IceShanty.com's Ice Fishing Community
Ice Fishing Tips -Check your local regulations! => Tipups => Topic started by: Hood on Feb 06, 2005, 10:22 AM
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I want to make a few of my own tipups but I do not know where to get some of the parts like the flag and trigger wire and the spools and such, does anyone know of a supply company for this stuff or if anyone sells kits/instructions?
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You can get almost everything you need at the home depo.And for the tubes for the trigger assembly I got some at a local craft shop.You can make red flags out of tailight repair tape. Just buy or borrow any ones tip up and copy away!
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www.FISH307.com carries all the parts for the heritage lakers if you are interested in making great traps. Sadly. the cost of the parts is higher then the completely assembled rigs. I think the only reason to do this is if you are like me and had a nice slab of Teak wood or some other exotic laying around to make high end Tips.
My finished home made ones now work as good as the real Heritage Lakers, will last a lifetime and look awesome.
Basically I just killed some time, played with my wood working machines, enjoyed the project and spent easily twice as much in making my own.
Have fun but if you decide to do it then check out the site because the parts are probably the best available and a tried and true mechanism.
Gary
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I want to make a few of my own tipups but I do not know where to get some of the parts like the flag and trigger wire and the spools and such, does anyone know of a supply company for this stuff or if anyone sells kits/instructions?
Look for some Tip-Up information in the following invention section:
http://www.iceshanty.com/ice_fishing/index.php?topic=17919.0
Also an extensive Tip-Up section at:
http://www.iceshanty.com/ice_fishing/index.php?board=30.0
Good luck,
-Reelcharacter
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If you check out the archived sections from previous posts, there may be more info there as well. I recall someone last year recommending using the metal strips from windshield wipers for the flag arm. (Damn, come to think of it, I just threw an old set of wipers away). :-\
These are the right width and length can be adjusted. Good strong springy metal for the flag arm.
-Reelcharacter
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::) Try Jack Traps site . They sell all the parts you may need.
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::) Try Jack Traps site . They sell all the parts you may need.
Could not find it with a quick Google search. Do you have a link to the site?
Thanks,
-Reelcharacter
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here's the link.. expensive stuff.. I'd go wth the local hardware store for most of this stuff..
http://www.jacktraps.com/
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here's the link.. expensive stuff.. I'd go wth the local hardware store for most of this stuff..
http://www.jacktraps.com/
Thanks.
Can at least use Jack's to make up the shopping list, before hitting the hardware store.
Half the fun is in the scrounging any way . . . :)
-Reelcharacter
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I think you will find, if you want good quality parts, the cost will be right up there.
Weather you go Jack Traps or Heritage Laker or any of the other quality makes you will not buy the parts for bargin basement prices.
For the total do it yourself bargin basement project I have seen guys use the spool the line comes on by drilling a hole and installing a screw as a trip triger. Some even add another screw on the out side as a winder. Most of these have been added to the inexpensive cross brace tip ups available for a few bucks in the local Wal MArt stores.
I seriously doubt anyone will be able to reproduce any tip up completely from scratch for less then they can be purchased for. I also believe the only good reason to do this yourself is to make a better trap and not to attempt to save money.
With cheep working tip ups sold for $2.99 each you can catch just as many fish as with Heritage Lakers or Jack Traps. Weather they work as smooth, look as nice or are as durable is where "do it yourself" should begin.
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Ok here is what I am useing on my traps I am creating right now. for the trip mechinism I am useing stainless steel tubing (you can get it from an auto parts store) 1/8" steel tig welding rod (local welding supply) slid inside with a very mild greese inside of the tube. the welding rod can be bent to make your trip. for the upper part that trips the flag I am basically copying the heritage laker setup useing 1/16" aluminum than for the flag I am useing 1/8" tig rod attached to a spring (available at home depot, 2 for under 3 bucks can be found in the door and window accesory area) to attach the rod to the spring just screw a wooden dowel into the spring about a half inch with a hole in the center smaller than the welding rod so you have to force it in and a little bit of glue and it is attached than do the same for the top of the trap just screw it through the center hole to the trap. (just like the laker) for the reel I am basically creating an exact copy of the jack traps 4" reel very easy to make. Of course I have most of the equiptment available to me through work but everything is available through the stores previously mentioned. Any questions feel free to ask.
