PFAS in freshwater fish

[deerefishyfishy]

Interesting article about the levels of PFAS "forever chemicals" in freshwater fish. Kinda scary...

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pfas-forever-chemicals-one-fish-us-lakes-rivers-month-contaminated-water/?dc_data=4165335_samsung-browser-us&utm_source=taboola&utm_medium=taboola_news&jd=V1_7378628653421173535

[uncleshorty]

Yep, I saw that.  Because of dangerous pollotion there have been consumption limits and warnings about eating fresh water fish in PA & TX, where I live, for many years.  It's only gonna get worse.  I am a catch and release fisher for many reasons.  Gettin poisoned is just one of them...

[pmaloney86]

Prob scare tactics so they can start putting vaccines in our food and force the sheep to eat what they offer.

[HWeber]

Prob scare tactics so they can start putting vaccines in our food and force the sheep to eat what they offer.

I won't go quite that far but it seems telling when they push commercial over natural

[HWeber]

If you look at the evidence WE are the ones polluting our land, air and water.  If we don't change, we will perish and the human race will no longer exist.  Not sure how some of the folks on here feel about the Lord and the Bible, but I believe the bible tells us that there will be great starvation.  Not because of the lack of food but because the food will be inedible.  It also says that viruses will become plentiful and deadlier!  Hmmm, I believe I've heard that the Covid virus keeps mutating and that the flu virus is becoming deadlier.  Should I not be vaccinated, so that my immune system builds up to better fight off viruses?  I'll take my chances in getting vaxed, thank you very much.  Will it keep me from dying from a virus?  I do know this, I think I'll listen to the doctors and not the comspiracy theorists.

You never fail to entertain 

[bigstorm]

Im fairly sure that eating fish I catch once every 2 to 3 weeks will not be my downfall

[sploke]

Im fairly sure that eating fish I catch once every 2 to 3 weeks will not be my downfall

The quantities of alcohol I consume while fishing are far more detrimental to my health than eating the fish...I'll continue to take my chances.

[Scranton Joe]

Im fairly sure that eating fish I catch once every 2 to 3 weeks will not be my downfall

Yes. The bluegills will bring you down. 

Maybe even give you Covid.  lol

[HWeber]

  I eat fish once or twice a week myself and pretty much plan on doing so in the future.  If you or anyone else doesn't think that humans are causing irreparable damage to our environment, you don't have a clue and pretty much don't care.  I'm just glad there are still those of us out here that do!

That has nothing to do with your first comment. On with the nonsensical ramblings.

[DR.SPECKLER]

Oh boy i think the bag of pork rinds i ate earlier will kill me off quicker than eating a few bluegills.but and i am cringing at saying this but i agree with snitch and we as human destroy the planet.greed and polluting the lands.all other species take what only is needed and doesn't have a impact in the environment like we do.

[HWeber]

Revelations and the Wuhan flu definitely we're meaningful points to add to any fishing discussion.
The study had a couple goofy points as well, apparently this is a social justice issue as blacks consume more fish than whites and Latinos (From the study not my personal opinion)

[Salmonquest]

Don't confuse "nutrition value" with chemicals present. Eating a hot dog is better then a salad with arsenic dressing.

PFAS collect in high concentrations specifically in lakes. They are used deliberately because they aren't water soluble so they collect in the water system. They are "forever" chemicals and will accumulate in your system. This increases your "CHANCE or LIKELYHOOD" of medical issues.

That being said I eat my catch but probably a good idea to moderate.

[Ice_Fly_Guy]

  I eat fish once or twice a week myself and pretty much plan on doing so in the future.  If you or anyone else doesn't think that humans are causing irreparable damage to our environment, you don't have a clue and pretty much don't care.  I'm just glad there are still those of us out here that do!

I totally agree.  Those who don't are just in denial. Or there are those who say "I won't be around to deal with it". Hate that attitude.

[SirCranksalot]

here in Ont we have mercury in the relatively pristine waters flowing into L Huron. I understand that merc is still being washed out of  of rocks tyhat were flooded when dams were built for hydro power, navigation etc.

There is no such thing as 'pristine' water, unfortunately. Even Artic watersheds have been polluted by rainfall bearing contaminants from elsewhere.

[WARRIOR_ON_ICE]

I am a chemist by occupation, and I am embarrassed and saddened that PFAS were developed at all. More to the point, I am sickened by the attitudes of the management of chemical plants and manufacturing sites in general, that polluted the environment with no regard whatsoever to the effects of chemicals on the environment, wildlife health, and human health. Before there was the EPA conducting audits of chemical manufacturing sites, releases of toxic chemicals that ultimately end up in the water were not investigated or fined. Now that the EPA watches over the chemical industry so intensely, there are very few and maybe zero intentional chemical releases. The problem with PFAS and PCB is that they are so stable and don't naturally biodegrade to less harmful materials, so we all suffer the consequences of past indiscretions for thousands of years.

