Author Topic: Fish Swallowing Hooks?  (Read 12891 times)

Offline WalleyeCrawl10

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Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« on: Jan 12, 2012, 07:03 AM »
Ok, I've been searching for a good answer and unfortuantely I haven''t.  Last night I caught a small walleye who swallowed my treble hook. I always feel bad when this happens cuz Idk what's gonna happen to the fish. He was a small one and the reason the hook was so deep was because he was so small he didn't set up my tipup or run with it. Weird huh? Anyway I cut the line as close as I could and let him go. Now does anyone have any evidence that a fish will live with a hook in it's stomach? Idk if I believe that the fish will be fine. Does the hook really breakdown in the stomach and if so how long does it take. My hooks are eagle claw ones that have a red coating that seem to come off fairly easy.  ???
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Offline Lobes

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #1 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:16 AM »
I remember as a kid I'd lost topwater lures to pike that were recovered within two weeks, hooks rusted away. Not sure if it does this with all species but I'd think so. If the fish die they become food for other creatures so they're not entirely wasted.

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Offline rdhammah

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #2 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:17 AM »
circle hooks

Offline nitzer

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #3 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:18 AM »
circle

Offline slabfisher12

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #4 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:20 AM »
Ok, I've been searching for a good answer and unfortuantely I haven''t.  Last night I caught a small walleye who swallowed my treble hook. I always feel bad when this happens cuz Idk what's gonna happen to the fish. He was a small one and the reason the hook was so deep was because he was so small he didn't set up my tipup or run with it. Weird huh? Anyway I cut the line as close as I could and let him go. Now does anyone have any evidence that a fish will live with a hook in it's stomach? Idk if I believe that the fish will be fine. Does the hook really breakdown in the stomach and if so how long does it take. My hooks are eagle claw ones that have a red coating that seem to come off fairly easy.  ???
my granpa always told it broke down in its gut :)
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Offline slabfisher12

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #5 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:23 AM »
and i think they make biodegrdible hooks :thumbsup:
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Offline GCD

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #6 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:25 AM »
A 3/0 circle hook should keep the little Walleye from swallowing the hook.
Give a man a fish and you'll feed him for a day, give him a religion and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish... author unknown


Offline privateeyes

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #7 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:38 AM »
I don't think trebles should be allowed for live lining bait , I rather stand by the hole and wait for the fish to come back(which they usually do and feel the take /set a #6 eagle claw.. barbed works well keeping the shiner on too. But plain shank or barb eagle claw is fine and much easier on any released gamefish. If you are missing fish , it could be the way you are baiting the hook.. sometimes when a small fish such a perch will trip a flag three or four times even after killing the bait on the hook!! At this point , I remove the hook from the back just before the dorsal and double lip hook the dead bait.. next flag usually catches that tricky little fish.. I guess know how they swallow all their baitfish head first and having the bait hooked in the lips helps improve hookup.

Offline CharlieBrn

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #8 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:41 AM »
I think if the hooks actually get to the stomach then I suppose it's possible it can be broken down.  The fact that it breaks down completely is a myth. First of all, the hooks have to get that far, most the time they are lodged in the fishes gullet/throat and cant be seen.  Thus, the fish dies because it cant eat, etc. etc.  It will become food for something else.

Offline eriksat1

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #9 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:51 AM »
Being a musky fisherman this was a great debate on single hook sucker fishing. It has been determined through numerous studies that as long as the hook does not break through the stomach lining the fish should be ok and will be able to dissolve most of the hook with the stomach acid. But if the hook punctures the stomach lining (usually on hook set) the fish will eventually die delayed mortality, about 100% of the time.

Offline woodyvt

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #10 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:53 AM »
Not sure if it is true or not, but I have heard from many that the hooks break down and rust due to the chemical reaction in the fish.  I would certainly like to learn more.

For one I do not use treble hooks at all......If I do have a fish swallow the hook I just cut the line as close to the hook as possible. 
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Offline privateeyes

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #11 on: Jan 12, 2012, 08:55 AM »
I think if the hooks actually get to the stomach then I suppose it's possible it can be broken down.  The fact that it breaks down completely is a myth. First of all, the hooks have to get that far, most the time they are lodged in the fishes gullet/throat and cant be seen.  Thus, the fish dies because it cant eat, etc. etc.  It will become food for something else.
I believe that too. when I can seemost the shank or if I feel the hookcan be lightly pulled threw the gill plate and trying not to bleed the fish using my forceps .. forceps can work if the hook shank can be pushed down a light twist and the lightest jerk from the fishes gullet.. if you don't see blood. the fish will live.. if however the fish is bleeding or you tear a gill.. just put it out of it's misery. I would never use a treble hook for tipups because three points barb are likely to increase the mortality of released fish 

Offline GCD

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #12 on: Jan 12, 2012, 09:14 AM »
This is a good video of circle hooks in action, notice where all the fish are hooked.

