OUR STATE PARKS AND FISHERIES IN THE GREAT STATE OF WYOMING

[Mooter]

Just a little whining

I was fishing Keyhole a few weeks back and was talking to a couple of fishermen about our fabulous State Parks.  I was informed that if your parking on the bank of the lake a $250 fine was in order.  The situation with parking on frozen ground has me a little confused.  I'm try to figure out the impact on the frozen shore that is created when a angler parks his truck on it. There were signs up saying driving only allowed on designated areas.  Is the state trying to protect the dirt that is normally under water (because they are not too keen on keeping water in our lakes)  Which brings up another point.  When is Wyoming going to pull their head out and figure out that walleye and trout can co-exist?  They are talking about raising the rate of our license fees because less licenses are being purchased.  Maybe they should focus on improving the fisheries so people are interested in fishing more.  The amount of revenue that is create from fishing and hunting is huge.  If the interest was boosted there would be increased revenue.  We pay every time we enter a state park and I am not seeing (visually) these moneys used to improve the park.  You know a fish cleaning station is a good addition to any boat launching facility.  I can count on one hand then number of fish cleaning stations that are in our state.  Don't get me wrong.  I like catching trout.  But they are not the most sought after game fish.  This "Big Sky" attitude is hurting our states fishing possibilities.  I propose stocking more varieties of fish in more reservoirs to diversify our resources.  Anyone else have any comments on this subject?

[LT]

Well Mooter, I'm gonna step out here and say something. The only frame of reference I have on the subject is Boysen. The law enforcement guys have never said anything about how we park and the facilities are kept up pretty well. I mean like, there's always TP in the potties and they're basically clean. I don't know of a fish-cleaning station anywhere on the lake though.
     Far as stocking goes, I know they stock according to what they feel the lake will support. For instance, splake are stocked in Louis Lake up on the loop road because that lake apparently produces a bazillion minnows and that's what splake feed on; putting lakers in there would be counter-productive because they would grow too large and when the minnows were gone, they'd wipe out the rainbows and brookies and you'd have a laker-lake only.
     Far as trout goes, I heard in the wind they were trying to make Boysen a trophy trout fishery...not surprising, I mean like I said, I've gotten to where I don't even keep the danged things...they taste too much like a sucker-minnow smells. I don't see why they would stop stocking wallys in BOysen, big and deep as that lake is, it could support even more species...just my thoughts, but I've also displayed my lack of knowledge of the other big reservoirs.
     One final thought, ling are native to and regulated over on this side, but somehow they've gotten into the GR drainage and are consuming not only the forage-base of the other fish, but the fish themselves, so they've upped the bounty to 25 and kill upon catching. By contrast, over here on our side of the range, the limit is still three.
                                                     LT 

[Mooter]

Maybe I sould be ling fishing down south

Do you know Mark McDonald?

[LT]

No, that name doesn't ring a bell.  I was kinda waiting fer sombody to ask me what a "splake" was    

[Mooter]

No, that name doesn't ring a bell.  I was kinda waiting fer sombody to ask me what a "splake" was   

Been there, caught that

[wyohookset]

No, that name doesn't ring a bell.  I was kinda waiting fer sombody to ask me what a "splake" was    

Hey ex-LT...isn't a splake a brookie/laker hybrid?  The only time I saw one was when I was in the West Laramie Fly Store and a guy walked in with a large one he had just caught at lake Hattie.  Nobody really knew for sure what it was, so we were thumbing through the store's fish identification books to try to determine what it was.  I think that fish held the state record for awhile, then it got surpassed by another splake taken from Hog Park.  Beautiful colored fish.

[LT]

Yeppers, exactly, but Mooter's right, I throw all mine back...no size to the ones I've caught..pretty fish though, it downsizes a laker to manageable size for a given lake. The bo's in Louis are larger, on the average, than the splake. 

