ROLL TIDE!!!

[Fishking83]

Looks like we're drinkin the same thing.

I can tell

[Fishking83]

The two best teams are playing for the title. As stated OK state blew it against Iowa state. I do think the Tide will roll past LSU, but 13 points  no way!!  The SEC dominates the college football scene, thugs and gangsters maybe.... however they do make for some damn good football on Saturday

Couldn't be more right.  All I prefer to watch on Saturdays is SEC football.  Watching ND and some of the other teams or confrences sometimes looks like a high school game most of the time.  I always hear ND fans talk about how their academics are outstanding.  15 years ago when ND was good at football nobody ever talked about their football players academics?  All you heard about was ND football.  All of this academic talk began about 5 years ago and I crack up when I hear it.  They aren't saints either.  Dont forget Michael Floyd's 3 DUI/alcohol related charges, or the basketball player Harongody(spelling) getting busted for marijuana twice.  Bottom line is every school has top notch scholars and boneheads on the same team.  I give anyone credit for continuing the education after high school.  Better to be on a campus attending classes rather than on the streets.  ROLL TIDE!   

[rico]

Alabama has earned the right to play in this game. Rember its the body of work that you have done.When Bama's only lose is to LSU and OKSU get blown out by a nobody what do you expect. Other teams had their chance but pissed it away. I mean come on do you really think LSU wanted to play BAMA. Hell no. They were praying for anyone but them. Roll Tide all the way!!!!!!!!!!

Okie State didnt get blown out, they lost in OT.  And a questionable FG call at the end of regulation put it in OT.  I dont like the system.  This happened a few years back when Nebraska didnt win their side of the Big 12 and ended up in the "Championship" game.

[wax_worm]

Couldn't be more right.  All I prefer to watch on Saturdays is SEC football.  Watching ND and some of the other teams or confrences sometimes looks like a high school game most of the time.  I always hear ND fans talk about how their academics are outstanding.  15 years ago when ND was good at football nobody ever talked about their football players academics?  All you heard about was ND football.  All of this academic talk began about 5 years ago and I crack up when I hear it.  They aren't saints either.  Dont forget Michael Floyd's 3 DUI/alcohol related charges, or the basketball player Harongody(spelling) getting busted for marijuana twice.  Bottom line is every school has top notch scholars and boneheads on the same team.  I give anyone credit for continuing the education after high school.  Better to be on a campus attending classes rather than on the streets.  ROLL TIDE!   

Point is alot of kids at SEC schools would not be in college or even graduate HS if not for their ability on the FB field.  Alot of them can not even speak a complete sentence.  The SEC dominates for 1 reason only.  They are allowed to over sign FB players beyond the 25 limit (until this year with SEC is finally changed its conf rules) because so many of the kids don't eventually qualify acedemically.  They also pull scholies from kids that get hurt or are not living up to the hype in order to stay under the 85 team scholie limit allowed by the NCAA.  Those kids are dumped on the streets or have to transfer and sit out a year and if injured they are not wanted by other schools.  They can't afford college without the scholie so they end up dropping out.  If you think I am making this up, do some research on CFB recruiting the past 10 years and you will see what I mean.  There are plenty of damning articles written about the oversigning pratices of the SEC.  The SEC and its schools are basically having 'tryouts' to see who is really good and making up medical reasons, etc to pull scholies for those that don't cut it.  Not picking on Bama as they all do it, but here are their numbers for recruits from 2008 - 2012.  Keep in mind the 2012 signing day is still 3 weeks away so the number could go up or down.

2012 - 26
2011 - 22
2010 - 29
2009 - 27
2008 - 32

No matter how you add it up over 4 years from 2008-2011 = 110 or 2009 - 2012 = 104, anywhere from 19 to 25 kids who signed a LOI to play FB at bama have had their scholie pulled, transferred or went to the NFL EARLY in order to stay under the 85 total limit.  Some parents of kids that had scholies pulled by SEC teams for made up injuries to make room for a better player finally challenged the SEC and they have now fallen in line with the 25 limit per year rule like every other conference imposes. The kids that they dup into alot of these SEC schools all think they are going pro and don't need an education.  The reality is about 2% of D1 college FB players go pro.  With FB grad rates at 70% or below for all teams in the SEC other than Vanderbilt and the grad rate for african american FB players hovering around 50% at alot of SEC powers, you better be in that 2% that go pro or those schools will use you and toss your aside like garbage and not think twice about helping you get an education.   In contrast, teams like Northwestern, Stanford, Vandy, ND, etc...have grad rates for FB hovering around 98% (kids that transfer and don't graduate eventually count against the orginal teams %) for all FB players, black and white. 

