Fishing Lake Jean

[Byron/PA]

Please don't take any perch fron Jean, There's only 500,000,000,000,000,000,004 Left in there

Yea, and 499,000,000,000,000,000,856 are those prime 6" inch specimens that provide the superior genetics to produce more 6" inch specimens so people can talk about the huge numbers of perch and how it's good to keep one of the remaining 15 inchers so we do not pollute the lake with their genetics.............. .

 

And just for the record, I'm all in favor of keeping fish that are going to be eaten. But, the overall quality of perch has dropped in this particular lake and it's up to the fisherman to make the right dicision. I mean, how many of you can honestly tell me that you have had a day at Jean when you have caught a dozen or more perch that were all over an honest 12" within the past five years?

And all because someone asked about a good place to fish.................. ...............sorry

[Ski Hunter]

Yea, and 499,000,000,000,000,000,856 are those prime 6" inch specimens that provide the superior genetics to produce more 6" inch specimens so people can talk about the huge numbers of perch and how it's good to keep one of the remaining 15 inchers so we do not pollute the lake with their genetics.............. .

 

And just for the record, I'm all in favor of keeping fish that are going to be eaten. But, the overall quality of perch has dropped in this particular lake and it's up to the fisherman to make the right dicision. I mean, how many of you can honestly tell me that you have had a day at Jean when you have caught a dozen or more perch that were all over an honest 12" within the past five years?

And all because someone asked about a good place to fish.................. ...............sorry

That was exactly my point...and its nice to see it also being said by the guy who has probably put more time on this lake than everyone else on here combined over the past 5+ years 



I'm done on this thread...every body of water I fish has ice already so I'll be fishing instead of sitting on here arguing over something I obviously know nothing about anyway 

[ICE REBEL]

I love to fill my 3 deep freezers that i have in the basement. I catch and release them right in the freezers i love it ... I don't buy a license and go onto a lake for no reason. I really love to eat bass they are my fav.

[stormtrooper]

Yea, and 499,000,000,000,000,000,856 are those prime 6" inch specimens that provide the superior genetics to produce more 6" inch specimens so people can talk about the huge numbers of perch and how it's good to keep one of the remaining 15 inchers so we do not pollute the lake with their genetics.............. .

 

And just for the record, I'm all in favor of keeping fish that are going to be eaten. But, the overall quality of perch has dropped in this particular lake and it's up to the fisherman to make the right dicision. I mean, how many of you can honestly tell me that you have had a day at Jean when you have caught a dozen or more perch that were all over an honest 12" within the past five years?

And all because someone asked about a good place to fish.................. ...............sorry

  A dozen perch over 12" in one day. I think you would have a hard time doing that on any lake in PA.

[ICE REBEL]

That's the prob with this lake there are to many perch that's why they have no size.

[Rebelfisher]

That's the prob with this lake there are to many perch that's why they have no size.

same problem with the pickerel...AKA "SNOWSNAKES"

[digger953]

snot rockets  the other white meat
goood eatin just a little boney unless you grind them up
then no bones

[Gillaholic]

That's the prob with this lake there are to many perch that's why they have no size.

I'm glad to see someone has the insight to see what over population of perch can do to a lake. By not taking them out you are only hurting the fishery. I have seen this happen on many lakes & it is happening right now on Jean. I fished up there last spring & saw schools of thousands of them swimming along the shore line around spawning time. All of them were dinks. I am not trying to cause problems with this thread but too many perch & not enough food for them = dinks! There is no way you can fish a lake that size out of perch or gills! If conditions are right, the gills will spawn three times a year!

[Ski Hunter]

The problem is very few people would bother to keep dinks. They instead keep the prime spawning fish, that are also more than capable of chomping down on many of the YOY perch after the spawn and possibly keep those numbers in check a little more

[dkfry]

When the large fish spawn they keep the dinks out of the spawning area thus not allowing them a successful spawn. When you have large numbers of dinks spawning they create more dinks in a couple years and it snowballs. Selective harvest is good for the lake however taking a large portion of the larger fish out of the system leaving dinks to spawn produces more dinks and an overpopulation of dinks. The small lakes like we have here in PA can show the effects much more quickly than large lakes. Its rather simple, some just don't quite get it.

[Gillaholic]

"When the large fish spawn they keep the dinks out of the spawning area thus not allowing them a successful spawn"

With your way of thinking the large fish take over the whole lake & the dinks can't find a place to spawn?? C'mon!!!!

