar yearly gross sales are no longer supporting our family's lifestyle.  We will continue to develop our outsourced products for you (you know who they are!!) and yes, even Lewiston! But we must make changes in order to keep our barrels full of cash. Sincerely S. Gorman
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: FlagChasr on Feb 10, 2018, 10:48 AM
Haters are always gonna hate. Another prime example of the entitlement attitude that’s out of control. If they are successful and make money, let’s tax them more and make them give it all back.
And let’s bash a true Maine Company that makes a great quality product at a reasonable price. They haven’t been in business since 1912 because they make a cheap product. Doesnt matter what people say. Not gonna change my mind.
I’m on team LL Bean. Hope next year they make 3.6 billion and hire more employees...
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 10, 2018, 11:04 AM
Just to keep this ice fishing related. My Jiffy auger and Jack Traps were all purchased from LL Beans.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: StevenB on Feb 10, 2018, 11:09 AM
Ask for employees opinions.....
There is No Union to "care for" employees. WHY?  LL Bean has GREAT benefits for ALL employees, not just upper management or select few family members.
I'm sorry, but if you've had a product for X amount of years, used it fully and were "satisfied" during that time, that should not entitle you to return said product because it just tore, wore out or died and now you are unsatisfied with its performance X years down the road.
Loyal customers will still buy their products as long as Beans puts out quality products.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: StevenB on Feb 10, 2018, 11:10 AM
Gary, I think we would be hard pressed to find someone on this board that does not have LL Bean products
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 10, 2018, 11:19 AM
I just started to poke around and i literally lost count of bean gear and clothing I own Steve. I have no problem with the new policy. I worked multiple seasons on the phones for beans and no complaints, pay was good and a few perks too. I just think it's disingenuous that the policy change was blamed on so called abusers. I think they should have just said  we made a business decision...
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: FlagChasr on Feb 10, 2018, 12:16 PM
Ex wife’s cousin use to go to yard sales and look for Bean products so she could return them. I remember her bragging about getting a new pair of boots when she returned a pair she found, and they weren’t even her size. They gave her a difference size, no questions asked. I don’t know how much it happened, but it did happen. Wasn’t proud to even be associated to her. Remember I did say Ex wife.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: stripernut on Feb 10, 2018, 12:28 PM
I am an LL Bean fan (bigger Orvis fan) and own many products from both. I have never returned a Bean product myself. That said both company products are not of the same quality they once were and it is a good thing Bean to cut back on the Warranty, with the gear not lasting as long...
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: bootstrap on Feb 10, 2018, 12:45 PM
i am the king of yard sale returns lol
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: apresby11 on Feb 10, 2018, 12:51 PM
They'll lose some Customers but I think they'll increase their bottom dollar overall which is the goal of any company.  It's kind of sad when you go to the Flagship store and there are far more people in line to return items than there are buying items.