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Transplant, Sounds like your traps should be pretty nice!
Now, for what I was trying to say, if you can get most of the materials for $ 0 and you have the wood that cost NOTHING and the time which is worthless then you can make great tip ups for very little useing the basics of the other great tip ups.
I did it and it appears you did it but the fact is; If I pay myself for the time and effort spent, buy the materials and add up the hours, I can buy them ready made much cheeper.
I know there are alot of us out here who like to "DIY" but the facts are that making a better trap is a labor of love that will never be less expensive unless we forget about paying the pipper!
My Teak Wood tip ups are fine examples of all the best ideas and materials available yet, I would have a very hard time selling them on ebay or to the general public for half of what they actually cost. I suspect yours are in the same catagory.
I guess what I was attempting to say and possibly did not get accross is that VICTOR made the mouse trap and many have attempted to make it better but none have succeeded.
We can get by with home made traps but you can't do it much cheeper then the manufacturers.
I do love the ones I made and I am sure yours are fine examples of ingenuity that will never get you rich but will always be loved.
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Transplant,
Tried to post a compliment, but it did not go through to this site the first time. The TipUps sound like they will rival the better engineered store bought types. How can you place a value on something made by hand? These sound like family heirlooms to be.
How about transplanting a picture or two to this topic. If you want to email them to me I will post them.
Thanks,
-Reelcharacter email: [email protected]
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as soon as I get my traps done (hopefully this week) I will definatly post a pic with detailed instructions as to what where how much and all that good stuff. I agree with the time issue but like I have said there is something to be said about useing a product that you have created.
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I would love to see the pics and am always impressed with the stuff we can come up with in our own work shops. I keep thinking back to a design I saw last year by RGFIXIT out of PVC pipe and some simple supplies he wipped together.
Some of us like to disign our own and others like to copy tried and true existing designs and maybee improve upon them but the fact is, as stated above, We did it ourselves and alot of love went into them.
I have seen lots of various home made traps out on the ice and one thing is for sure, the fanciest, most expensive tip up, rod or rig is no better at catching fish then the cheepest working models we make.
Keep playing and creating because if, for no other reason, it does your heart and spirit good and provides us all with some interesting ideas.
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I would love to see the pics and am always impressed with the stuff we can come up with in our own work shops. I keep thinking back to a design I saw last year by RGFIXIT out of PVC pipe and some simple supplies he wipped together.
Some of us like to disign our own and others like to copy tried and true existing designs and maybee improve upon them but the fact is, as stated above, We did it ourselves and alot of love went into them.
I have seen lots of various home made traps out on the ice and one thing is for sure, the fanciest, most expensive tip up, rod or rig is no better at catching fish then the cheepest working models we make.
Keep playing and creating because if, for no other reason, it does your heart and spirit good and provides us all with some interesting ideas.
Amen brother, and I totally agree with you cause the world of fishing is 40% having money and 60% inginuity. As I grew up my grandfather never bought a lure. never bought bait every part of fishing for him was bulding his own equiptment and finding his bait. The man still is a great fisherman and learning from him has been the greatest expierence in my life. My tackle box contains many of his homemade rigs and I use them all the time. I love it.
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OK "transplantfromMN", like your take on a custom trap design, not unlike what I am contemplating, collecting parts and getting ready to start building.
The question I have is how are you making the aluminum side plates for your Jack-trap spool copies? What are you using for the trip and hand reel pins (screws, or press fit)? I am looking for an easy way to cut a batch of the side plates myself.
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Ok TP from MN, you have peeked our interest and we are patiently awaiting the pics. Love to see the sh%# we members come up with but Jeeze, does it have to be like fishing! LOL
I should not be biching because on this slow poke dial up I could never post a pic with out getting dumped a half dozen times and getting more aggrivated then it is worth. The price I pay to live in the wild is sometimes more then I wish to pay but then I look in the back yard and see the trout rising in the stream and the deer and bear eating at the feeder and it all makes perfect sense.
All kidding aside and not preasuring you but get the darn pics up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
When you get it figured out I will gladly send pics of my inventions to see if you can get them on too.
I am a die hard Jiggerrigger from a way back and really do love seeing what we all come up with. Heck, if it was not for inventiveness I would find this thread boreing.
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OK "transplantfromMN", like your take on a custom trap design, not unlike what I am contemplating, collecting parts and getting ready to start building.