[Rebelfisher]

Couldnt of said it better myself!!!

[dkfry]

"When the large fish spawn they keep the dinks out of the spawning area thus not allowing them a successful spawn"

With your way of thinking the large fish take over the whole lake & the dinks can't find a place to spawn?? C'mon!!!!

The larger fish do keep a large portion of smaller fish from spawning in the prime areas. In nature the biggest and most dominant often are the ones that get to to spread their genes and they fight to do so. I've spent a lot of time watching panfish, bass and other species on spawning beds in two countries and the larger fish dominate the smaller fish on the beds. When another fish gets close they are chased off.

[scavengerj]

Those dinks came from some place. I'd imagine that if they were the spawn of large fish, then they have the potential and genes to be and produce large fish. How many thousands of eggs have those large fish laid over the years? If they don't have the right habitat and food, too much competition, only then do the fish stay small.

I agree the fish should definitely be thinned.

Wasn't there a big thread on IS last year about fish and genetics that talked about this same thing?

[dkfry]

Those dinks came from some place. I'd imagine that if they were the spawn of large fish, then they have the potential and genes to be and produce large fish. How many thousands of eggs have those large fish laid over the years? If they don't have the right habitat and food, too much competition, only then do the fish stay small.

I agree the fish should definitely be thinned.

Wasn't there a big thread on IS last year about fish and genetics that talked about this same thing?

Seems every year the same topic comes up a few times, nothing new.

You are correct those dinks are ultimately the child of some of the larger fish. I agree the herd needs thinning however removing the large fish and keeping the dinks in there is not the answer. Keep the smaller perch to eat and let most of the large ones go. The genes are only one part in the equation and in order for those fish to reach their potential size they need an adequate food source as you mentioned. When the population is too high food can run low and growth rates suffer as a result. Its the snowball effect as I mentioned earlier.

[scavengerj]

Yeppers!

Didn't they use to draw that lake down every couple of years before to control the perch population?

[dkfry]

Yeppers!

Didn't they use to draw that lake down every couple of years before to control the perch population?

They may have, I'm not sure its hard to keep track of all the lake draw downs on these little PA lakes. Seems they are always being drawn down for one reason or another.

[Byron/PA]

You are correct those dinks are ultimately the child of the larger fish

No, that is not always the case. And again, this has nothing to do with keeping some fish to eat.

Everyone presumes that a small fish, if it lives long enough and has food, will become a big fish. Study after study has shown that this simply is not true.

As with humans and other animals, genetics play a huge role in how large a fish grows. If two 5foot tall humans have a child, it is very unlikely that child will grow to be seven feet tall, regardless of how long it lives or how much it eats. The same is true with deer, perch and every other animal that I can think of at the moment.

When you have a lake that is full of genetically mature perch that measure 8", which is fairly common in many lakes, and they spawn; it is unlikely that their offspring will reach the 10" mark, regardless of how long they live or how much food is available.

Out of the mature 8" perch mentioned above, there is a possibility that for some unknown reason, a very small percentage might grow to decent size. And if that fish is left to spawn, it will in turn produce bigger perch.

When you release a mature 8/9" perch, you are not doing any favors for the gene pool. Of course, you have no way of knowing if that perch is fully mature or is still growing.
But, when you keep a 13 - 15" perch, you pretty much know that it is fully mature and of prime breeding stock, and you are hurting the gene pool.

There is a difference between a lake that is full of genetically inferior fish and a lake that is full of stunted fish. Stunting occurs when there are more of a species than there is food to support them, and there is a lack of predators to control their numbers. Lake Jean has a decent food base and there is no shortage of pickerel that prey on the perch.

If, somehow, you could take a lake like Jean and impose a slot size limit on perch, you'd have really good perch fishing in a couple years. Something along the lines of all perch between 12 and 15 inches must be released would protect the prime breeding stock and still allow anglers to keep eating size and trophy fish.  

And yes, I know that's a few moments of my life I'll never get back.....

[btechvft70]

well said byron I couldn't agree more

[ICE REBEL]

Very well said Byron. Everything you said there is 100% true

[pagunner]

had a prosperous day at lake jean three blue gills and 4 perch  three of the perch were jumbo size  cant wait to get up there again   

[JiggerMan]

No, that is not always the case. And again, this has nothing to do with keeping some fish to eat.

