ONEIDA LAKE DIEHARDS THREAD 2013/2014

[SNAGGER]

  So all those perch I marked in 30 fow that were up 5-12 feet, were they staying away from bottom because of a lack of oxygen in that area?  3 hours, never marked a fish under 4 feet up.

[reeleyz]

  So all those perch I marked in 30 fow that were up 5-12 feet, were they staying away from bottom because of a lack of oxygen in that area?  3 hours, never marked a fish under 4 feet up.

Almost all of the perch I marked were at least 3' off bottom. I don't remember seeing that before, not all day at least. Could be oxygen or maybe that is the range that most of the wigglers are swimming in.

Nice pic perch-hound. The goose is a taking a gander at the perch. 

[315stickbow]

Most of the fish I saw were coming in 3ft up as well...one being the burb I caught. They can tolerate low oxygen, so if they're 3ft up the lake must be hurting oxygen wise.

[scout57]

I've been noticing this for 3 weeks now.....all of the perch I have been catching have been at least 3 or more feet off bottom...posted this a while back....never gave the oxygen thing a thought though....put all my lures above that mark and have been doing good.....down in Myrtle beach now.....41 degrees and rainy right now ....gonna get better in a day or 2.....R&R

[bcons]

  So all those perch I marked in 30 fow that were up 5-12 feet, were they staying away from bottom because of a lack of oxygen in that area?  3 hours, never marked a fish under 4 feet up.

I've been searching for a reason for my odd perch year too.  However I doubt it's the oxygen levels.  When considering dissolved oxygen levels in water you have to remember to take into account other gases that remain trapped under the ice the CO2 & other gasses from decaying plant matter.  They remain trapped in the water.  Shallow ponds, lakes, & bays under 12-15' have problems much more frequently. Due to less volume of water and more decaying plant matter from the weeds.
Water deeper than that not so much. 
Think of Sandy Pond, until the current from the channel blows the cut open it's often frozen shut from the Shoves on the beach.  The creek stays frozen a ways up most years. Couple 13' holes thats it.  Also has a much larger biomass of fish/acre of water.  Yet the fish there are much less moody most of the time.
Lakeview is even worse than that.

Oneida is always locked up for far less time each year, the 40-50' hole is bigger than either of those other two.  Then it would bring up the question why aren't the fish migrating towards the 50' hole where there's less fish, less bacteria & algae consuming the oxygen?

Then most years guys catch fish with much more consistency on Big Bay then we do out in middle (granted BB has been rough this year, but its been rough for most of the year) O2 levels there are worse.

When we get our big midwinter thaws that last several days to a week & fish creek blows out, why don't the fish flock to the beach bowl? Not only do they not flock there, the new dirty water turns the bite right off for a week.  Even when marking fish & getting some interest on bright or glow stuff, coaxing the bite just doesn't work well.

Lots of questions this year for sure, unfortunately far fewer answers

[Dark Cloud]

My old fishing buddy came in from Minnesota for a couple of days of perchin. Going to try some spots this afternoon and then do an all day blitz tomorrow. Hope we can find a few that will bite.

Ut-ooh, the Gman is in town. Nobody is more fun to catch more fish than, then him... 

[Oldtimer]

It has been a long, cold, dark, snowy winter. People  are sick of it and so are the fish.. 

[coachwarner]

  So all those perch I marked in 30 fow that were up 5-12 feet, were they staying away from bottom because of a lack of oxygen in that area?  3 hours, never marked a fish under 4 feet up.

http://dnr.wi.gov/wnrmag/2009/12/ice.htm

[scout57]

http://dnr.wi.gov/wnrmag/2009/12/ice.htm

very interesting article

[pooch2543]

I'm sticking with the cause as being Meth contamination!!!!!!! We are gonna have some funky looking fish next year. Just imagine the grillz on those Walleye, all ate up and stuff.

[perchtrapper]

good article Thanks for sharing

[315stickbow]

Good read

[chummer16]

In Wisconsin they were cutting large holes in the ice. Northern pike and crappies would swim up and just sit there. Kinda of a last gasp situation. They were netting the crappies and shooting the northerns with a bow.  They said all the bass and sunnies in the lake were probably already dead. 