And by the way, if you go back and look at grad rates when ND was a power and winning alot under holtz, the grad rates were still well above 90%.  No one talked about it because the team was winning, but you have no argument against the fact it is a different kid that gets into ND, Stanford, Vandy, NW to play FB than what the SEC is recruiting.

These kids are called STUDENT - athletes for a reason.  The SEC has it backwards and use the kids for FB and generating millions without regard to their education or well being after they are used up on the FB feild.

I do like Saban more than Miles, but could care less who wins.

[Iceassin]

This ones for you Swamp..."similar" one on the Go Blue thread as well...



GO BLUE

[spring bobber]

Dont forget Michael Floyd's 3 DUI/alcohol related charges, or the basketball player Harongody(spelling) getting busted for marijuana twice.   

It was actually McAlarney, not Harangody, who was the pot smoker.  But that's beside the point.

I agree with Rico. They lost in overtime, only a few days after the tragic plane accident that killed four people from their womens basketball team. And people may say that they barely beat Stanford, but that is just how they play. They win shootouts. Stanford can hang with anybody, they have proven that several times. Just something to consider.

[rico]

Good read Waxie.  I am a Tennessee fan, and you have hit the nail on the head.  Some of you out there might remember the old SWC(Southwest Conference).  It was basically all the D1 schools in Texas plus Arkansas.  Corruption was their demise.  Hopefully the SEC gets with the proper program or I am going to have to throw away alot of orange! 

But I will say this......with what has been going on with Ohio St and Penn St......are we the pot calling the kettle black?

[wax_worm]

I'm with Waxy here.


The BCS is a joke, until college football starts playing for an actual title that is awarded by winning a tournament i will never be able to agree with the elected teams that are in the top game. They ought to start paying the kids openly as well, even if its set salary caps. Everyone acts like it doesn't happen, but there isn't a division one football player out there that isn't "on the take" in one way or the other.

They are paying the kids....They are getting paid anywhere from 80 - 200K over four years.  All they have to do is go to class and graduate and they have a degree and NO COLLEGE DEBT.  I know a ton of kids that would give anything to be able to get out of college without a mountain of student loans to pay.  The schollies they get also have money for them to spend each month on whatever they want like food, cell phones, shoes, clothes, travel home for holidays etc... the amount is not small either. 

I think it is a stretch to say EVERY D1 player is on the take.  Some are, some aren't.  Probably happens at most major programs to some level, but not every player is on the take.  If they were, there would be alot more investigations going on because kids tend to have loose lips.  Also, alot don't need it, and others aren't good enough for someone to offer them illegal benefits.

[wax_worm]

Good read Waxie.  I am a Tennessee fan, and you have hit the nail on the head.  Some of you out there might remember the old SWC(Southwest Conference).  It was basically all the D1 schools in Texas plus Arkansas.  Corruption was their demise.  Hopefully the SEC gets with the proper program or I am going to have to throw away alot of orange! 

But I will say this......with what has been going on with Ohio St and Penn St......are we the pot calling the kettle black?

Rico,  Ohio stat and Penn state were not allowed to do the oversigning thing, as the big ten has never allowed it.  Their Grad rates for FB players are horrible though and in line with the worst of the SEC schools.  The Paterno/Sandusky thing makes me sick to my stomach and I hope they get the death penalty like SMU did for lack of institutional control.  Ohio State has been dirty Tressels whole tenure, he just finally got caught.  Their penalties should have been more in line with what USC got, but they got off relatively unscathed and now have a better coach out of the deal!!  Doesn't seem quite right, does it....but again it is all about money for both the schools and conferences.

[rico]

That is what I am trying to say Waxie.  I dont know what the lessor of two evils are.  On one hand we got the SEC doing their thing(fellas, a majority of them have been put on probation for rules infractions) and we got the Big Ten having schools that do favors for tattos and cover-up the molestation of young boys.  I dont know what the answer is, but I dont like what is going on across the board in different shapes and forms. 

Good discussion.

[swamp]

It was actually McAlarney, not Harangody, who was the pot smoker.  But that's beside the point.