[Icatchfish]

Mooter,
A couple of buddies and I are heading up to Keyhole on Sunday to spend some of our vacation time fishing for eyes. I have never been there before (I have just iced fished Glendo and Boysen) and you can pretty much drive and park wherever you like at those 2 lakes.
Being a Greenie from Co. I was wondering if it is posted where you can park or not.
Do not need a $250 fine. I do love the fisheries in Wyoming, a lot better than in Colorado.
If my wife would go for it, I would move up there. Any tips on where to catch walleyes and
crappie this weekend?

Thanks.
Icatchfish

[hammerhead]

Mooter
Wyoming State Parks manages select little chunks of ground that are very popular for recreation. Many of our state parks are on reservoirs and the land was bought and is still owned by U S Bureau of Reclamation. They bought the land to build their big water projects on and have no interest in provideing you and me with recreational opportuniies. If State Parks weren't there trying to maintain a little order in these popular popular places, Bureau of Rec. quite likely would have stuck up the "NO TRESPASSING" signs long ago.

Wyoming Game and Fish Department manages the fish and wildlife in our state. Do you really think we would have the wonderful hunting and fishing we enjoy if they weren't on the job? Our wildlife would have been blasted into nonexistance long ago and our fisheries besides being overfished would have been spoiled by guys who haveing a personal liking for this fish or that fish would be hauling them around to "stock" them as they see fit. There are guys who think that the carp is the greatest fish there ever was.

[Mooter]

Mooter
Wyoming State Parks manages select little chunks of ground that are very popular for recreation. Many of our state parks are on reservoirs and the land was bought and is still owned by U S Bureau of Reclamation. They bought the land to build their big water projects on and have no interest in provideing you and me with recreational opportuniies. If State Parks weren't there trying to maintain a little order in these popular popular places, Bureau of Rec. quite likely would have stuck up the "NO TRESPASSING" signs long ago.

Wyoming Game and Fish Department manages the fish and wildlife in our state. Do you really think we would have the wonderful hunting and fishing we enjoy if they weren't on the job? Our wildlife would have been blasted into nonexistance long ago and our fisheries besides being overfished would have been spoiled by guys who haveing a personal liking for this fish or that fish would be hauling them around to "stock" them as they see fit. There are guys who think that the carp is the greatest fish there ever was.

I'm not saying The Game and Fish  is not needed I'm saying they need to diversify their thinking on the trout fisheries.  For crying out loud I have to drive dang near halfway across the state to catch anything besides a trout.  Montana is a prime example of a department that knows trout can co-exist with other species.  I guess I could move but I love where I live

[hammerhead]

Yeah I used to have the same complaint years ago, trout fixation used to be really bad back in the stone ages. It's better now, they do plant other fish. The reason they do 90% trout, is that compared to other fish, trout are chiep and easy to grow, and the Wyo hatcheries are really good at it.

 If they want to do some other species, they usuallly trade a bunch of trout for whatever they want. Needless to say that is expensive, and so the idea is instead of planting on a put and take basis like they often do with trout, with these expensive species, they try to introduce them in places where they will be succesful in spawning and be self maintaining.

[hammerhead]

I think the Boysen walleye fishery is falling apart, too many years of low water from the drought. Doesn't De Smet have walleyes? Annual fishing licenses from our neighbor states aren't all that expensive. I remember that Montana has a small lake I think maybe on the Powder River. It's so far from any big population centers that it is kind of a sleeper. Supposed to be really hot. Then there are supposed to be priemier walleye lakes on the west side of S.Dak.

What I have trouble understanding is why folks get so caught up on a particular species. But to each his own I guess. Probably has to do some with the way a man gets his time off. My style has always been to learn to love whats near to home.

[Dorado]

Montana and Wyoming have very similar fisheries management philosophies.  Wyoming has mostly trout lakes because of its high elevation and cold water temperatures, which are well suited to trout, less so for other coolwater species like walleye and smallmouth bass.  Montana has a lot more lower elevation areas, especially in Eastern Montana that are more similar to the upper midwest than the Rocky Mountains, and coolwater fish like walleye, pike and smallmouth bass do well there.

