Preservation of Freshwater Trophy Fish

[Dbarz]

As a 25 year old who has been ice-fishing for 10+ years, I've always had a fear that during my lifetime there will be no more trophy sized fish available in large freshwater lakes in the New England area.  My worries are spurred from hearing stories from my father who grew up ice fishing (mainly for pike) in the Berkshires (Onota/Pontoosuc) and how accessible these large pike/tiger muskie used to be.  Sooner or later the word got out, social media/the internet became more accessible than ever and from what I hear it's never been the same.

They still pull out beasts once or twice a year (http://www.berkshireeagle.com/stories/onota-lake-yields-two-monster-pike-in-one-day,143628 or http://www.onthewater.com/angler-lands-31-pound-northern-pike-in-massachusetts/), but large fishing derbies and word of mouth did a real number on these fisheries.  I'm pretty sure the Lake that yielded a state record tiger muskie doesn't even have the species anymore (even though this might be more of a reproduction thing).

I guess the point of this post is to ask Maine community: whether your'e 12 years old or 80+ years, have you ever been afraid of over-fishing in your prized waters?  In an exaggerated pike example:  If a big derby yielded 20 fish all over 30lbs and people posted online about it, would you be afraid for what the ripple effect would be?  I'm curious to what you old timers think.

(I'm a CT raised, current MA resident that goes to Maine every year strictly to ice fish for trophy pike/browns.  In my years going we have never kept a fish for ourselves and this includes multiple Pike over 40".  This post is a result of me being bored at work and thinking if I'll be able continue my annual tradition into my retirement years.)

[RealBigReel]

Sounds like you need a new job

[Dbarz]

Sounds like you need a new job

Don't we all?

[gamefisher]

As a 25 year old who has been ice-fishing for 10+ years, I've always had a fear that during my lifetime there will be no more trophy sized fish available in large freshwater lakes in the New England area.  My worries are spurred from hearing stories from my father who grew up ice fishing (mainly for pike) in the Berkshires (Onota/Pontoosuc) and how accessible these large pike/tiger muskie used to be.  Sooner or later the word got out, social media/the internet became more accessible than ever and from what I hear it's never been the same.

They still pull out beasts once or twice a year (http://www.berkshireeagle.com/stories/onota-lake-yields-two-monster-pike-in-one-day,143628 or http://www.onthewater.com/angler-lands-31-pound-northern-pike-in-massachusetts/), but large fishing derbies and word of mouth did a real number on these fisheries.  I'm pretty sure the Lake that yielded a state record tiger muskie doesn't even have the species anymore (even though this might be more of a reproduction thing).

I guess the point of this post is to ask Maine community: whether your'e 12 years old or 80+ years, have you ever been afraid of over-fishing in your prized waters?  In an exaggerated pike example:  If a big derby yielded 20 fish all over 30lbs and people posted online about it, would you be afraid for what the ripple effect would be?  I'm curious to what you old timers think.

(I'm a CT raised, current MA resident that goes to Maine every year strictly to ice fish for trophy pike/browns.  In my years going we have never kept a fish for ourselves and this includes multiple Pike over 40".  This post is a result of me being bored at work and thinking if I'll be able continue my annual tradition into my retirement years.)

I really wouldn't worry too much about it, Maine biologist have encouraged us to harvest every pike, black crappie, etc. that we catch for decades and yet 40" pike and 15-16" crappie are still readily available.  Another factor, in all honesty, is there aren't really that many truly capable fishermen out there to "catch them out."

[mmaloney1983]

Tough question to ask. Depends what side of the social media buzz you are on I guess. I know that when someone catches a 25+ pike early on in the winter the local bait shops are not mad that word got out about catching big fish. So from an economic standpoint I guess those in the business would be happy. From a sportsman prospective it depends on what you consider trophy fish. Many ol'timers would rather catch salmon, brook trout, and white perch then pike. For many of us it is an invasive species that has devastated a lot of cold water fisheries that use to provide trophy fish of other species. The state of Maine IFW tells fisherman every year to kill and leave on the ice every single pike they catch - so I guess that goes to show where that species falls on the list of importance.