I agree with Rico. They lost in overtime, only a few days after the tragic plane accident that killed four people from their womens basketball team. And people may say that they barely beat Stanford, but that is just how they play. They win shootouts. Stanford can hang with anybody, they have proven that several times. Just something to consider.

that plane crash had nothing to do with that is some BS..we had a players mom die 6 days before the LSU game but we didnt blame it on that..we got beat fair and square at the time just like OKSU got beat..Just our loss was less harsh as losing to a sub 500 team..

[Iceassin]

Right you are Rico...and if I might add...

As long as the NCAA and the schools/conferences are generating huge revenues for this "business", little is being done about infractions, inappropriate/illegal behaviors, etc. That is, until too many people outside these institutions start blowing whistles and they become totally exposed of their actions. Look how long the Penn State thing had been going on before it became public knowledge...my God!

These people have been greasing each others palms forever and a day, all the while pointing fingers at each other to try and create an "illusionary diversion" for us.

We can only hope that these latest findings may lead to those magicians finally running out of rabbits to pull out of their hats...and maybe get back to why colleges are really there for...brains, not brawn.

I dunno...

[rico]

that plane crash had nothing to do with that is some BS..we had a players mom die 6 days before the LSU game but we didnt blame it on that..we got beat fair and square at the time just like OKSU got beat..Just our loss was less harsh as losing to a sub 500 team..

I beg to disagree swamp.  You cant compare the two.  OSU lost their Women's coach and top assistant and the University cancelled everything except that football game, prolly cause a lot of money was involved?  Seems like a lot people forget about that missed FG call at the end of the OSU-ISU game.  Had that been deemed good we wouldnt even be having this discussion right now.

[mongo782]

Ice  wouldnt that be a novel concept. education!

[Iceassin]

I beg to disagree swamp.  You cant compare the two.  OSU lost their Women's coach and top assistant and the University cancelled everything except that football game, prolly cause a lot of money was involved?  Seems like a lot people forget about that missed FG call at the end of the OSU-ISU game.  Had that been deemed good we wouldnt even be having this discussion right now.

Bingo...

[rico]

Right you are Rico...and if I might add...

As long as the NCAA and the schools/conferences are generating huge revenues for this "business", little is being done about infractions, inappropriate/illegal behaviors, etc. That is, until too many people outside these institutions start blowing whistles and they become totally exposed of their actions. Look how long the Penn State thing had been going on before it became public knowledge...my God!

These people have been greasing each others palms forever and a day, all the while pointing fingers at each other to try and create an "illusionary diversion" for us.

We can only hope that these latest findings may lead to those magicians finally running out of rabbits to pull out of their hats...and maybe get back to why colleges are really there for...brains, not brawn.

I dunno...

Amen bro......All I know is that it is about the almighty "Buck".  It goes across the board, just some schools hide it in different ways.  Boosters, alumni, giving recruits parents University jobs......the list is never ending.  It aint just about football.......it is what ever a particular institution's major income comes from..........Why do all the Duke basketball players major in sociallogy? 

Like I said, I dont have the answers or really even a solution.  I just know what we got out there is broke and needs fixing.

[Iceassin]

Amen bro......All I know is that it is about the almighty "Buck".  It goes across the board, just some schools hide it in different ways.  Boosters, alumni, giving recruits parents University jobs......the list is never ending.  It aint just about football.......it is what ever a particular institution's major income comes from..........Why do all the Duke basketball players major in sociallogy? 

Like I said, I dont have the answers or really even a solution.  I just know what we got out there is broke and needs fixing.

Sure you do...you (we) just don't have the money to compete with those guys to change it. And another thing, it's not so much what these kids are learning inside the classroom...it's what they are being taught/shown outside of it...very sad.

[rico]

Sure you do...you (we) just don't have the dirty money to compete with those guys to change it. And another thing, it's not so much what these kids are learning inside the classroom...it's what they are being taught/shown outside of it...very sad.

I dont know about the dirty money part, but society does have its priorities out of skew.  The money chain is vast.  It seems to be never ending.........Reggie Bush, Cam Newton, Marcus Camby, even the "Fab Five".  I just dunno.