The question I have is how are you making the aluminum side plates for your Jack-trap spool copies? What are you using for the trip and hand reel pins (screws, or press fit)? I am looking for an easy way to cut a batch of the side plates myself.
I am cutting the side plates with a 4" hole saw out of 1/16" aluminum than welding aluminum tubeing to it for the reel pins and making another piece to weld to it. I know all dont have the ability to obtain a tig welder therefore I do believe that you could probably use like a countersink screw or something like that. just keep the inside smooth so your line will not get hung up on anything.
as for the pics I am soo trying to get these traps done and I do promise I will post pics. Just gotta give this guy some time. bear with me yall.
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OK TP MN, we will cut you a bit of slack but get with it and get them posted.
We could be fishing and having more luck ;D
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Ok guys here is a quick pic of my finally finished trap. I just completed this last night and have 4 more to make today. in this pic the Heritage laker is on the left and my Laker/Jack mix is on the right. I gotta get some batteries than I will take some close up pics of the trip mech and all that. I still have to stain the new trap so bear with me.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/chad_banks1/DSCF0043.jpg)
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Sweet job. how tall does the trap stand when the flag is up?
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Damn nice looking rig! That is pretty close to what I had in mind for my "improved traps". Like the height of the main support frame!
Why didn't you shoot the works and go for a longer flag rod? You could have shortened the trip mechanism and saved material that way, and still gotten even more flag height.
How about a close up of the reels? Did you use a spring-and-washer style drag, or just a friction nut?
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I didnt go longer on the flag due to the fact that all the springs that I found would not pull the flag up well and stand straight with too much weight. I just used a friction nut on my reels but I have to change the setup a little after this weekend as I have found some problems with the reels I made. hopefully soon I will get that issue but for now they work great. I am planning on trying to get a parts list togather along with pictures to explain how I came up with all the items on the traps.
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TP from MN, SWEET ;D
They do look very nice and I commend you on your efforts.
Now the Tweeking begins to get them just right!
I have a local hardware store that has a pull out tray full of springs that I might be able to find stronger ones for you so the flags work like they are pitching a tent ;D
I like the long verticle shafts but they do get tough to carry at times. Think the longer flag staff is a great idea if you can find the tougher springs. Height is Height and no matter how you get the flags up there, lighter is better IMHO.
I have seen many guys use the spools the line comes on for the reels and they work great but are not durable, cheap though.
Wish I could see them a bit clearer and hope you get the close ups posted one of these days. I happen to SUCK at photography so I can't fault you here in any way.
The best part of them is that you will get them working perfect and have top notch equipment with a life time guarantee!
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In all reality my flags do span pretty high I just looked at the pic and that soo doesnt do it justice. They span 21" from the top of the trap plus I am placing extra large flags on there for better view. So all in all not too bad.
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TP from MN, Sent you an Email with attachment. Hope you LYAO ;D
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Very nice Transplant, you have rewarded our patience.
(Now you have us hanging on in anticipation of the close-ups).
Way to keep us still in suspense!!!
Can't wait to hear when the first fish is caught on one.
-Reelcharacter
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One, I made 5 LOL. Right now I am really hoping that these will work out well being that they will be being used in a derby this weekend. I have more plans going in the mix right now like new reels and such as I am not extremly comfortable with the reel system taht I am useing. If you go to the jack traps website find the parts page and look at their 4" reel that is pretty much the same design I used but finding hardware like they are useing is damn near imposible therefore I have had to use some high strength glue to keep my reels togather to get me by till I can get my buddy to mill me out some nice new reels on the CNC machine. hopefully soon I will have some beautiful all aluminum reels that will never break. Gamealot that was a funny vid man I dont remember where I saw it before but it was great to see it again none the less. Thank you everyone on the comments on my traps.
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Awesome! Good luck with the news reels.
If you and your bud have success with the all-aluminum reels and can find the time to make some spares, let me know. If the price is reasonable, I'd be interested in buying 6 or 12 of them. Would save me the trouble of duplicating the jack style reels. I have too much experience already in rebuilding those, as I inherited five old (vintage mid-1980's) original style jack traps from my dad. He still lives in Maine, but since the Florida winter climate better suits him in his retirement, he doesn't ice fish anymore!
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Awesome! Good luck with the news reels.
