Why does FWP only stock fish in lakes?

[flatgo]

FWP must have rule that they only stock fish in lakes and i can't figure out why? there are lots of lakes in this state that would benefit from fish being stocked in upstream tributaries.  especially trout and salmon species that prefer running water to spawn.  it's always baffled me that sustainable spawning populations are not promoted this way, and less money would be spent on hatcheries every year.  i would just like to know if anyone knows FWP's logic if any on this.

[Wenger]

Rivers have been proven to be best managed through natural carrying capacity. Our river trout populations are far healthier now than when we were stocking them, and at no cost. 

Plus we have the threat of introducing disease such as whirling disease  again as hatchery trout being crowded into concrete runs are very susceptible to pathogens. Currently they only stock in lakes where natural reproduction is not possible, and are trending toward natives such as cutts. Private ponds have to have escape proof outlets and are not supposed to provide upstream spawning areas, except as I understand when native cutts are stocked.

[flatgo]

seems like a weak excuse when you look at lakes like canyon ferry.  stocked trout from the lake could easily spread whirling disease downstream, and FWP spends more money then i want to know stocking trout in that lake instead of stocking in the upstream river where there is potential for natural spawning.  I understand in rivers where there is not a downstream lake, but where there is it doesn't make any sense to me.

[fridayfish]

i think wenger explains it well. wild trout are better than stocked. furthermore don't want to risk threatening native trout with implants through interbreeding and competition.

[Wenger]

There is certainly a contradiction below Holter and Bighorn afterbay concerning unintentional stocking of rainbows.  If the dudes below these dams do not realize they are catching stockers along with wild fish that's Ok, but FWP needs to be honest about this. The guides all know the truth.

But we have not been stocking rivers (except in cases like the Laurel cutty stocking and west slope reintroductions) since the 60s and our rivers have proven to manage themselves in terms of carrying capacity and spawning rates ever since, making stocking redundant.  In low water years trout reduce their own numbers to fit the habitat, in high waters years the numbers increase to fit the habitat and food availability. All of our major rivers are healthy and filled with trout, and many other states have followed suit. This is perhaps one of the most successful changes in river management.   I applaud them on this for sure. Wild fish from a balanced ecosystem are always better than finless wonders.  That is what the CF  deal is all about, self sustaining populations of healthy warm water game fish with stocking of bows which lots of folks like to catch. 

[lspower]

How many of the 250k stockers they dump right above Holter make it through the dam?

[Mtwolfer]

Alot of them go over the dam! thats when the Walleye bite is the best! Ive caught a gazillion trout and rarely is one "wild" . FWP does stock other areas,some ponds, I'd like to see more crappie, sunfish ,perch stocked myself, some big lakes out in area 7 have nothing in them, why not catfish or bullhead or perch???

[flatgo]

seems to make sense for most rivers, and good to know reason behind it.  it seems like a good policy for river fish, however I think this policy is a little to one size fits all when you look at certain species of fish.  Kokanee salmon for example would benefit from being stocked in rivers upstream of lakes where they could naturally spawn.  i think it would be good if fwp tried to get more naturally spawning populations going rather than dumping money into stocked fish every year.

[Wenger]

Your idea about kokes is interesting. Are there any natural spawning kokes in western MT now? Only have caught a few in Newlan myself.

[lundin-loading]

Your idea about kokes is interesting. Are there any natural spawning kokes in western MT now? Only have caught a few in Newlan myself.

Georgetown

[flatgo]

Yes there are lakes in NW Montana.  Bitterroot and Ashley are the two biggest ones where they can spawn naturally in the lake not a river system because the lake levels do not fluctuate and there are a minimal number of predator fish.  koocanusa they spawn in tributaries like graves creek since the water level fluctuates.  This really peaks my interest in stocking kokes in rivers for lakes like canyon ferry where i believe if tributaries with potential spawning habit were found they may have a chance of flourishing in the lake.  also not to go down a complete rabbit hole, but i believe you could potentially bring back the salmon population in flathead lake if you planted them in tributaries of the flathead river like McDonald creek where they were originally stocked.  stocking was a mute point in flathead lake when they tried to supplement the population because they dumped smolt in a predator rich environment and any salmon that survived returned to spawn on the shore where their eggs were left high and dry when the water level dropped.  not saying it could actually be done, but would be interesting to try.  would be cool to see some new ideas tried at least.

[Wenger]

Very cool. Thanks.

[RuralMT]

What would the process entail?  I know Native-American tribes in the Pacific Northwest helped salmon colonize other rivers by transplanting the fertilized eggs, but I haven't read the details on how they managed the feat.  How would one keep the eggs from washing away in the current, getting covered in silt, etc.?

[flatgo]

I might be wrong but believe if you introduce the young smolt in the stream they will spawn at the point they were introduced at.

[RuralMT]

Makes sense.  Seems like it would be even cheaper if you could find a solution involving eggs...wouldn't require feeding them/housing them even to the smolt stage.  But you're right...simply dumping the smaller fish in should work.  My most experienced fisher-friends have all mentioned fishing various boat ramps in the spring, as that's the easiest place to off-load a planting.  According to them the fish return during the spawn. 

[Quantoson]

My most experienced fisher-friends have all mentioned fishing various boat ramps in the spring, as that's the easiest place to off-load a planting.  According to them the fish return during the spawn.

Notes taken.  Never thought of that.  Thanks!

[RKP]

I like the way you guys are thinking. Wenger with the idea of stoking Cisco in CF and Flatgo with stocking Kokanee in tributary's. developing more sustainable plans to provide sport opportunity in out the box ways is the only way we will ever truly maximize the potential of our lakes. The more sport fish that can self sustain the more money FWP will have to work on native fish and habitat issues.

[Wenger]

Makes sense.  Seems like it would be even cheaper if you could find a solution involving eggs...wouldn't require feeding them/housing them even to the smolt stage.  But you're right...simply dumping the smaller fish in should work.  My most experienced fisher-friends have all mentioned fishing various boat ramps in the spring, as that's the easiest place to off-load a planting.  According to them the fish return during the spawn.

The Ft Peck chinook salmon also return to the boat ramps, especially in Duck Creek where they get snagged before dying off.

[Quantoson]

I didn't get even one this year.  Spent 2 days trying.

[Wenger]

Been tough for two years now. We caught five in open water last summer.

[RuralMT]

Kokanee salmon for example would benefit from being stocked in rivers upstream of lakes where they could naturally spawn.

It would have other benefits as well.  There are quite a few giant bull trout that have figured out that they can lurk near large schools of spawning kokanee and vacuum up the eggs, and I suspect the fry upon hatching as well.  It's fun watching them during snagging season on the Tobacco...they seem to enjoy and profit from their easy meal.

[RuralMT]

Notes taken.  Never thought of that.  Thanks!

Happy to help!  I chase pike in the spring, so I can't verify how lucrative an idea it really is.  But as Wenger mentioned, the chinook on Fort Peck exhibit that behavior (again verified by the aforementioned fisher-friends of mine, just not at Duck Creek) so the trout ought to as well.  It was just a nugget of wisdom I tucked away and have yet to try.  Just make sure you're chasing a strain that spawns in the spring.  If I read this article correctly way back when, you'll be wasting your time in the spring if they stocked the Arlee strain! 

https://billingsgazette.com/outdoors/rainbow-bite-hot-at-helena-reservoirs/article_24221711-ce74-5cd5-89cb-87912577a84c.html

[MTviking]

"Why does FWP only stock fish in lakes?"


What else should they stock in lakes?  Turtles? Muskrats?



J/k... Couldn't resist.

[Wenger]

They used to stock beavers.