I won't stop eating all of the fish I catch. I eat an estimated 30 pounds of fish from Lake Champlain every year, and have never experienced any symptoms of mercury toxicity despite the mercury advisory for that lake. Do what you can to make the fish safer to eat: prepare skinless fillets, trim the belly flap from the fillet, and don't eat too many of the bigger fish. If you live an otherwise healthy lifestyle then eating a lot of fish from NY or other fresh water is probably not going to be that detrimental from the average lake.

[HWeber]

I am a chemist by occupation, and I am embarrassed and saddened that PFAS were developed at all. More to the point, I am sickened by the attitudes of the management of chemical plants and manufacturing sites in general, that polluted the environment with no regard whatsoever to the effects of chemicals on the environment, wildlife health, and human health. Before there was the EPA conducting audits of chemical manufacturing sites, releases of toxic chemicals that ultimately end up in the water were not investigated or fined. Now that the EPA watches over the chemical industry so intensely, there are very few and maybe zero intentional chemical releases. The problem with PFAS and PCB is that they are so stable and don't naturally biodegrade to less harmful materials, so we all suffer the consequences of past indiscretions for thousands of years.

I won't stop eating all of the fish I catch. I eat an estimated 30 pounds of fish from Lake Champlain every year, and have never experienced any symptoms of mercury toxicity despite the mercury advisory for that lake. Do what you can to make the fish safer to eat: prepare skinless fillets, trim the belly flap from the fillet, and don't eat too many of the bigger fish. If you live an otherwise healthy lifestyle then eating a lot of fish from NY or other fresh water is probably not going to be that detrimental from the average lake.

In your opinion are there any "safe" pfa's? Their use seems pretty widespread. From food wrappers to fire fighting chemicals
 https://www.usnews.com/news/us/articles/2022-06-01/pressure-growing-to-remove-pfas-from-fast-food-wrappers

[Salmonquest]

This is really good advice. Most harmful chemicals in. Fish are stored on the skin and fatty layers. Warrior’s advice about skinning and making your filets thinner by focusing on tail sections and the back. Younger fish typically have less contaminants of any kind and larger predator fish will almost always have more. Bluegills perch and crappie probably safest options.

[Scranton Joe]

This is really good advice. Most harmful chemicals in. Fish are stored on the skin and fatty layers. Warrior’s advice about skinning and making your filets thinner by focusing on tail sections and the back. Younger fish typically have less contaminants of any kind and larger predator fish will almost always have more. Bluegills perch and crappie probably safest options.

The study specifically  mentioned bass, carp, and perch as fish with PFA's.

No mention of bluegills.

Who is still eating carp?   And bass for that matter.

Bio accumulation of toxins will occur in fish higher up the food chain.

[mcully]

I am a chemist by occupation, and I am embarrassed and saddened that PFAS were developed at all. More to the point, I am sickened by the attitudes of the management of chemical plants and manufacturing sites in general, that polluted the environment with no regard whatsoever to the effects of chemicals on the environment, wildlife health, and human health. Before there was the EPA conducting audits of chemical manufacturing sites, releases of toxic chemicals that ultimately end up in the water were not investigated or fined. Now that the EPA watches over the chemical industry so intensely, there are very few and maybe zero intentional chemical releases. The problem with PFAS and PCB is that they are so stable and don't naturally biodegrade to less harmful materials, so we all suffer the consequences of past indiscretions for thousands of years.

I won't stop eating all of the fish I catch. I eat an estimated 30 pounds of fish from Lake Champlain every year, and have never experienced any symptoms of mercury toxicity despite the mercury advisory for that lake. Do what you can to make the fish safer to eat: prepare skinless fillets, trim the belly flap from the fillet, and don't eat too many of the bigger fish. If you live an otherwise healthy lifestyle then eating a lot of fish from NY or other fresh water is probably not going to be that detrimental from the average lake.

I've had this sent to me by multiple people and one question I have and admit have not looked into was how were the samples collected? Whole fish ground up with skin and guts included or skinless fillets? Species?  I'm betting entire fish similar to other sampling like mercury and PCBs. I wish they would give charts breaking down the sampling to show how the fish are typically used by people and the species sampled. Any water body tied to a wastewater treatment plant also have many medications used by everyone in the ecosystem on top of pollutants left from industry so lots to think about but for sure "We all get dead" Hondo 1953

[HWeber]

  Glad you find what I said was entertaining and nonsensical ramblings.  You shun the Dr's about covid, the scientist's chemicals in our food and apparently the Lord and his teachings and I'm entertaining?  I'm glad you think that you know more than all those I have mentioned.  It must be great living in your own little world.  I'm sure its kinda like sticking your head in the sand, like a flamingo on the cartoons.  And I'm entertaining!  Let's not do what happened last year.  People come on here to socialize and give their opinions.  If we are talking about fishing, I'll give "me" opinion.  If we are talking about pollution, I'll give "my" opinion.  And, just like I respect your opinion, you should respect mine! If you don't, I'll follow you around this site and make a dumb ars comment everytime you open your mouth!  So from now on, if you don't like "MY" opinion, please keep your mouth shut and move on!  I have the same right to make a comment here as you and everyone else, without ridicule!!!  And, I'll not let you or anyone else to continually harrass me.