If you and your bud have success with the all-aluminum reels and can find the time to make some spares, let me know. If the price is reasonable, I'd be interested in buying 6 or 12 of them. Would save me the trouble of duplicating the jack style reels. I have too much experience already in rebuilding those, as I inherited five old (vintage mid-1980's) original style jack traps from my dad. He still lives in Maine, but since the Florida winter climate better suits him in his retirement, he doesn't ice fish anymore!
You are fortunate he did not take the ice gear along with him to Florida. There were some die-hard ice fishermen here on the Shanty who last Spring talked about floating their TipUps with styrafoam on soft water. Suppose that would work for the die-hard Floridian as well . . . :)
-Reelcharacter
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Nice looking work there Bro, I must say Im cheatin a bit....Im usin mostly Jack Traps parts to build mine, the stuff is pricey like others have stated but it is top knotch. Mostly stainless.
It will cost more to home make a nice trap including our time and all but hey...when someone asks..we simply say.."Yeah I made em".
Wondering what ya used for wood and kinda measurments ya got out out of em. Mine will be in full Mahogany and the cross bases are a slight narrower than the uprights due to cost. If I didnt have the Mahogany lying around,Im not sure what I'd use. cross sections are 3/4x7/8 and the uprights are 1x3/4. I ordered a Jack trap to build off,and some parts to get started.
Heres a pic of my stage 1. I cut the strips and rounded the edges on a router table to smooth em out...then lightly sanded em...Not sure what Im goin to use for a finish...but I wont color em..the Mahogany should be a beautiful redish when done.
Good Luck and Flags Up to Ya.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/Titleist1964/P1010005.jpg)[/img]
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I'd probably try a satin polyurathane finish. Some of the newer finishes allow you to brush on several coats in a day. Gives me an idea for what to do with all that 5/4 mahogony stock left from the last deck job. If only I wasn't fishing in my spare time.........Good luckwith them!
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Hey Van...thas where this stuff came from...a deck job....whattya think...jus a hard as Ash,Oak and Maple. I like the look too.Good Luck w/ yours Bro.
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Ice dawg, Nice looking stuff and very similar to the Teak I had left over from a Deck Patio set I built a few years back. Built my tip from it and tried a number of different finishes and found the best to be Teak Wood Oil finish. It goes on easy, gets sucked into the wood and protects and preserves. Mahogony being an oily wood also, I am sure you will be happy with it and it is simple to re oil any time you feel like.
Mahogany and Teak are not nearly as hard as the Oaks, Ashes you mentioned but they are more durable in a water environment and do not splinter like the others.
They also sand and finish very easy.
Good Luck. Gary
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Thanks Bro....I received my Jack Traps 26" cross trap and the hardware needed to complete a set of 5 of my own today.....Its true, for what it cost me in parts for them I nearly coulda bought 5 of his....but not really worring about the money(not rich either) but I wanted to make mine real sweet,and I think he's got the best parts I've seen anywhere. Got any pics of them Teak tips....like to see em. Thanks for input on the Teak Oil, Im definitly going to look into that.Peace :tipup:
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Will try to post some pics today, got my Photobucket account set up and need to learn a bit of photograpy 101 to get clear close ups with new camera.
I see you got that part down very nicely and your pics are clear and gorgeous.
Do ya think reading the book might help ???, :-[.
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Heres my lil secret...shhhh....lol I take alot pics and use different lighting settings on my Olympus...But I stand back about 3 to 4 feet and zoom in....if ya stand to close ya get alotta light wash from the flash....Good Luck n hope that helps ya Bro.
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Nice looking work there Bro, I must say Im cheatin a bit....Im usin mostly Jack Traps parts to build mine, the stuff is pricey like others have stated but it is top knotch. Mostly stainless.
It will cost more to home make a nice trap including our time and all but hey...when someone asks..we simply say.."Yeah I made em".
Wondering what ya used for wood and kinda measurments ya got out out of em. Mine will be in full Mahogany and the cross bases are a slight narrower than the uprights due to cost. If I didnt have the Mahogany lying around,Im not sure what I'd use. cross sections are 3/4x7/8 and the uprights are 1x3/4. I ordered a Jack trap to build off,and some parts to get started.
Heres a pic of my stage 1. I cut the strips and rounded the edges on a router table to smooth em out...then lightly sanded em...Not sure what Im goin to use for a finish...but I wont color em..the Mahogany should be a beautiful redish when done.
