ice shantys on river

[firefighter]

I have an Idea. How about giving the local Boy Scouts a chance for some extra Cash?


This is the smartest post on here! But this wont work right andre ...... Even if you gave them $10000... Whats 10 grand in the big picture? I like it.!!!AWESOME IDEA MICHIANAFISHERMAN!

What organization would allow kids to tromp around on possibly unsafe ice and pick up all types of unknown trash and hazardous materials left behind by a bunch of slob fishermen that are fully capable of picking up after themselves. Just need one kid to get cut by broken glass, recieve a needle stick injury, fall through the ice, etc... Not a good idea IMO

FF

[KIWICO]

It IS a good idea.  Just the money has to come from somewhere, and they could change the shack moving day a few weeks earlier on the Red to give time and provide enough strength on the ice to ensure you can get trucks on and off the ice to haul any crap away.  But yeah, it wouldn't necessarily be kids.... likely contracted out instead. The permitting system sounds ok, but it's a whole new program. Our provincial officials love prohibiting this and that (because it's the easy way out), but new programs take work, thought, and effort..... and lots of it.  I'd be in favour the money coming from fishing licences.  It's relatively cheap to buy one, another $0.50- $1.00 more per licence won't cause a province wide revolt.  Then the money can be allocated towards the purpose of cleaning up the Red and any other problem spots in the province, if any.  It's not perfect, but it's an idea.

Now it's apparent that Andre has a raging boner to wipe all permanent shacks off the face of the planet, but he is one man.... one old bitter man with his mind made up that permanent shacks are criminal magnets, and no amount of logic will ever change that.  He's seen too much of a negative thing for too many years, now he's too jaded to think outside of the box that he's in.  I wonder what his peers, feel about the issue.  Of course i fully expect him to come back and say they feel the same, but I don't buy it.

1000000000% agree

[maw31]

What organization would allow kids to tromp around on possibly unsafe ice and pick up all types of unknown trash and hazardous materials left behind by a bunch of slob fishermen that are fully capable of picking up after themselves. Just need one kid to get cut by broken glass, recieve a needle stick injury, fall through the ice, etc... Not a good idea IMO

FF

you're right, thats all that needs to happen. If something did happen to a kid or kids, the person who approved this would get in so much trouble by the parents of those kids. just my opinion.

[firefighter]

A contract to pick up after people on the Red ? To be completely realistic picking up trash after fishermen will only cause the problem to grow exponentially. Imagine if all the icefishermen on the Red and surrounding region knew that a "janitor" was provided to clean up after them. The whole place would be treated like a giant movie theater...chuck in on the foor and let the paid staff clean up. Those that are habitual pigs will operate in the same manner. Those that most often pick up their trash would leave it behind as it would become a THEIR "right" as THEIR tax dollars are doing the job. Try throwing all your household garbage somewhere on the street infront of your residence and see if it gets picked up...Geez ...as contract outfits do pick up our houshold garbage

FF

[maw31]

A contract to pick up after people on the Red ? To be completely realistic picking up trash after fishermen will only cause the problem to grow exponentially. Imagine if all the icefishermen on the Red and surrounding region knew that a "janitor" was provided to clean up after them. The whole place would be treated like a giant movie theater...chuck in on the foor and let the paid staff clean up. Those that are habitual pigs will operate in the same manner. Those that most often pick up their trash would leave it behind as it would become a THEIR "right" as THEIR tax dollars are doing the job. Try throwing all your household garbage somewhere on the street infront of your residence and see if it gets picked up...Geez ...as contract outfits do pick up our houshold garbage

FF

good thing there are no janitors, or it would look even WORSE.

[hapyhukr]

 I am gonna upset the apple cart but true outdoorsmen /outdoorspeople would not treat the environment in this fashon, and unfortunatly the true outdoors person is gonna get tared with the same brush. Its part of life and we have to get past it. We have to solve this problem and we should embrace any measure taken by the NRO'S to assist in solving this problem ,be it not allowing any  permanent shacks on the river or closing the whole river to fishing during the winter.  We all know whos shack is beside us and what its main purpose is be it fishing or . We are blessed to have such a great fishery at our doorstep  however it could also be its biggest downfall.    

[firefighter]

good thing there are no janitors, or it would look even WORSE.

Yes but there ARE "janitors" that pick up the carnage on the Red each spring ! Manitoba Conservation is stuck with the logistical nightmare of clearing abandoned shanty's and trash from the ice. These are the educated people that are supposed to be out there protecting our valuble natural resources from the bad guys...stuck doing a job that even a garbage collection service would decilne... Capish!

FF    

[sled-in]

Banning hard sides won't HELP the problem?