Another typical snitch post, have you ever thought you may be the problem making assumptions about everyone else?

[sinneD]

Most of you seem to be away from the Great Lakes: we have been living with this kind of advisory since like the early 70's. It's just a fact of life we deal with. PFAS has been on the radar for ~5 years...  PCBS, Mercury, PFAS. It all adds up, but you know, 'science'.
For those who care-
https://www.health.state.mn.us/communities/environment/fish/docs/eatfishoften.pdf

Super-Sauce for those who care to read: https://www.ijc.org/sites/default/files/ID1540.pdf

Picture pages of the above for those of you who are generally challenged

[Scranton Joe]

https://www.ewg.org/interactive-maps/pfas_in_US_fish/map/

A map of lakes and waterways with PFA's


It looks like they tested bass and carp  from the Susquehanna  River, of all places
 

Click on the 3 green horizontal  bars in upper right hand corner for map.

[HWeber]

https://www.ewg.org/interactive-maps/pfas_in_US_fish/map/

A map of lakes and waterways with PFA's


It looks like they tested bass and carp  from the Susquehanna  River, of all places
 

Click on the 3 green horizontal  bars in upper right hand corner for map.

Thanks for the map. Hopefully the study prompts more detailed studies by state agencies. More species would definitely be beneficial, in my area bullheads seemed to be their choice. While bullhead can be tasty they're generally seen as not edible by many

[HWeber]

  Ok Flamingo!  Your right and I'm wrong, now lets move on!

I have moved on, some here are discussing pfa's in fish not religion and politics. You can continue with threats and name calling if you find that necessary

[WARRIOR_ON_ICE]

If you enjoy eating fish, continue to do so from your favorite fishing places, unless they are known to be among the worst polluted water in your area. Don't fish there. Sitting on your ass all day because you are not out there fishing is probably a bigger cause of cancer than eating the fish you will catch after exerting yourself to some degree while persuing the fish. Everyone will die from something 

[WARRIOR_ON_ICE]

I've had this sent to me by multiple people and one question I have and admit have not looked into was how were the samples collected? Whole fish ground up with skin and guts included or skinless fillets? Species?  I'm betting entire fish similar to other sampling like mercury and PCBs. I wish they would give charts breaking down the sampling to show how the fish are typically used by people and the species sampled. Any water body tied to a wastewater treatment plant also have many medications used by everyone in the ecosystem on top of pollutants left from industry so lots to think about but for sure "We all get dead" Hondo 1953

Great post mcully. I think a guy my age would serve as good case study for the effects of eating freshwater fish over a multi-decade period. I typically eat 20+ pounds of fish from NY waters every year for 40 years  and at 57 years old I am still getting great results from my physicals. I will continue to eat fish with abandon, there is a  much higher chance that I will die in a car accident on my way to my fishing spot than from toxins in the fish I eat 

[TheJigginJerk]

It seems like most of the water bodies on the map, at least WHERE I looked in New England are all major rivers. I’m assuming they all have sewer treatment plants that dump into them which caused most of the PFAS. It could also be from industrial waste. Has anyone seen any studies where lakes and ponds were tested? Are they safer? We’ve really screwed up the world where you can’t even eat wild fish and game anymore without health concerns. Maine even has an issue where deer contains PFAS.

[Krazykaiser]

Pfas is being found in high levels with smelt here in Michigan. Odd because its not a long lived fish.

https://www.mlive.com/news/2023/01/new-fish-advisories-warn-of-pfas-in-lake-michigan-and-huron-smelt.html

[kondan]

Revelations and the Wuhan flu definitely we're meaningful points to add to any fishing discussion.
The study had a couple goofy points as well, apparently this is a social justice issue as blacks consume more fish than whites and Latinos (From the study not my personal opinion)

Ouch, so much for discussing PFAs, you took the race cards out! I'm a little offended because I'm Chinese.

[Scranton Joe]

Ouch, so much for discussing PFAs, you took the race cards out! I'm a little offended because I'm Chinese.

The issue isn't  the pfa's or pollution.    We've known our waterways have been  polluted since the mid 1980's.  The issue is the bodies of water they sampled, the fish they sampled (carp?) , and the nationwide roll out of "commercial fish are safer than local freshwater fish.  It's so bad that one meal equals a month of drinking polluted water."

I'll  stick with local bluegills over Talapia any day.

https://globalseafoods.com/blogs/news/why-you-shouldnt-eat-tilapia