Good Luck and Flags Up to Ya.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/Titleist1964/P1010005.jpg)[/img]
I am useing oak 3/4" x 3/4" on everything. my main post is 43" long and than 35" cross pieces the reason I made them big is for extra stability in winds. I used my new traps this weekend and they worked great but the wood inside of the reels swelled up and I basically had a hard drag set. So back to the drawing board on the reels and I will hopefully come up with a new plan soon. I will continue to get my crap togather and make a step by step building of traps post when I get it all togather.
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I have found one of the tips mentioned above to be most accurate and valuable!!!
When you drill and mount the reel shaft, see that it is completely isolated from the drag mechenism. This way, swelling of the verticle wood will not cause a tightening of the reel drag.
I corrected this malfunction on my HLs by removing the reel, adding a nut right against the wood and re fitting the reels and drags. Now when or if the wood swells it does not affect the drag setting.
Still having poor luck with photos, they all come out with that saw tooth look and very poor definition. I promise I will do some reading to learn the proper settings of my camera as I am certain this is where the problem lies.
Lighting is not the problem, when I get close enough for great detail, I can only get a small portion of the tip up in the pic. Move back and zoom in to get the entire trap in and I get saw tooth and no detail. :%$#!:
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My traps are 20' for the crosses and a true 26" for the uprights....The Jack I received was 19" on the cross and 25" on the upright. My type of fishing really dosnt require a big trap but I'd like to have some big traps anyway....maybe the next ones will be that way.
What did you use to protect the wood?
No probs game I've got nothin but time Bro.
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Finally took some pics of my home made Teak wood tip ups and am going to attempt to get them in here. Wish me luck because this computer stuff usually beats me!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v722/Gamalot/DSCN0773.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v722/Gamalot/DSCN0771.jpg)
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highlight the url than click the image button above the smilies.
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Thanks again TPfromMN, Now it is working and I hope I can "ramember evrathing you learnt me"
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Dude those traps look awesome. They look like furniture. hang them above the fireplace in the cabin man. Awesome work.
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Now for the occassional Night fishing I like to do.
When the flag pops the light goes on and begins to blink and a pizzio tweeter send an alarm you can hear pretty well as long as the wind is not howling.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v722/Gamalot/tip2.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v722/Gamalot/tip1.jpg)
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Ahhhh Game u dirty Dawg those Teaks look real sweet brother...very nice work. looks like I've got my work cut out for me :)....I finially have all the peices sanded and smoothed out to my liken.I'm ready to drill the holes and and prep em for the finish I ve got all the parts lined up and ready to go.....but I think Im going to do some type of art work on the sticks first. I was looking at a wood burning tool my wife has....Think I'll burn my name into them. I need to make up a stencil and then burn it in. How do you like those Extremes...I jus scored 4 of Ebay for round 35 bux.....they looked pretty cool so I dropped a bid and won em. Got luckyI think Ive seen em go over 60 bux for 4.
Anyway Nice Work Gamalot.
CT IceDawg
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The wood burner sounds pretty cool and since you have all the parts lined up and ready then you are half way there.
I see you won something on ebay, not quite sure what it was but nice to hear someone is able to win an occassional auction there.
With this slow dial up, I get beat at the last minute every time.
Keep us posted and get some pics when you get them done.
Gary
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I won 4 of the Polar Therm Extremes....I liked the look and idea of them stacking in a bucket real nice and they make a gr8 set of extra traps when my wife feels like joining me for the day. How do you like those Polar therms? Snapping pics as I go..
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Did a little work on the traps today...drilled the holes and put togather a test trap to see how it all fits.....So heres a quick pic.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/Titleist1964/P1010021.jpg)
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hey Game.....I notice that u an your bro did some ridin on the Hatfeild McCoy trail in WV...I know of 5 trails there which one did you guys run? I have a friend from work with several buddys down that way and he rides those trails often. He goes for a couple weeks and camps on the trails too. He hunts in WV also.
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I love the Polar Therm EXTREMES. Great for elactrifying! Easy storage in a bucket and great visibility with extended flag. Auger should be no larger then 9 inch, be careful with the antenas when picking up and they could be frozen open. On real windy days with snow blowning I have had trouble finding them if I don't keep the area around the holes cleaned. In fact, once, the only way I did find one was the flag went up!