I have bought hundreds of things from Beans (Fly rods, Spin Rods, Trolling rods, Boots, Ice Shacks, Augers, Fly Tying Supplies, Waders, Nets, Lures, Line, Chamois Shirts, River Driver Shirts, Sweatshirts, Keens, knives, tents, furniture, EVERYTHING)  from Beans and maybe returned a dozen things or so over my lifetime.  The overall quality of their Products is above average, I've been very happy with most of everything I've bought from them.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: bootstrap on Feb 10, 2018, 12:57 PM
going to have to figure out another way to do my xmas shopping
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: FlagChasr on Feb 10, 2018, 01:08 PM
i am the king of yard sale returns lol
That is funny sh*t.  ;D
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Seamonkey84 on Feb 10, 2018, 03:47 PM
I use to work for brookstone before they made the same type of change. It use to be lifetime guarantee/replacement, or 100% satisfaction from the products. I’ve personally seen the type of yard sale picking and attic clean outs that occurs. The oldest return I had to do was 17 years from the purchase date, the guy had the packing slip  :clap:
It was to the point that there was over 100%  return rate on some years because people sought out the brandname to do just that. Unless the brand name was crossed off or had our outlet mark on it, we did a exchange or store credit for the price it was last sold at. Then we get people coming in with gift cards they bought online from the people that salvaged/stole the returned item to begin with.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: WishnIwasFishn on Feb 10, 2018, 04:22 PM
I tried explaining this to a buddy of mine (who recently returned a Beans fly rod he bought second hand off a guy in the 80’s for $100, they gave him $80 for it and he walked out with a brand new rod) but he doesn’t get it. Beans is in a tough spot because they’re their own manufacturer, distributor, wholesale and retail, not nearly as much wiggle room as a big box store who has vendors and distributors and can return merchandise to receive credit on the next trip. Beans gets a sweater back with a hole in it, they eat it. Chair or a rod gets broken they give you another and hope it’s in halfway decent shape so they can sell it at a reduced cost at the outlet/Good Will or another retailer altogether. I wonder how many rods, reels, clothes, kayaks and whatever else is floating around Freeport gets collected and returned, even for store credit? Ya got kids grabbin their mom and dads old Beans Boots and returning em for store credit only to sell those at a discounted rate so they can go buy dope. Cabelas only does 90 day returns now on all non-Cabelas brand merchandise, period, no exceptions. Learned that the hard way trying to exchange a rod I bought there last summer (11’ Tsunami surf rod) but hey, live and learn.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Bottle_O_Moxie on Feb 10, 2018, 04:27 PM
The return abuse has gone on for many years.  I worked in their returns department 30 years ago and we had some winners back then on a regular basis. 
I still have some of that gear that I bought back then, and some of it was imported from overseas.  So that isn't a new thing either. 

The policy change is long overdue, and if by doing so they can keep more Mainers employed  - then more power to them.

Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: FJ40 on Feb 10, 2018, 06:54 PM
FWIW, here's a quote taken from an article in the Morning Sentinel:

"L.L. Bean Executive Chairman Shawn Gorman said the cost to the retailer of abusive and fraudulent returns had become so great that it eclipsed total annual revenue from sales of the company’s flagship Bean boots."
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: bootstrap on Feb 10, 2018, 07:14 PM
if the boots did not suck they wouldnt have a problem.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: izmir on Feb 11, 2018, 04:45 AM
How and the hell can u bash a Company that's as good as LL Beans? Some people just want some thing for nothing, I guess its a Left Wing thing. I don't care how much then owners are making, when the workers are happy, and the Company is surviving.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: FlagChasr on Feb 11, 2018, 06:00 AM
if the boots did not suck they wouldnt have a problem.

Saying Bean boots suck is like saying Vermont’s maple syrup tastes like raccoon piss
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: robbfishing on Feb 11, 2018, 06:04 AM
How and the hell can u bash a Company that's as good as LL Beans? Some people just want some thing for nothing, I guess its a Left Wing thing. I don't care how much then owners are making, when the workers are happy, and the Company is surviving.  I totally agree with you. !! I have been reading these posts shaking my head !
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: TroutWorm on Feb 11, 2018, 08:04 AM
Beans stuff is cheeply made these days. China stuff. Old LL himself would be rolling in his grave if he knew what was going on. I've worked in their facilitys before and it's no different than any other stuff made.  Also I used to buy alot from there. 100 doller Camo pants riped first trip out hunting. Camo ran gear same thing. And don't get me started on how you work their forever then they just let u go bc your getting seniority. Beans isn't the same people it used to be.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: thedirtydirtyfisherman on Feb 11, 2018, 08:41 AM
i agree with shrinkage but i also agree that the policy needed to change, but i blame them for the abuse.  Simple things could be in place to stop fraud, such as all clothing only has a year warranty, (who expects shirts and pants to be returnable after you have worn them for a year?)  All returns must have proof of purchase (receipts, card that was used to buy).  I just dont like that they go from one extreme to the other and a year warranty on things other than clothes is not that long for a manufacturer.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: joefishmore on Feb 11, 2018, 10:08 AM
People that stole from Beans probably steal elsewhere.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: FlagChasr on Feb 11, 2018, 10:31 AM
Beans stuff is cheeply made these days. China stuff. Old LL himself would be rolling in his grave if he knew what was going on.
If LL Bean is rolling over in his grave.....it’s a gold plated coffin with diamond inlays, and the finest silk lining money can buy. Rest In Peace my friend. You earned it. Every penny.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: moosehunter on Feb 11, 2018, 10:59 AM
I got a pair of ll bean cold weather boot ive had for 35 years. still wear them every time out ice fishin. went threw 3 or 4 pairs of the reagular ones and that's after replacing the bottoms. never did the return thing , if they were worn out , id just buy new ones. when the price went way up I stopped getting them.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: billditrite on Feb 11, 2018, 04:43 PM
I am sure it has nothing to do with the overall quality of the merchandise they sell now compared to what they sold when the policy was first enacted...stuff from China just doesn't hold up to the "forever" way of doing things!
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: tipman14 on Feb 11, 2018, 11:20 PM
Well my family and I have shopped at beans ever since I could remember , we always new we were paying more but just that idea of having the warranty just Incase was a good feeling and helped with the thought of spending our hard earned money and to think  after all those years I think I used it once and it was only because it was poorly made but I had no complaints because I knew I could exchange it for another one. Most merchandise is marked up double what it should cost and why because if it came  back some day the item was already payed for twice.I’m sure there not going to drop there prices to be more competitive so I would have to say if there going to be like most other companies why wouldn’t I shop those other companies with better prices. Not that losing me as a customer matters to them in the big picture. I say good luck to them I don’t like to see any business hurting it is not good for the economy and effects many people . But I think it was a very bad business decision and I honestly believe it will hurt them more then the cost of there return policy did.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: The Rusty Crab on Feb 11, 2018, 11:23 PM
Saying Bean boots suck is like saying Vermont’s maple syrup tastes like raccoon piss