Unfortunately we cannot seem to have the best of both worlds. Dishonest sportsman continue to pollute trophy lakes with invasive species like Pike - if we could manage to keep these to certain ponds, well then maybe we would all be happy! You are never going to eliminate a derby or the buzz of catching huge fish. It is like shooting a 200lb deer in Maine. You may have been the only guy to hunt that land for 30 years but if word gets out you killed a patch worthy buck you'' be hunting with 100 of your best buddies next fall.

We need to leave trust in the IFW that they will regulate fishing based on the needs of the species. Unfortunately for those who want to protect "trophy pike" that is just not going to happen in Maine. They are going to continue to protect those species native to Maine.

And no we don't all need new jobs! Mines is great!
"

[Dags Bait Maine]

I'm not too worried about it. I feel that as long as we can retain the biodiversity in those communities and preserve the habitat, than we will always have the opportunity to change our practices and bring back a trophy fishery if the people want to.


-Dylan

[Dbarz]

Tough question to ask. Depends what side of the social media buzz you are on I guess. I know that when someone catches a 25+ pike early on in the winter the local bait shops are not mad that word got out about catching big fish. So from an economic standpoint I guess those in the business would be happy. From a sportsman prospective it depends on what you consider trophy fish. Many ol'timers would rather catch salmon, brook trout, and white perch then pike. For many of us it is an invasive species that has devastated a lot of cold water fisheries that use to provide trophy fish of other species. The state of Maine IFW tells fisherman every year to kill and leave on the ice every single pike they catch - so I guess that goes to show where that species falls on the list of importance.

Unfortunately we cannot seem to have the best of both worlds. Dishonest sportsman continue to pollute trophy lakes with invasive species like Pike - if we could manage to keep these to certain ponds, well then maybe we would all be happy! You are never going to eliminate a derby or the buzz of catching huge fish. It is like shooting a 200lb deer in Maine. You may have been the only guy to hunt that land for 30 years but if word gets out you killed a patch worthy buck you'' be hunting with 100 of your best buddies next fall.

We need to leave trust in the IFW that they will regulate fishing based on the needs of the species. Unfortunately for those who want to protect "trophy pike" that is just not going to happen in Maine. They are going to continue to protect those species native to Maine.

And no we don't all need new jobs! Mines is great!
"

Even as a "Millennial" I try to stay away from social media when it comes to fishing spots.  Having bait shops/locals word of mouth spread rumors of big fish always made things more interesting haha

And I agree that invasive species are probably a bigger concern than the human element.  I'm pretty sure college students introduced pike to Great Pond when they were trying to conduct a study on pickerel growth.  Pretty bad mix up since all the salmon are gone now.  A homeowner on the pond walked by and told us stories of how in the 80's he used to troll the and could see salmon jumping all the time.  It was truly sad to hear and can understand the hate of the fish that aren't supposed to be there. 

[walpy]

This is why I rarely catch anything when I go out on the ice!

Yeah - we'll go with this reason!

..... 

[Seamonkey84]

Maine as a destination for trophy pike and browns?!?  Compared to some of the other neighboring states I would not of thoughts so. For browns I’ve heard NY or CT having great brown trout fishing (although through fly fishing channels so idk about lakes and pond). When I think of large pikes in Maine, I actually cringe. I do have fun catching them as they are strong fighters, but in most places I won’t release them.

[Dbarz]

Maine as a destination for trophy pike and browns?!?  Compared to some of the other neighboring states I would not of thoughts so. For browns I’ve heard NY or CT having great brown trout fishing (although through fly fishing channels so idk about lakes and pond). When I think of large pikes in Maine, I actually cringe. I do have fun catching them as they are strong fighters, but in most places I won’t release them.

Anything is a trophy fish coming from central CT haha but we specifically target certain lakes and I didn't mean to overgeneralize.   

[9huskies]

KILL ALL PIKE!!!