[wax_worm]

One step that can be taken is to force univeristies to obtain a graduation rate that is acceptable or they don't go to bowl games.  Set the bar at 80% for ALL sports not just football or you don't go to bowls or play for titles until you meet that standard.  80% is not a hard to achieve if you put the people in place to help these kids actually learn something that will be of value to them after football.  Just like you have to pass certian tests to graduate HS, the same should be put in place for college athletes so you prevent colleges from just giving them grades to move them along.  Depending on the year in school (frosh, so, jr, sr) they take a standardized test that has to be passed by that 80% benchmark or you don't go bowling.  This would force some colleges to put more money into tutors and actually helping the kids learn something for their future instead of just using them for their athletic ability and then tossing them aside when they get hurt or their eligability is up.  It is embarrassing to the NCAA to see kids after their Jr. year in college unable to put a sentence together better than some 4 and 5 yr. olds.  It is a shame where college FB and hoops have gone as far as just looking at the money to be made and not caring about the kids or their futures.

Did anyone watch the under armor all american game last night on ESPN?  They had 6 live committments on the show and of the 6 only one of the kids could put complete sentence together.  Guess which conference, got 5 of the 6 commits?  The SEC.  The kid that could actually speak went to Eastern Carolina, even though he had SEC offers.

[fishinfiend]

CMON MAN!!!!!  Its football there are way too many teams for it to be "fair" every year!!  Somebody always gets the shaft....it happens!  If all the schools just had kids that were outstanding scholars then the game would SUCK!  We would be on here crying the blus cuase all the teams suck and cant move the ball ten yards in 4 Qtrs.  It is what it is, I hope we get some ice soon because everything on here turns into a great debate, because we are all EXPERTS on everything............ ......................

[Iceassin]

I dont know about the  money part, but society does have its priorities out of skew.  The money chain is vast.  It seems to be never ending.........Reggie Bush, Cam Newton, Marcus Camby, even the "Fab Five".  I just dunno.

Took it out...little harsh 

[Iceassin]

CMON MAN!!!!!  Its football there are way too many teams for it to be "fair" every year!!  Somebody always gets the shaft....it happens!  If all the schools just had kids that were outstanding scholars then the game would SUCK!  We would be on here crying the blus cuase all the teams suck and cant move the ball ten yards in 4 Qtrs.  It is what it is, I hope we get some ice soon because everything on here turns into a great debate, because we are all EXPERTS on everything..................................

No...not at all. Just OPINIONS... on a lot of things 

[Iceassin]

One step that can be taken is to force univeristies to obtain a graduation rate that is acceptable or they don't go to bowl games.  Set the bar at 80% for ALL sports not just football or you don't go to bowls or play for titles until you meet that standard.  80% is not a hard to achieve if you put the people in place to help these kids actually learn something that will be of value to them after football.  Just like you have to pass certian tests to graduate HS, the same should be put in place for college athletes so you prevent colleges from just giving them grades to move them along.  Depending on the year in school (frosh, so, jr, sr) they take a standardized test that has to be passed by that 80% benchmark or you don't go bowling.  This would force some colleges to put more money into tutors and actually helping the kids learn something for their future instead of just using them for their athletic ability and then tossing them aside when they get hurt or their eligability is up.  It is embarrassing to the NCAA to see kids after their Jr. year in college unable to put a sentence together better than some 4 and 5 yr. olds.  It is a shame where college FB and hoops have gone as far as just looking at the money to be made and not caring about the kids or their futures.



Did anyone watch the under armor all american game last night on ESPN?  They had 6 live committments on the show and of the 6 only one of the kids could put complete sentence together.  Guess which conference, got 5 of the 6 commits?  The SEC.  The kid that could actually speak went to Eastern Carolina, even though he had SEC offers.

Great idea Waxie, wished it would come to that but...."No bowl game for you, No big money for you"   

[spring bobber]

that plane crash had nothing to do with that is some BS..we had a players mom die 6 days before the LSU game but we didnt blame it on that..we got beat fair and square at the time just like OKSU got beat..Just our loss was less harsh as losing to a sub 500 team..

I am not placing blame on the plane crash as an excuse, and neither was Oklahoma State. They wanted to win that game for the victims and they even dedicated their great game vs Stanford to the four victims. But to say that the plane incident had no affect on the game would be ignorant. The school was, for the most part, shut down, and the negativity and sadness they were surrounded by most definitely had an affect on their psyche. Not to mention the fact that the University had gone through this almost exactly 10 years prior with the men's basketball team.