This is why I have three different sets of tip ups. One for calm days when the 8 inch hole is fine and fishing shallow-Polars, One for windy days or when fishing very deep-Heritage Lakers and my home mades for when I bring a friend as they are fine for all around fishing.
Hope you are or plan to use either Brass or SS screws and wing nuts on those beauties. Makes no sense to cheapen them now for the few extra dollars.
If you really want to make the wood look and perfom great, after you treat it with the Teak oil, allow them to dry for a full day and then use MinWax Paste furniture wax. That stuff is not as durable but really brings out the beauty in fine woods and can easily be re applied any time you want to shine them up. Also helps with ice build up while fishing.
Sent you a PM.
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Thanx for the tips Bro.....All the hardware is SS...rite down to every last detail....the reels are Jack Traps too so they're aluminum with a wooden insert. I spoke with Tim Jackson and we set everything up that I would need to make them. His hardware has to be the best stuff I've ever seen....like many others said and I can prove it that it's cheaper to buy 5 of his traps ready to go than buy all the hardware to make 5. He polys his traps with 2 coats and they look great and shine too. The stuff is thick so I think they'll last forever.
All I can say is this...for those who have been following this tread...its great to build your own traps..but for those who just want to buy a set and have them last for ever...spend the extra and go Jack Traps. Heres a pic of a Jack Traps 26" cross. Very nice tip-ups.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/Titleist1964/P1010032.jpg)[/img]
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Like the Jacks but will like yours much better with some real wood meant for the elements. Don't get me wrong, I build 99% of my furniture out of red or white oak and it is great wood. For wet environments it STINKS unless you cover it tottaly with a plastic finish. White oak is better but will still warp and splinter if the finish is penetrated.
Your idea of Mahogany or mine with Teak coupled with the quality parts from either Jacks or Heritage will certainly make a much prettier and more durable trap. I think the Jack parts will be easier to work with and the fastening method is much better then those of the heritage brand.
Not too sure I like the wood insert in the reels and think if money was not all that big an obsticle I would search for eithe solid aluminum, Stainless or even Graphite spools. I actually like the graphite Heritage spools better then the metal because they don't get dented, bent or have any sharp edges. Find someone with access to a CNC Lathe and have him wip you out five nice solid aluminum or Brass spools and you will really be in business.
We can get very creative here and very expensive like you and I have said before, but the one thing we can't do is make them better for less money.
I really like the reel and shaft mechenism on the Artic Fisherman Beaver Dams but I do not like the low profile style tip ups nearly as much as the tall, cross stick jammies we make.
Think the biggest problem you might have upon completion is you might not want to use such pretty tip ups in such a harsh environment. Mine take more of a beating in the bucket and during transport then they ever get while in use.
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The wood burner sounds pretty cool and since you have all the parts lined up and ready then you are half way there.
I see you won something on ebay, not quite sure what it was but nice to hear someone is able to win an occassional auction there.
With this slow dial up, I get beat at the last minute every time.
Keep us posted and get some pics when you get them done.
Gary
I used to have dial up before getting high speed on-line, so I know where you are coming from. I could never figure out how I was out bid at the last minute / second every time I wanted something that I had bid on. You can even the score, even with a dial up connection, by using something called a Sniping program or Sniping software. It allows you to place a bid and then the software program waits until the last minute / second and submits the bid for you.
You should be able to do a Google search to find out some more info on it.
Good luck with your next bid on fishing equip . . .
-Reelcharacter
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Hey Reelcharacter...what do you know about this sniper bid program......if you can beleive this old friend I use to work with about a year or so ago was telling me a guy his father worked with was working on a program very similar to what you spoke of. I know his old man is into PC software but dont really know anything more than that. I do remember him mentioning something about this. Sounds kinda kool.....its just a matter of time berfore someone comes up with something like this or one better.
Hey Game....Im not to sure about the wood insert on the reel either but if Tim at Jack Traps says it works it must be OK. What is this plastic finish you mentioned...I had a guy that does hardwood floors I work with say that to me tonight when I asked him what I should use.
My local paint shop recommends a marine grade varnish due to the fact that a portion of the trap will be submerged in water. I've had several different opions on what to go with...Im afraid of yellowing over the years..I'd hate to see the wood change its color from a beautiful reddish tint to a pitiful dull brown...all caused from a cheap finish.