[Wolley]

Tiger muskie are a sterile hybrid, so if you aren't seeing the numbers of those you need to look at the stocking lists.  Also people needing to throw them back, is especially true in that case.

[woodchip]

Species such as Perch, Pike . the reason they get smaller in size is too many are released  and not enough are kept  for  food  for the  fishermen and Eagles.  getting larger means more bait for the ones swimming .

[woodchip]

Fish like Hornpout grow so fast they will kill a bait pond and not leave enough Oxygen ,feed,  for   shiners,  Trout Species

[jacksmelt71]

up here in the fish river chain, we have tons of salmon but for some reason rarely get fish over 16in. anymore. the bios been playing with the slots sizes and bag limits to try and get more quality fish. even years when the smelt populations are great the salmon never seem to grow. they think it may be a parasite thats keeping them smaller. they seem to be almost starving in a lake full of smelt! long lake is the exception to this. no one can figure it out definitively. the togue that they stock don't have this issue and the few brookies left seem to fair well but the state not wanting to stock them is taking its toll on their numbers. competition from a booming y. perch population might also be impacting fish growth. we are infested with them like I've never seen in 30+ years of fishing up here! and theres no way of effectively reducing their numbers either. i suggested stocking more togue to predate on young perch but the smelt fishermen think the togue will eat all the smelt. we are dealing with issues unheard of 30 yrs ago so i think this has something to do with lack of trophy fish. deforestation is also hurting water quality and mudding up spawning areas which also isn't helping matters.

[woodchip]

Do you think all the excessive wood cutting could have possibly lowered the P H  enough to make the waters unhealthy for Smelt, Whitefish. We must have excess Phosphorous   causing small trout ponds to turn into clear dead ponds.

[Ohiocatfish]

Trophy fish stories get bigger and bigger the farther in the past you go.

[jacksmelt71]

Do you think all the excessive wood cutting could have possibly lowered the P H  enough to make the waters unhealthy for Smelt, Whitefish. We must have excess Phosphorous   causing small trout ponds to turn into clear dead ponds.

  i believe so but no one wants to go there as anytime logging practices are questioned, the big landowners threaten to gate their lands! irving is the worst one up here!

[woodchip]

If this in uncontrolled cutting keeps up in Northern Maine it will end up like, Quebec did a few years ago, or like what's happening in California right now. wish the Government had more foresight!!!

[Fatcat]

ive caught some nice fish in 50+ years fishing maine waters, ice and open waters. Ive usually fished the same spots and lakes. Ive noticed more fishermen over the years. just like anything else the  " good " fishermen or hunter get the most. . But in my opinion its the better/new, electronic equipment that contributes taking bigger fish or trophy fish more than over fishing.

[9huskies]

Do you think all the excessive wood cutting could have possibly lowered the P H  enough to make the waters unhealthy for Smelt, Whitefish. We must have excess Phosphorous   causing small trout ponds to turn into clear dead ponds.

I don't know about cutting affecting phosphorous levels but it does increase water temperatures. The brooks don't get as much shade so warmer water flows into the lakes from the inlets.

[jacksmelt71]

i think its a combination of  less shade and increased nutrient runoff. this could be counteracted easily by increasing the cutting buffer from a water source but like i said before, if you even suggest a change in forestry practices, landowners threaten to reduce or eliminate access to their land! very frustrating! imagine the difference a 500ft. buffer would make. this would reduce runoff and keep these waters from heating up as well as giving needed winter sanctuary to the animals that barely have any cover left.

[woodchip]

It was not the warmer water that have killed Whitefish and smelts!

[grub662]

It was not the warmer water that have killed Whitefish and smelts!

Well I haven't seen a dinosaur with a jig rod yet. Evolution man evolution.

[jacksmelt71]

It was not the warmer water that have killed Whitefish and smelts!

i think it was a combination of that and fishing pressure. whitefish grow very slow and have many predators. they are also very sensitive to pollution and temperature. if you catch one in the summer its dead. they don't survive being reeled thru the warmer upper levels. smelts aren't as sensitive but the live bait industry hits them hard.