Those flagship boots suck. They have zero support and zero insulation. If you think they are good try them out for a full day on the ice.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: TroutWorm on Feb 12, 2018, 04:20 AM
You people don't listen to what was said and just make stupid comments. I didn't say old man LL stuff was cheep but NOW it is. He did earn every penny and Yes he'd he pissed right now about cheeply made products for high price sorry if you don't like it not sorry
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: fishlessman on Feb 12, 2018, 02:32 PM
try a pair of schnee's, way nicer than the bean boots ;D
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 12, 2018, 03:06 PM
try a pair of schnee's, way nicer than the bean boots ;D

How's there return policy?    @)
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: fishlessman on Feb 12, 2018, 03:20 PM
How's there return policy?    @)

same as beans on the boots, pay to have the bottoms replaced.  my schnees are 16 years old and still look new, and theres none of that bean slippage at the heal
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: 9huskies on Feb 12, 2018, 06:13 PM
Well my family and I have shopped at beans ever since I could remember , we always new we were paying more but just that idea of having the warranty just Incase was a good feeling and helped with the thought of spending our hard earned money and to think  after all those years I think I used it once and it was only because it was poorly made but I had no complaints because I knew I could exchange it for another one. Most merchandise is marked up double what it should cost and why because if it came  back some day the item was already payed for twice.I’m sure there not going to drop there prices to be more competitive so I would have to say if there going to be like most other companies why wouldn’t I shop those other companies with better prices. Not that losing me as a customer matters to them in the big picture. I say good luck to them I don’t like to see any business hurting it is not good for the economy and effects many people . But I think it was a very bad business decision and I honestly believe it will hurt them more then the cost of there return policy did.


If you compare L.L. Bean's prices with other brands of similar quality you will find that they are competitively priced. It only seems overpriced if you compare it to prices of low quality junk at WalMart. If you buy Jack Traps from L.L.Bean's, L.L.Cote or Dag's the prices wil be about the same. If you buy at the end of the season you will probably get the best deal from Bean's.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: zhaaksdad on Feb 12, 2018, 07:12 PM
worked at corporate for a couple years as a contractor:
1- folks are the nicest, most professional in the industry
2- Mr Gorman was a daily interaction- outstanding man
3- Bean boots are, uh, terrible, great for high school gals and the like for chic coolness.
4- new policy is obvious, the trend towards lefties being somewhat legitimized with nothing more than plurality needs to stop everywhere
5-The descendants of LL are all outstanding human beings; dealing with an ever-changing business