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PLASTIC as in POLY-Urethane, spar varnish, marine grade varnish are all in the same class to me. They are great finishes--------for a while and a true pain in the bum to re finish. To do it right you should strip and re coat.
You are useing fine grade wood, Mahogany, Teak and should not cover it but should protect it with an oil based finish that penetrates rather then coats. Mahogany and teak are oily woods to begin with and known throughout the industry for their wet environment properties. Coating them with POLY/Plastic would be great but giving them what they want-Penetrating OIL, would be better.
If I build a kitchen table out of OAK, I use Plastic/Polyurethane. If I build the same table out of a fine wood, teak/mahogany, I use a carnuba wax or penetrating oil. Re coating is a breeze-no stripping is ever required.
My Teak tip ups are in their 12th season and look almost as good as new!
My older Oak tip ups got sold after 5 years because I did not want to strip them down and re finish them when the Plastic/Poly began to peel off and look like trash.
Try it, You will be glad you did on mahogany or teak but never on Oak-it will not absorb it like the oil based woods.
Think of it this way. Gorgeous Boats are complimented with Teak and Mahogany and it is almost never coated with Poly but almost always treated with a penetrating oil. Swim platforms on most boats are made, almost exclusively, from teak, direct water contact and always treated with teak wood oil.
Do a stupid, simple experiment with small cut off pieces of your wood. coat one with Poly urethane, one with marine spar varnish and the last with a penetrating oil and then leave them all out on your deck for a year in the sun and thru the winter.
I already know which finish will win. If you do the same with oak, I will bet you have a few pieces of split junk wood at the end of the year no matter which finish you use.
Poly will, however, look the shinnyest for a while! Oil will have a dull, waxy look and feel for a long time and all you need to do is re oil once a year durring the off season, 2 minute job per tip up! A pint of teak oil stored properly will keep your tip ups happy a protected for your lifetime!
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Hey Game...My Jack Trap has a very shinny finish on it and he applies 2 coats of poly on em. ..but again he isnt using a teak or mahogany. With the penatrating oil will the wood swell like others have mentioned? I would like em to shine but also ultimatly last. If I went with the penatrating oil recommend...what name should I be looking for and what is it actually called?
Thanks Bo
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Teak oil will soak into the wood and become invisible. It will not make them shine at all, just protect them by closing off the poores and not allowing water in.
If you sand the wood with fine sandpaper prior to oiling it the wood will look the same before and after coating except it may darken a bit. I have notice no swelling on my teak tip ups when the oil is applied but can't be positive how it might affect your Mahogany. Best to try a bit on a small scrap so you can see what it will look like and determine if the wood will swell.
Teak Wood Oil is the name, I am sure there are many brands out there and it is used to coat teak and other oily woods for marine environment. If your local paint/hardware store does not carry it then try a boating store. I have seen it here in Wal-Mart in the boating section.
If shine is what you really want then use a high quality Marine polyurethane or Marine Spar varnish Gloss. Follow all directions to the letter and especially the drying and recoating part. Some say second coat after the first coat is completely dry while others want the second coat to go on after a few hours or more.
I think the key to a good adhesion of the poly or varnish is to be certain all oil or grease is off the wood before you coat it. This includes unseen oil from your hands or any tools. If there is contamination on the wood, this is where the plastic coating will eventually fail.
I like the teak oil and it is the easiest to apply and re apply, no need to take the traps appart or disassemble, just give them a quick coat with a rag or cheap brush and your good to go. Joints won't get stuck together and it will penetrate all over.
The Poly or varnish is far more labor intensive, you must do each stick seperately and allow each stick to dry completely, sand between coats to break the gloss and then assemble all the parts. If you will notice on your Jack traps, the wood was first coated and then the parts were added. Possibly all the holes were drilled after the coating was applied rather then before.
I will add only this. If you already have the tip ups assembled with the trip shafts already nailed or screwed on to the wood you could be too late to do the poly or varnish. If you don't get the entire piece of wood completely sealed as in under all the parts, then the water will immediately soak in thru the unsealed areas and start to peel the coating. I would bet Jack Traps are sprayed with an HVLP (high volume, low preasure) system and allowed to completely dry before the holes are drilled or any parts are mounted. This assures complete sealing of the entire piece of wood and makes for a great protective coating. Painting them after everything is in place is not a good seal because the finish will not get under everything and should be avoided. The penetrating oil would be your better choice if this is the case but it will not have the glossy finish like your Jacks.