Nonetheless, everyone expected them to win that game. And that game winning field goal will be disputed for a while. Them scoring their lowest point total of the season in regulation (24), in combination with Iowa State's knack, under Paul Rhoads, to upset big opponents, ended Okie States perfect season. Now we will see LSU vs BAMA Round 2 in LSU's back yard, the Superdome.

[spring bobber]

CMON MAN!!!!!  Its football there are way too many teams for it to be "fair" every year!!  Somebody always gets the shaft....it happens!  If all the schools just had kids that were outstanding scholars then the game would SUCK!  We would be on here crying the blus cuase all the teams suck and cant move the ball ten yards in 4 Qtrs.  It is what it is, I hope we get some ice soon because everything on here turns into a great debate, because we are all EXPERTS on everything............ ......................

I don't think they would suck. Your assuming that the talent level would take a step down. Even if that were true, EVERY team would take a step down and you wouldn't know the difference. For example, if all the players started having like MAC talent instead of SEC talent, they would all be relatively equal and we wouldn't know the difference. It would be all down to recruiting to get the best scholar-athletes.

Recruiting is its own mess...

[Mr. gill]

I here the helicopter coming again. Just kidding kidding. This is a good argument by both sides. Boiler up.

[rico]

Let me say that discussions like this are a heckuva lot better than coming here reading nothing but "nice fish" responses!!!!!!!!!

Colleges are supposed to be about higher education.  They are not supposed to be used as a platform to jump to the next level of athletics.  Not a single school out there was founded to provide any athlete the means to do so.  However in the last 20-30 years it has become just that.  There is a lot of blame to go around. 

[wax_worm]

CMON MAN!!!!!  Its football there are way too many teams for it to be "fair" every year!!  Somebody always gets the shaft....it happens!  If all the schools just had kids that were outstanding scholars then the game would SUCK!  We would be on here crying the blus cuase all the teams suck and cant move the ball ten yards in 4 Qtrs.  It is what it is, I hope we get some ice soon because everything on here turns into a great debate, because we are all EXPERTS on everything............ ......................

I love how whenever a good conversation starts on here, people start pissing and moaning about it.  Don't read it if you don't like it.  I don't see anyone claiming to be an expert in anything.  Facts are facts and there are plenty of them stated in here why the SEC is what it is today in football.  The point is there should be playoff to avoid someone getting the shaft.  Until it happens the BCS is a joke. 

I think the kids at Stanford would take exception you saying they suck at playing football especially after what they have done in the past 3 years.  Rhode scholars like Myron Rolle would also laugh at your comment.  It can be done with the right coaches and if the school makes an effort to hold their program to any kind of standard in the classroom.  You say it is what it is, but the facts are the rules all other conferences are going by have not been the same as the SEC conf rules.  They have finally come in line and you will see they will no longer dominate  (it will take a few years) like the last 6 years.  Anyone can field a team of 85 players that are good when you are allowed to sign as many as you want and then pick the 85 that play best and discard the others.  Now they can only have 25 max per year and some of those won't qualitfy like at other schools and conferences, so they will be playing on an even playing field except for the academic part of it.  But that is the kids loss not the univerisities...they are raking in the cash.

[rico]

LOL...waxie and I concur.

I did find this.......

https://sportsdelve.wordpress.com/2011/05/23/ncaa-probation-and-college-football/

[spring bobber]

I recall a year or two ago, Notre Dame had a lineman by the name of Chris Stewart. At the time he was the only player in the FBS attending law school while playing football.

Of course the announcers always used this fact boastfully, deeming it one of Stewart's greatest accolades.

When I heard it however, even being a Notre Dame fan, I was shocked at the fact that he is the only one out of 110+ colleges and universities that is securing his future by means of going to law school. It just baffled me that no one else wanted to take it upon themselves to secure their future outside of football. There are these little things called injuries, and they don't necessarily come when your Brett Favre and 40+ years old with doing Wrangler commercials just raking in the money. They can come when you leave your junior year, without your degree and in spring training you tear your ACL and can never run or cut like you used to.

Fortunately, I believe Andrew Luck has somehow made staying at school somewhat 'cool' again. Tyler Eifert is staying, Manti Teo is staying, Landry Jones (Okla) is staying, Montee Ball (Wisc) is staying. Some are still making their decisions but the future looks promising in that regard. However, college basketball is another story.