Its not just the garbage that is the problem, its also the other illegal activity. If the guys who are out there to do more then fish don't have a shack to hang out in, do you really think they would put up a portable and do the same stuff?

I can see the Red as being a problem spot, its close to the city and easy to get to. Just looking at this forum I can see that there are many anglers who never fish beyond the river or maybe a real out there trip is to LW or LM. Yes litter bugs might travel farther to make a mess, but it is different to clean up garbage when it is in the middle of nowhere then beside a hardside.

[fishncamp]

Now it's apparent that Andre has a raging boner to wipe all permanent shacks off the face of the planet, but he is one man.... one old bitter man with his mind made up that permanent shacks are criminal magnets, and no amount of logic will ever change that.  He's seen too much of a negative thing for too many years, now he's too jaded to think outside of the box that he's in.

One man who has the gonads to bring this issue to the forefront and stand behind his convictions. I know for a fact that Andre has the respect of his peers and everyone who also see the abuses and have had enough. Perhaps you do not understand that the majority of anglers and most citizens who live in this community are bitter . Most are sick and tired of being labelled drunken pigs by the media because of the actions of others. The NRO see the abuses of wildlife and natural resources first hand along with the lack of support from the government and public. It is easy for those who are doing nothing about this issue to sit behind the keyboard and lob critism. I think Andre will likely ignore your "logic".

[KIWICO]

Thats all he wants and its a stupid idea plain and simple.

[maw31]

Yes but there ARE "janitors" that pick up the carnage on the Red each spring ! Manitoba Conservation is stuck with the logistical nightmare of clearing abandoned shanty's and trash from the ice. These are the educated people that are supposed to be out there protecting our valuble natural resources from the bad guys...stuck doing a job that even a garbage collection service would decilne... Capish!

FF    

I didn't say there were "janitors" that pick up the garbage on the river/lakes.....But if there was....i couldn't imagine what it would look like out there because everyone would depend on them.  right?

[HighlandGlen Guide]

its obvious in Andre's posts that this is not a new issue and its been talked about within the conservation office and probably higher up in the government for some time, im not necissarily for banning permies but i think what hes trying to get at is that it may be the only answer left, unfortunately.....mayb e when people cant fish so convieniently anymore they'll realize how they screwed it up themselves...or maybe not!!

[gatorhunter]

its obvious in Andre's posts that this is not a new issue and its been talked about within the conservation office and probably higher up in the government for some time, im not necissarily for banning permies but i think what hes trying to get at is that it may be the only answer left, unfortunately.....mayb e when people cant fish so convieniently anymore they'll realize how they screwed it up themselves...or maybe not!!

Very good post HG!

The only objectives that I have are to fix a problem.  However, this problem is huge and can not be fixed by what everyone keeps thinking are simple means.  Every suggestion carries some very difficult changes to the way that winter fishing activity on the Red River would occur.  I have not called down anyones' suggestions. Rather I have tried to explain that your suggestions so far, have already been thought of and discussed.  Some of them numerous times and at great length by the people who have to develop administrative, legislative and enforcable policies and laws.  I've tried to explain why these suggestions will not work or fail to make any significant positive difference in the problems.  The replies are that my ideas are stupid, take away rights, tunnel visioned, narrow minded, etc.  You can't deal with an issue for 6 years without thinking out side that box and opening up the issue for debate!   

Four years ago, I made a presentation to the executive of the Manitoba Wildlife Federation.  It was their belief that I was setting up anglers for another money grab by suggesting that a permit system was the way to go.  I think my posts over the years are pretty clear that I don't believe a permitting system would do what's needed to fix the problem yet the MWF was convinced that a permitting system was my recommendation.  So the representatives of the largest organized sporting group in Manitoba did not want a permitting system.

In the past 2 or 3 years, I've made this presentation to the Walleye Anglers Association of Manitoba, the Manitoba Bass Anglers, the Canadian Esox Association and the Seven Oaks Game and Fish Association.  Collectively or individually none of these organized groups or their individual members told me to pound sand or that I was out to lunch with my presentations or ideas.  They asked questions and I answered them as best as I could based on the experience of a person who has researched this issue more than anyone else in Manitoba.

Cleaning crews are an awesome idea.  All that's needed is someone to organize such a group, get funding and other resources and it can happen.  Robert Belanger (NRO) did not quit despite all the nay sayers!  He created Operation Clean Up by soliciting Government and Non-Government Organizations to develop a program that sets out garbage drums and picks up garbage along the banks of the Red River.  Who'll pick up the ball for the winter portion of this program should that be a viable option?