Everyone presumes that a small fish, if it lives long enough and has food, will become a big fish. Study after study has shown that this simply is not true.

As with humans and other animals, genetics play a huge role in how large a fish grows. If two 5foot tall humans have a child, it is very unlikely that child will grow to be seven feet tall, regardless of how long it lives or how much it eats. The same is true with deer, perch and every other animal that I can think of at the moment.

When you have a lake that is full of genetically mature perch that measure 8", which is fairly common in many lakes, and they spawn; it is unlikely that their offspring will reach the 10" mark, regardless of how long they live or how much food is available.

Out of the mature 8" perch mentioned above, there is a possibility that for some unknown reason, a very small percentage might grow to decent size. And if that fish is left to spawn, it will in turn produce bigger perch.

When you release a mature 8/9" perch, you are not doing any favors for the gene pool. Of course, you have no way of knowing if that perch is fully mature or is still growing.
But, when you keep a 13 - 15" perch, you pretty much know that it is fully mature and of prime breeding stock, and you are hurting the gene pool.

There is a difference between a lake that is full of genetically inferior fish and a lake that is full of stunted fish. Stunting occurs when there are more of a species than there is food to support them, and there is a lack of predators to control their numbers. Lake Jean has a decent food base and there is no shortage of pickerel that prey on the perch.

If, somehow, you could take a lake like Jean and impose a slot size limit on perch, you'd have really good perch fishing in a couple years. Something along the lines of all perch between 12 and 15 inches must be released would protect the prime breeding stock and still allow anglers to keep eating size and trophy fish. 

And yes, I know that's a few moments of my life I'll never get back.....

well said byron I agree about 95 % of what you said.  I am just not sure if the food source is there  to support all the different sizes of perch.  I have not seen many fat heads or other small fish besides young of the year fish for foraging.  I guess there is alot of buglife though. 

If you want to see a good picture of a nice catch of the sizes of perch that would be good eaters and thinners of the herd you can look at preacher mans days catch on the reports page for jean.  the two bigger ones  are bderline but overall good job done. 

I believe that all those fish would fit into the slot limit you were talking about.

   

[SuperX2Nut]

In the summer, we catch and see large numbers of golden shiners out of Jean.

One also has to remember that small perch eat many things we can't see with a naked eye.

[Ski Hunter]

Byron, I know you spend quite a bit of time up there, is there any wardens out checking for licenses and limits? I can't remember ever being checked up there 

Only reason I ask is because I do like the idea of a slot limit, but only if it'd actually be enforced. I know most of the park rangers seem to ignore me when i bring it to their attention guys are illegally fishing Kitchen Creek when I'm up their hiking 

[Locnar]

Imposing slot limits on a number of lakes in PA could be very good. Many lakes display stunting and this is mostly due to overpopulation of smaller fish and the lack of food to support them. This is compounded by fishermen keeping as many "keepers" as possible especially the largest best breeding stock. Genetics plays an important role, obviously the biggest are the best, but there is no way to tell as previously mentioned if a small perch will become big. Virtually all fish display indeterminate growth, meaning they will grow throughout their lives given proper forage, meaning there is no such thing as genetics controlling a maximum size, genetics plays a much bigger role in speed of growth as well as health. Potentially inferior perch stock will become big, but in their lifetime they will not become as big as better stock. I am currently studying this as my major as well as this having come from articles I have read by biologists. Angler C&R of the biggest fish as well as slot limits to ensure this happening are the two best tools to regulate stunting. Smaller perch taste better and have less toxins in their flesh anyway so keep the dinks let the big ones go in problem lakes 

[slabs]

But, when you keep a 13 - 15" perch, you pretty much know that it is fully mature and of prime breeding stock, and you are hurting the gene pool.

Do fishing tournaments encourage releasing prime breeding stork? just sayin'...

[slabs]

Do fishing tournaments encourage releasing prime breeding stock? just sayin'...

[Byron/PA]

Do fishing tournaments encourage releasing prime breeding stork? just sayin'...

Point well taken

[icefishing275]

well im going the tuesday after christmas with a friend. Hope to get into some of them perch you guys are talkin about. And some bluegills and crappie and pickerel would be good additions to the day . thanks for all the help!!!

[Byron/PA]

thanks for all the help!!!

Did anyone really help, or did we just hijack your post? Check your PM box.