In Flaming Gorge, smallmouth can take 15-20 years to reach 5lbs.  A rainbow trout can reach 5lbs in Flaming gorge in less than 5 years.
 
Also, Walleye and trout do not "coexist" without considerable predation from walleye on stocked trout.  WGFD spends a ton of $ to raise trout to over 12" before being stocked in Pathfinder and Seminoe because when they stock smaller fish they all are eaten!  When you figure out how many stocked rainbows it takes to feed a walleye to reach trophy size they can get pretty expensive.

Most of the people working for WGFD as fisheries biologists have post-graduate degrees and could be working for private companies making a hell of a lot more money.  They work in the jobs they do because they love the resource, and make managment decisions based on science. 

By the way I do not wrok for WGFD!

[POk3s]

Maybe I sould be ling fishing down south

Do you know Mark McDonald?

I know him very well....he is a sergeant at the Green River Police Department along with my father and his family and my family are very good friends. Kind of suprised me when his name popped up...lol. Did you need him for something?

[POk3s]

Mooter...i just texted mark to tell him that his name popped up on iceshanty and he told me the whole story about how you are his nephew....i was very confused when his name popped up on here...lol. WHEN ARE YOU COMING DOWN TO DO SOME ICE FISHING WITH US!

[Hellsangler]

POk3s , you been to the Gorge lately ? I may make the trip next weekend . I hear it is capped . 3" 2 weeks ago at swim beach around Lucerne .

[POk3s]

It's been capped for a while now up where the blacksfork and the gorge meet. That's where I usually fish...and there's a foot/ foot and a half up there. I haven't been in now for 3 (this might be 4) weeks in a row and it's killing me. First week I missed my parents went to Wendover over the weekend (i'm only 15 so I can't drive out there by myslef). Second weekend my dad went to a SWAT thing (he is a sergeant at the GRPD)up in Idaho. Last week me and my dad were in a coyote hunting derby out of Rock Springs....and I'm leaving for a Wyoming game in about 5 minutes. I might be able to make it out tomorrow (sunday) and hopefully meat up with Dilli who's coming out to fish. If I go out I'll let you know how everything is...I don't really know much about lucerne as I don't usually fish over there. Definetely try to make a trip out and I can see what I can do to meet up with you.

O by the way...the fishing is starting to pick up for trout. My dad went out by himself on Monday (of course he goes when I have school) and caught 9 in about 4 hours.

PeACE

[POk3s]

Mooter ^^^

[Mooter]

hello

[roundhead]

I've live and fished the Wyoming waters for 20 years and enjoyed what the state has to offer, but would agree Wyoming seems to cater to the Trout fisherman and could care less for the Walleyes fisherman.

As you stated Montana and Wyoming are very similar in how they manage there fisheries.  I've fished a lake in Montana called Canyon Ferry, which was a great fisheries. The Montana G&F is trying to kill all the walleyes, with limits of 20 fish per day and no size limit. 

I have fished Utah, ND and SD and these states have some of the best facilities for fishermen, like fish cleaning stations.  Both Wyo and Mont should like some lessons learned from SD/ND on how to manage fisheries as they seem to do a great job. 

Roundhead.

[Cargo]

roundhead, I Totally Agree!

[doggbiter]

 Sorry Hammerhead.......but who the hell thinks carp are great??

 I shoot hundreds each summer with my bow and arrow, it is a blast!!

 But I have yet to meet a guy who thinks carp are great.   My main incentive to shoot them (besides fun) is that a fishery gets so over-ran with them!      

 No-one could convince me that an over abundance of carp, in any fishery is a good thing!

[raven]

 

[hammerhead]

If you see what happens to a lake after carp have been removed you know what a horrible influence they are on the habitat. All other critter populations from fish to waterfowl just explode when the carp are gone or even reduced significantly. Unfortunately almost all big waters in the lower 48 are spoiled by carp, so we don't realize how good it could be without them.