Good luck with what ever you decide to do.
I have been building furniture for over 40 years and used many finishes. The Poly and Varnish are outstanding finishes when properly applied but few have the patients to do it correctly where water submersion is in play.
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Boy is my head spinning now... ??? I have yet to assemble the traps but Ive drilled all the holes..no matter the finish I agree...doing them without the hardware is the best way to coat them. I'm really having a hard time deciding on what to do....as far as labor intense Im not to worried about that...I have the time to doit rite. These traps wont see any action this year.
So I have nothing but time.....we may be selling our house so I just my not even start them,I dont want my sticks hangin in a drying room and someone poking around and touching em.
I Thank you very much for all your advice Game and Im givin all the options you've provided a lot of thought.
Thanks Again Bro
CT
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If all you have done is drill the holes and you really want them shinny then do the Marine poly or Varnish. You may have to drill the holes out after but this would be the best time to do it.
No need for your head to be spinning! Figure out if you want shine or not and go for it.
I like the oil but this in no way means you have to!
Just be sure to sand them to 220 or finer and have all oil and grease off before you coat. You would be surprised how much oil is in your hands and fingers so buy some tiny eye hooks, screw one into the end of each stick and hang them. After the finish is completely done, both coats, remove the hooks and spot coat the tiny holes you made.
Good luck.
Gary
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Hey Reelcharacter...what do you know about this sniper bid program .....
IceDawg,
Since we are kind of getting off the topic, I will send you a direct email. (Unless someone else wants some eBay discussion here. What little I know, I have learned the hard way from collecting boy scout patches and having to sell some to support the affliction. (Yes, I am addicted to something other than just fishing . . . :)
-Reelcharacter
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DAve, Now the art work is sweet! You better PM me and give the details of how you did that!
I just know you are itching to do the finish so why wait????? It is a one ore two night task depending on how many coats you do.
We can't wait to see those babies all done and just think, if you get to it you could break them in this season. We will have ice into April here for sure.
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Thanks Bro.....I'm still looking over some decals that they use for rod building.....we do mostly bass fishing round here so I've found a few I want to add...the guys at Janns Netcraft have been alotta help...I'd really like to see em in action this year but Im not sure they will be :(
I went to 3 places today looking for the epoxy I wanted and no one had it...I have a couple more places to go tommoro....if not I'll havta order it online.....I'll keep ya posted.
CT ID
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If you have a West MArine anywhere close try them. Might also find it at a auto paint store that services collission shops.
Did you burn your name in, paint it thru a stencil or what???
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Thats where I went....we hav a boaters world,and a west marine....niehter one had it.. Im going to woodcraft and see if they hav it....they had it on thier web site.
I actually used a rub-on decal for the lettering..I found them at a local craft store AC Moore.
The letters were very easy to use,made for crafts and wood,I can also epoxy over them.
They came out ok. Im still looking over the decals though.....
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The stenciled decals look great to me and as long as the top coat will not lift them off I would go with it myself.
Guess your boating stores are not with the program there! I have found the epoxy at every marine store I enter and it is quite popular all along the great lakes.
Hope you locate it soon. Think it is made over by Buffalo and they have a store I have been to.
Gary
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They're outta Auburn WA..and very well may have a store in Buff...I was kinda surprised that neither of the 2 boating stores carried it....this stuff is designed for heavy protection and recommended for below waterline applications. I can apply 3 light coats then sand the 3rd...
I think I'll prolly order it online if I cant find it today.
The rub-on letters I used came from a company called MakingMemories, you can see the differant letters they carry on thier website....I did see another type I liked but the store didnt have em...woulda like to make it a little more designer and classy than a block type letter....but never the less they look ok. The woman at the craft store said her husband has used them on wood projects and never had a problem with them peeling or cracking.
Im kinda gettin a lil antsy and wanna see em done but I jus wanna take my time n doit right the 1st time....when I'm done I dont wanna say.."Oh Man'''I shoulda done that". So I'll just keep the wheels turning for now and have em ready fer next year.
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CT,
You may just have to float them on some styrafoam this spring to try them out. :)
I can't imaging having to wait 8 months to try out them babies?!
-Reelcharacter