can't wait to fish on Friday!
tight lines - come at me bro
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: pondstar on Feb 12, 2018, 08:15 PM
I hope they choke on their over priced junk.  LL Bean could not be more removed from true Maine outdoorsman.  I saw a t-shirt there that read ICE FISHING RANGELEY LAKE.  They could do the return policy because they changed 7 times what the product was worth
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: icecruiser on Feb 12, 2018, 09:42 PM
I hope they choke on their over priced junk.  LL Bean could not be more removed from true Maine outdoorsman.  I saw a t-shirt there that read ICE FISHING RANGELEY LAKE.  They could do the return policy because they changed 7 times what the product was worth

If you don’t like it why were you shopping there buying ice fish Rangeley shirts?

Oh wait do you even ice fish anymore?

Or were you there buying flannel underwear?   ;D

I have lots of beans stuff but haven’t shopped there for years but have heard many stories of the abuse.

Just a matter of time in my opinion. 

John
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: pondstar on Feb 12, 2018, 11:21 PM

Oh wait do you even ice fish anymore?

[/Haha.!!!!  Around ice all the time ... Just not the kind with fish under it.quote]
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: TroutWorm on Feb 13, 2018, 05:20 AM

If you compare L.L. Bean's prices with other brands of similar quality you will find that they are competitively priced. It only seems overpriced if you compare it to prices of low quality junk at WalMart. If you buy Jack Traps from L.L.Bean's, L.L.Cote or Dag's the prices wil be about the same. If you buy at the end of the season you will probably get the best deal from Bean's.
well now with 1 year warranty you buy at end of season for cheeper but can't use it till next season and if something goes wrong you can't bring it back bc it's been a year
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: allagashking on Feb 13, 2018, 07:25 AM
If defective they will replace I have no problem best warrantee period only people who have problem with are ones who where scamming them. give them year we will see.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: JDK on Feb 13, 2018, 08:33 AM
In general, people suck.  This is LL Beans way of saying it.

Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: darkeyez on Feb 13, 2018, 09:52 AM
Interesting subject! I have never returned anything made by Woolrich, Johnson, Codet, Columbia, and a few other manufacturers. I have worn their products for years, and when worn out I got my use out of them and wouldn't even consider trying to return them.
I have not had that experience with some of the "modern" gear that is expensive, years ago I bought 2 pairs of Rocky Snowstalkers and the pair I had been using started falling apart after about 3 yrs. of minimal hunting use only, next year I went to use the brand new pair in the box and the rubber heel guard was no better than the pair I had worn and was disintegrating ---China JUNK! Also had Cabela's Dry Plus bibs that I wore very minimally and looked like new, needless to say I bought them for the waterproof quality and after about 6 yrs. they were no longer waterproof even though they were hardly worn and stored properly. WTH, expensive and only worn a few times and no longer waterproof, those were returned!
Talk about lifetime warranties, many years ago I bought a Sunoco "LIFETIME" battery where the paperwork stated that Sunoco would replace the battery for as long as you own the car it was originally installed in. Guess what, I still have the car and Sunoco is still replacing the battery, I think they hate me!  ;D
They did try to get out of that "lifetime warranty", but the FTC stepped in and said NOPE you will honor the lifetime warranty that you offered.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: JDK on Feb 13, 2018, 10:06 AM
LL Bean's return policy is/was a 100% satisfaction guarantee NOT a lifetime warrantee.  The issues comes when idiots buy stuff at a yard sale and then return it, when people go fishing for a week and then return gear, when people fish for a season and then return gear to get gear for a new season.  That is wrong and what was being abused.  You know it, I know it, LL Bean knows it.

Seems to me that if you aren't satisfied with something within a year you should know it.  If it is defective they are going to work with you.  Pretty simple really.  This is from someone that doesn't shop there and owns very little from LL Bean.



Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: caught_the_fever on Feb 13, 2018, 12:13 PM
Thank you to all of you for understanding our current difficulties, our 1.6 billion dollar yearly gross sales are no longer supporting our family's lifestyle.  We will continue to develop our outsourced products for you (you know who they are!!) and yes, even Lewiston! But we must make changes in order to keep our barrels full of cash. Sincerely S. Gorman

I hear you, however, the key word in the stated number is "gross" sales.   Remove the returns and you get "net" sales.  Next we have to account for cost of goods sold (product cost, including development, freight, etc) for gross profit.  Subsequently, there are volumes of expenses (payroll being the biggest, occupancy costs, etc) and we get to income before tax. 

I believe any of us who have stood in the returns line more than once has witnessed abuse of policies.  To expect a consumer grade boot to last an entire lifetime is not a realistic expectation.  I've personally witnessed individuals bringing trash bags of outfits clearly worn for years expecting full refunds.  I believe those cases of trash bags were the exception vs. the rule but I've seen a lot of old stuff showing back up.

At the end of the day, it's a business which has to turn a profit.  They'll need to monitor this change closely but I believe most of their customers will not have an issue upon some reflection.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 13, 2018, 12:38 PM
I hear you, however, the key word in the stated number is "gross" sales.   Remove the returns and you get "net" sales.  Next we have to account for cost of goods sold (product cost, including development, freight, etc) for gross profit.  Subsequently, there are volumes of expenses (payroll being the biggest, occupancy costs, etc) and we get to income before tax. 

I believe any of us who have stood in the returns line more than once has witnessed abuse of policies.  To expect a consumer grade boot to last an entire lifetime is not a realistic expectation.  I've personally witnessed individuals bringing trash bags of outfits clearly worn for years expecting full refunds.  I believe those cases of trash bags were the exception vs. the rule but I've seen a lot of old stuff showing back up.

At the end of the day, it's a business which has to turn a profit.  They'll need to monitor this change closely but I believe most of their customers will not have an issue upon some reflection.

Some people are taking this post way too seriously...
No offence but I've been in business for over 32 years and your explanation of business accounting is  a bit wrong bub but close enough...
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: 9huskies on Feb 13, 2018, 06:00 PM
There was talk on the radio about this. They were saying the opiod epidemic has added to the return problems. Junkies have been breaking into houses to steal L.L. Bean products. Then they return them for a gift card. Next, they sell the card for drug money.  It's not only local junky thieves. It was happening in other places. The thieves were returning the items by mail.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: 9huskies on Feb 13, 2018, 06:05 PM
well now with 1 year warranty you buy at end of season for cheeper but can't use it till next season and if something goes wrong you can't bring it back bc it's been a year

End of season sales on ice gear happen in March. If you discover problems next February it has not been a year.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Sampson on Feb 13, 2018, 06:41 PM
It's all my fault. Lol
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: gauge on Feb 14, 2018, 07:50 AM
L. L. Beam has been offering to e-mail your receiptwhen purchased at the store.
This will be a good way to save your proof of purchase for any issues.
I know I haven't been good about saving hard copies.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: TroutWorm on Feb 14, 2018, 08:11 AM
It's NOT ABUSE if that's their policy. You need to unconfuse your brain
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: hardwatergrampa on Feb 14, 2018, 10:21 AM
they are being sued 5 mill over this by some outer state people
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: caught_the_fever on Feb 14, 2018, 01:41 PM
Some people are taking this post way too seriously...
No offence but I've been in business for over 32 years and your explanation of business accounting is  a bit wrong bub but close enough...

My name is Mike, sorry I haven't introduced myself before.  Also my apologies if my post came across as condescending, certainly not my intent.  Some are just not familiar with the difference in gross sales vs. the bottom line.

I know a number of details were spared to avoid delving too far into a topic most on the board would find boring but out of curiosity, where do you feel the retail accounting went astray?

I don't disagree with you regarding the policy change entirely - the old is generally good for business and if people bought due to that warranty there's a very legit concern how this is applied.  That said, the policy being taken advantage of has been out in the open.  The change may be greed, but may also be trying to keep as many people employed as possible.  Without knowing the numbers, I personally find it tough to criticize a business.

Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Dankenstein on Feb 14, 2018, 02:18 PM

I believe any of us who have stood in the returns line more than once has witnessed abuse of policies.  To expect a consumer grade boot to last an entire lifetime is not a realistic expectation.  I've personally witnessed individuals bringing trash bags of outfits clearly worn for years expecting full refunds.  I believe those cases of trash bags were the exception vs. the rule but I've seen a lot of old stuff showing back up.


Really this should be all that is needed. Has been a great policy. Easy to see why it is not sustainable. I am amazed it lasted as long as it did. I have no doubt they will continue to be great to their loyal customers.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: caught_the_fever on Feb 14, 2018, 02:36 PM
Really this should be all that is needed. Has been a great policy. Easy to see why it is not sustainable. I am amazed it lasted as long as it did. I have no doubt they will continue to be great to their loyal customers.

I agree, Dankenstein.  It's hard to imagine a business that was so customer-centric completely shifting direction.  I may very well be wrong but I'd expect LL Bean to treat their loyal customers well and err in their favor while utilizing this change to say no to unrealistic expectations some, emphasizing some, held.  Only time will tell.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: TroutWorm on Feb 14, 2018, 03:05 PM
Question for ya, how does Ll bean know who their loyal customers are? I buy stuff there bc it's closer than cabellas and they treat me the same as the person before me and the person after me.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Shrinkage on Feb 14, 2018, 04:14 PM
Just throwing this out there, fun fact. I shot my first deer on the same mountain that Leon Leonwood Bean shot his.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: hardwatergrampa on Feb 14, 2018, 04:17 PM
ll shrinkage
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: rgfixit on Feb 14, 2018, 04:27 PM
It's near impossible to stay in business with a giant like Amazon out there doing all the things that no other can afford to do.

Rg
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: JDK on Feb 14, 2018, 04:44 PM
Just throwing this out there, fun fact. I shot my first deer on the same mountain that Leon Leonwood Bean shot his.

That is cool.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Gettinjiggy1 on Feb 14, 2018, 05:17 PM
 If I were LL Bean  I would be worrying about the giant influx of A- holes that are going to flood those stores now that the  announcement has been made..  for me ,  everybody knows right from wrong (  some people just choose wrong ) and in the coming months you'll see a big spike in fraudulent claims. The dumbasses that were using the system will show their ugly heads in the next year.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Seamonkey84 on Feb 14, 2018, 08:12 PM
The dumbasses that were using the system will show their ugly heads in the next year.

That’s to put it lightly. When brookstone changed its policy, it got ugly and took a while for the public to learn about the changes. I’m sure if the person still has the original receipt with the original warranty/guarantee on it, they would honor it, but no more yard sale pickers and good will salvaging.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: WhiteSquall on Feb 14, 2018, 09:42 PM
I think LLB has wanted to make the change for quite some time but doing it with a family member in charge would of brought even more backlash.

Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: Dankenstein on Feb 15, 2018, 08:26 AM
Question for ya, how does Ll bean know who their loyal customers are? I buy stuff there bc it's closer than cabellas and they treat me the same as the person before me and the person after me.
They can look up your purchase history when you try to return something.

And if you say "I don't want to give them my name so they can track me" well, can't do much for that. It is what it is, they need some way to protect themselves.
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: bearnoob on Feb 15, 2018, 08:45 AM
Love Beans products and services. Have a parka that I still use when ice fishing, have had it since high school and it's still warm. Compare that to the bibs I just bought (not LL Bean) which have stitching ripping out.

On another Bean coat, the button broke. I called and offered to buy a new button and (because they were not made anymore) they offered to pay for a new set of matching of my choice buttons. (Didn't take them up on it, wife found an extra sewed into the bottom of the jacket.) They could have told me to pound sand and I still would be happy with the product.

Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: TroutWorm on Feb 16, 2018, 06:29 PM
Nope
Title: Re: Return policy abuse !!!!
Post by: porkpiehat on Feb 19, 2018, 11:19 PM
If it makes business sense for them that's their choice. I do know a lot of people who pay their premiums because of that warranty. Never had a problem with their waders, fly rods, etc., but I've bought a few ultralite combos with crappy reels. I would have changed them out but would end up with the same crappy reels that keep breaking. I guess you could say the same with BPS but I don't expect the same quality.