That said, there are fishermen who think they are the greatest thing since Hershy candybars. I blundered into a site on the net once that was all about carp fishing. They loved the fish and were careful to not injure them when they relaesed them, only keeping an occasional one to eat. I think the website was mostly British.

My point was some folks seem to think they know better how to manage fisheries than the pros we hire, that is Wyoming G&F. Can you imagine what bad things could happen if people decided they knew better how our fisheries should be managed.

[doggbiter]

[quote author=hammerhead If you see what happens to a lake after carp have been removed you know what a horrible influence they are on the habitat.  agreed

 They loved the fish and were careful to not injure them when they relaesed them, only keeping an occasional one to eat. I think the website was mostly British.

 I am very careful to not harm them after I yank my arrow back through them, and yes I release all of them!

[hammerhead]

Actually those old hogs are a lot of fun on a hook and line, and if you do a little chumming with something like macaroni, you can have some pretty fast action. Not too careful about releasing them though. I used to just toss them up in the weeds, but after finding favorite fishing holes stinking so bad from dead carp somebody else gave that treatment, I don't do that anymore. What I do now is give them a definate fatal wound and then release them. I'm not sure that is the best solution either. The best solution to the carp carcass problem was when my fishin buddy's dad had hogs, so we hauled them to his house. After they got used to eating them they almost said thank you whenever we tossed them some.

[4cator]

Oh contrere (sp)  There are indeed those who love carp. My grandmother loved to catch and cook them. Theres a trick to cooking them though.  You must fillet them and skin them. Then carefully trim out the red meat that usually lives along their lateral line. Thats the stuff that gives them a nasty taste.  They certainly are not walleye, but then again they don't taste like trout either.  Consequently Suckers are edible also. Oh, but back to the carp. We hate them here in the states, but they were imported from england at the turn of the century as a food fish! Imagine that   I will be a fence rider on the subject of trout. I certainly agree with most on the forum, that walleyes are a better fish to have in our reservoirs. That being said, Most out of staters come here to catch trout. Most other states have walleyes anyhow and they can catch them there. It's like myself heading to lake powell whenever I get the chance. I like striper and bass fishing. I realize there is a little bit of bass fishing here. It's certainly not lake powell.  I spend a good amount of money going to Utah to catch those fish. Wyoming G&F is hoping for the same thing here. Us locals want to catch walleyes and tourists want to catch trout. I would like to see more lakes stocked with walleyes, but doing so may very well ruin the fishery. I am betting that say in a few years, if the walleyes and ling have decimated the fishery in Flaming gorge. We will all be crying about it. The problem is: I bet that Wyoming natives were the ones who stocked both of these fish in the green river drainage.  I agree with most that Boysen ( my usual haunt ) is going to be poor fishing for the next few years. ( Walleyes that is ) I am positive that we have lost a couple year class of fish. It didn't get fished out, they just never spawned.The low water and other scenarios didn't allow for a good spawn, or possibly dropping water levels during the spawn killed the roe.  It's not a new problem, as I have read that it happens back east to great walleye fisheries. They are slow for a couple of years then come back with a vengence. I hope that happens in Boysen. Until then I shall destroy the crappie and perch. 

[LT]

Cator ...Wow! You make a great case for everything you said. I hit Boysen the other day at Tough Creek and never graphed a fish, looked in depths ranging from 12-45 ft, not a FISH!
    Well, almost everything you siad...a slab of sucker meat slipped into our trout fish-fry one night and I smelled it before it hit the table. Yow! 
                                                   Theeee-ex-Lteeeeee

[Ocean Eyes]

Let's try the "survival of the fittest rule".  We should plant walleyes,perch,browns, rainbows, pike, musky,  bass and etc in every lake and see what happens!  What do you think??

[LT]

Ya forgot ling buddy!