[filetandrelease]

goofy is more like it , maybe I'll just wait for the easy bite 

[bcons]

http://dnr.wi.gov/wnrmag/2009/12/ice.htm

Coach that raises the next questions though.  If really low O2

1st    Since pans are much more susceptible to low O2 why are they still being caught in ok numbers?
2nd   Why are the dink perch in much larger schools consuming more of the available O2 in shallower water still active & normal?
3rd    Why aren't the fish hanging out near creek mouths as mentioned? I fished one recently where the ice will be gone within a week maybe 2
4th    lakes in colder climates ie upper Midwest & Canada are covered much longer, how do there fish continue?

This report says any even small ponds deeper than 25' should be ok.

https://www.sdstate.edu/nrm/outreach/pond/upload/Winter-Oxygen-and-Your-Fish-Sep-Oct-2006.pdf

While O2 levels may play a role, there's got to be more to it than that

[Takes2Long]

Hey fellas, I hate to barge in like this. I was just wondering if Oneida still has safe ice to fish and where I'm likely to find some perch and pike. I was thinking off accessing off Bartell rd. in Brewerton since I live in Mattydale now. I would be taking a friend of mine who's never ice fished so it would be nice if we caught a few and he had a good experience. Thanks in advance for any input.

[filetandrelease]

I'm not very smart but the last I knew plants produce Oxygen maybe thats why they are hitting there ,and i did fish a  creek  mouth just the other day lots of fish but it was froze over as most are still ,so its very cold, and there was a post of 34 degree water and thats cold

Hey fellas, I hate to barge in like this. I was just wondering if Oneida still has safe ice to fish and where I'm likely to find some perch and pike. I was thinking off accessing off Bartell rd. in Brewerton since I live in Mattydale now. I would be taking a friend of mine who's never ice fished so it would be nice if we caught a few and he had a good experience. Thanks in advance for any input.

ice is still fine just keep an eye out for gas pockets , far as the bite my last two trips have been awful

[Carcajou17]

http://dnr.wi.gov/wnrmag/2009/12/ice.htm

Very enlightening article.  Thanks.

[H.T.]

Nice perchies HT.

Hope the back feels better Freddie - there has to be some monster perch days between now and ice out. Of course, I have been saying that for the last couple of weeks.

My old fishing buddy came in from Minnesota for a couple of days of perchin. Going to try some spots this afternoon and then do an all day blitz tomorrow. Hope we can find a few that will bite.

i was messing around with my phone. getting tired of working for 50 perch that only fill a bucket half way for the most part. got some good ones but 400 dinks to weed thru

[bcons]

I'm thinking that the snow melts and small runoff water that we had may have warmed that shallower water. The little runoff we did get, didn't reach the deeper water. That water is very cold for this time of the year. We should of had a decent melt with a very good runoff by now. It seems as though, the runoff would generate some better oxygen levels too. We're not having the typical ice season we have had for the past few years.

I just like to look at all angles.  Still while it may play a part, don't think it's all O2.

Found an interesting piece that talks about the history of water temps, ice in & out, O2 levels ect. going back before the turn of the last century.

First Old timers talk about the Haydays of Oneida when sacks full of fish were pulled off with just plain old hand gear. Well turns out Oneida averaged nearly twice the ice we have this year back in the 70's
Also O2 levels so bad in the 50's-70 there were fishkills in the summer.  The bad algae blooms caused it.

Then it nearly wiped out the wigglers.  As it turns out Wigglers are the least tolerant of low O2 in the lake.  Which raises the next question.  Snagger said on camera he saw tons of them swimming by.

  http://www.cnyrpdb.org/oneidalake/pdf/SOLWFinal/ch2-2.pdf

[Chowdaire]

If the wigglers are raising up into the water column it kinda fits the low O2 theory too, no?

Leaving the mud and braving the perch schools to search for O2.

[filetandrelease]

If the wigglers are raising up into the water column it kinda fits the low O2 theory too, no?