To shed more light on the infamous_steve question about where ice fishing shelter control would go.  Whether this goes somewhere else is not up to us.  We have 20% to 25% of all the angling that occurs in Manitoba in our District so I don't need to concern myself about what goes on in other areas.

[Fish Camp 24-7]

Hey Gator, is the possibility of people having to serve community hours or a group from a minimum security jail be involved after the shacks were removed to do a clean up?

[golden eyes]

is this not a site for fisherman and women.all i hear is whine whine and b***h.if you know that the shack next to you is a party shack or dumping more garbage onto the river system than your local city,IE the water and waste system in the glorious city we call Winnipeg pours more crap into this system (RAW STINKING SEWAGE)more times than i have brought home my limit from this river.why are all of you that are on this bandwagon not at city hall when this sort of ignorance happens.why are the NROS out on the river system at night looking for these party shacks?and dont tell me man power,if you can hold night time stings for wildlife poachers you sure as hell can drive down the river in those sleds that my tax dollars paid for.dont say that you do because i seen you(nros)twice driving down the river.DRIVING,not stop and checking.fees and lic,permi shacks are not the answer.its more presence of our already govt paid NROS.

[firefighter]

Hey Gator, is the possibility of people having to serve community hours or a group from a minimum security jail be involved after the shacks were removed to do a clean up?

Better yet, all the folks that fish the Red in the winter should plan and get together on a Saturday for a clean up. I'm sure the turnout will be massive!

FF

[gatorhunter]

Hey Gator, is the possibility of people having to serve community hours or a group from a minimum security jail be involved after the shacks were removed to do a clean up?

You'd have to ask the Justice officials!  We have nothing to do with prisoners at any level.  I do like the idea though!

[Fish Camp 24-7]

Better yet, all the folks that fish the Red in the winter should plan and get together on a Saturday for a clean up. I'm sure the turnout will be massive!

FF

Careful FF, People might not see the sarcasm in your suggestion . How about a shack deposit to place your shack on the river which is refundable on a monitored cleanup day at the end of season. You show up to help you get your deposit, if not then to bad! Would still have the same problem to organize it though

[firefighter]

Careful FF, People might not see the sarcasm in your suggestion . How about a shack deposit to place your shack on the river which is refundable on a monitored cleanup day at the end of season. You show up to help you get your deposit, if not then to bad! Would still have the same problem to organize it though

My reply is pure sarcasm! Infact if one was to poll a thousand Red River ice fishers and ask if they have ever left trash behind, I'm almost 100 percent sure not one would admit to leaving even a twist tie behind . Kudos to you 24-7 for bringing solutions to the table rather than the regular complaints and wise cracks 8)


FF

[HighlandGlen Guide]

even as good as an idea of giving a deposit it, it still takes man power to run, man power equals money to pay for someones wage, money in which the government would not allocate for that, and definately money that fisherman would not give up in order to run this.  maybe some but definately not most.

and just because you people havent been checked or seen nro's the day youve been fishing doesnt mean there not out there...im sure you dont fish everyday. ive been out quite a bit this year and have been checked 3 times and saw them out there twice more. figure out the ratio of fisherman to nro's, especially in the selkirk, lw district....it wouldnt be very high!!

Hey Andre, the other day that i saw you at Balsom, i heard you ask to see a guys hook, and he gave you what i thought was a funny answer....i just got bit off!!  how many times do you hear that answer   

[gatorhunter]

Hey Andre, the other day that i saw you at Balsom, i heard you ask to see a guys hook, and he gave you what i thought was a funny answer....i just got bit off!!  how many times do you hear that answer   

All 3 guys at the same time yesterday!   Every once in a while we find their line in their basin hole so we deal with the issue!  Sometimes ppl cut their hands trying to break braided line (one of my favourites).  Or break one but can't get to the other one.  Or break one but the others in the case or vehicle have barbed hooks on them.

Yesterday a guy tried to hide a 40 ouncer in his jacket.....ah...no!

Next time introduce yourself!  I like to talk fishing too!

[Fish Camp 24-7]

All 3 guys at the same time yesterday!   Every once in a while we find their line in their basin hole so we deal with the issue!  Sometimes ppl cut their hands trying to break braided line (one of my favourites).  Or break one but can't get to the other one.  Or break one but the others in the case or vehicle have barbed hooks on them.

Yesterday a guy tried to hide a 40 ouncer in his jacket.....ah...no!

Next time introduce yourself!  I like to talk fishing too!

Amazing how all three guys can get snagged up jigging through the ice or bit off by a jack at the same time. Those barbs must really produce more fish for some anglers. And the best part would be that if you do fine these idiots, they will curse and swear up and down about it as if its not there fault!