Leaving the mud and braving the perch schools to search for O2.

that's a reasonable answer, maybe that's why I have drilled shrimp out of holes in 28 fow more than once this past month, 

[filetandrelease]

 well according to this they shouldn't be leaving the bottom yet, hence the name mayfly

http://ccs.infospace.com/ClickHandler.ashx?ld=20140317&app=1&c=zoo.gpde.19&s=zoosem&euip=54.236.109.23&pvaid=8d80e06b919b4ca6bde95131e578285a&fct.uid=685971781d4e4554bc7036f4cd350f2e&en=nR7QefvZLJv%2bWKEkpgEzJC4%2fcoz0Z70NAw5E%2bOhGwP6VDgMRCNYn2A%3d%3d&du=http%3a%2f%2fbiofreshblog.com%2f2011%2f05%2f16%2fthe-mayflys-lifecycle-a-fascinating-fleeting-story%2f&ru=http%3a%2f%2fbiofreshblog.com%2f2011%2f05%2f16%2fthe-mayflys-lifecycle-a-fascinating-fleeting-story%2f&ap=2&coi=239138&cop=main-title&npp=2&p=0&pp=0&ep=1&mid=9&hash=79E028485EA5B68ED0DFD88D0F9DA9CE

[bcons]

Hmmmmm all this topic has done is keep me thinking fishing while at work! 

What about being over laden with eggs or milt?
I mean they've been carrying it around for awhile with no cues to move to the spawn yet
While I know some say they spawn under the ice, which I know can happen fish are also programmed not to spawn until the water reaches a certain temp.  Basically the minimum temp it can be for the fry to survive. For perch that's low 40's.  The water temp can get there before ice out but certainly nowhere near that yet.

[pooch2543]

You guys are killing me, I'm just a Red Neck Southern Boy!!!!! To much educational information that I'm am not understanding!!!!!!! Give me some dynamite, I'll catch-em.

[MBrown4]

Anyone find one that isn't busted up? Are they actually mayflies or stoneflies? One of the ones I saw had coloration and size of a lake stone.

[coachwarner]

Coach that raises the next questions though.  If really low O2

1st    Since pans are much more susceptible to low O2 why are they still being caught in ok numbers?
2nd   Why are the dink perch in much larger schools consuming more of the available O2 in shallower water still active & normal?
3rd    Why aren't the fish hanging out near creek mouths as mentioned? I fished one recently where the ice will be gone within a week maybe 2
4th    lakes in colder climates ie upper Midwest & Canada are covered much longer, how do there fish continue?

This report says any even small ponds deeper than 25' should be ok.

https://www.sdstate.edu/nrm/outreach/pond/upload/Winter-Oxygen-and-Your-Fish-Sep-Oct-2006.pdf

While O2 levels may play a role, there's got to be more to it than that

Nope!! just squirt a little of this on your lures its like dropping a mini oxygen tank down to them! 

[bcons]

Amazing all this time goes into trying to figure out how to catch fish that are lucky to break a pound and 12" long.
Years like this they frustrate me more than walleye.

[315stickbow]

The lake is gorgeous. Sun is shining. No wind. Easy walking. Lets hope the fish are biting. 

[mrm57]

I just like to look at all angles.  Still while it may play a part, don't think it's all O2.

Found an interesting piece that talks about the history of water temps, ice in & out, O2 levels ect. going back before the turn of the last century.

First Old timers talk about the Haydays of Oneida when sacks full of fish were pulled off with just plain old hand gear. Well turns out Oneida averaged nearly twice the ice we have this year back in the 70's
Also O2 levels so bad in the 50's-70 there were fishkills in the summer.  The bad algae blooms caused it.

Then it nearly wiped out the wigglers.  As it turns out Wigglers are the least tolerant of low O2 in the lake.  Which raises the next question.  Snagger said on camera he saw tons of them swimming by.

  http://www.cnyrpdb.org/oneidalake/pdf/SOLWFinal/ch2-2.pdf

i think you're absolutely right. it's not just oxygen level.unless the perch somehow morphed into a weaker tolerance to the cold water and lower 02 levels over many yrs. of milder winters. we use to slaughter the jumbos back in the mid/late 70's. winters just as harsh and ice just as thick as now or even worse.and it just kept getting better and better as the season moved on.just used cheap jigging rods and wind milled them up. one after another all day long.driving down rt.49 you would see a half dozen places with "WE BUY PERCH" signs out front. fished on a 'good friday' holiday in april one yr.and we would never jig more than a foot off the bottom. usually the bottom 6 inches. never used minnows, just small jigs and spikes or mousies.the perch would be puking up the shrimp.so if it's a oxygen thing, then lake has changed or the perch have changed since then. i also have had the same reults as most everyone else the past couple weeks. mark lots and catch few.