&feature=related

Circle hooks work for all species of fish and come in a wide variety of sizes. If you're using bait, a circle hook is a very efficient tool.
Give a man a fish and you'll feed him for a day, give him a religion and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish... author unknown


Offline FishinJenn

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #13 on: Jan 12, 2012, 09:29 AM »
Huh, we may have to try these, I get tired of the trebles anyhow, they get caught on stuff too easily and are a b***h to untangle.  :tipup:
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Offline WalleyeCrawl10

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #14 on: Jan 12, 2012, 10:43 AM »
I will look into the circle hooks. It's worth a try at any rate. I'm rather curious now to see if they really work and who knows, I may be onto something because everyone I know up hear uses treble hooks on they're tipups just to insure a good success rate on tipups. Thanks for the advice! ;D
The Green Hornet Strikes Again! Caught my Limit....I see you only snagged one.

Two fish are on there, bonehead. And you know damn well that I throw back what I'm not gonna eat.

Oh yeah, like that 40 pound Musky your always yapping about, it's a shame nobody ever see's you with these monsters!

Offline tinyfisher

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #15 on: Jan 12, 2012, 10:44 AM »
I had a bass in an aquarium that I caught from a local pond.  Several months later it stopped eating, and starved to death.  After I took him out of the tank, it had a hook stuck ing it's gullet.  This is after several months.  If you can see any of the hook, cut as much of it out as you can.  Like mentioned, you can also cut the line and remove through the gill plate. 

I know a lot of people swear by circle hooks, but if the hook is swallowed to the gullet it doesn't really matter if it's a circle or treble, it will get stuck there.  I've never had a fish not trip a flag, might want to re-lube your traps!  I would prefer downsizing to a small, light treble, say a #8 or 10.
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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #16 on: Jan 12, 2012, 11:00 AM »
Unless its illegal, I just keep them and eat them ;D  Hate to waste a fish.  I don't have this problem very often though as I am usually jigging or using a variation of the slammer.

Offline GCD

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #17 on: Jan 12, 2012, 11:24 AM »
I know a lot of people swear by circle hooks, but if the hook is swallowed to the gullet it doesn't really matter if it's a circle or treble, it will get stuck there.  I've never had a fish not trip a flag, might want to re-lube your traps!  I would prefer downsizing to a small, light treble, say a #8 or 10.

You don't quite understand the mechanics of a circle hook (not trying to be rude).

Circle hooks are designed to be swallowed by the fish. After the hook and bait is swallowed the fish will swim away, when the fish swims away the hook comes out of the fishes stomach and catches in the corner of the fishes mouth.

These hooks were designed by longline commercial fishermen that fish the ocean. They were designed to keep the caught fish alive for an extended period of time so their catch would be fresh when they pulled their lines in. They also keep the fish that are too small to keep alive so they can be put back and not wasted.

As I mentioned above, the hooks work when the fish is swimming away from you. There is no need to jerk the hook to set it, it just needs steady tension to work... like putting the brakes on in your truck or car for a smooth stop. This is the thing that makes most people give up on circle hooks, they can't remember to not jerk the line... when you jerk the line it pulls the bait and hook out of the fishes stomach and mouth.

If you're using the hook on a tip up and the fish is running just apply steady pressure on the spool to stop the fish and then pull it in. If you're using these hooks on a rod and reel just start reeling with no jerk. Once you get the hang of them you'll be amazed at how well they work and your catch ratio will go way up.

This is some of my collection of circle hooks:



From 1/0 - 12/0, you would be surprised at how small of a fish can hook itself on a 3/0 circle. The 3/0 is what I'd use to target Pike (depending on the size of the bait) and the little 1/0 would be for Perch, Crappie, and small Walleye with minnows.
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Offline coldsteel

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #18 on: Jan 12, 2012, 11:38 AM »
I had caught a largemouth a few summers ago that must have swalloed a hook previously because when I lipped the fish to take my hook out of its mouth there was another coming out its back end... I helped it out by removing that one too haha... The hook looked fairly fresh so I would assume he just digested it and passed it..
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Offline shiveringjoe

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #19 on: Jan 12, 2012, 12:54 PM »
You don't quite understand the mechanics of a circle hook (not trying to be rude).

Circle hooks are designed to be swallowed by the fish. After the hook and bait is swallowed the fish will swim away, when the fish swims away the hook comes out of the fishes stomach and catches in the corner of the fishes mouth.

These hooks were designed by longline commercial fishermen that fish the ocean. They were designed to keep the caught fish alive for an extended period of time so their catch would be fresh when they pulled their lines in. They also keep the fish that are too small to keep alive so they can be put back and not wasted.

As I mentioned above, the hooks work when the fish is swimming away from you. There is no need to jerk the hook to set it, it just needs steady tension to work... like putting the brakes on in your truck or car for a smooth stop. This is the thing that makes most people give up on circle hooks, they can't remember to not jerk the line... when you jerk the line it pulls the bait and hook out of the fishes stomach and mouth.

If you're using the hook on a tip up and the fish is running just apply steady pressure on the spool to stop the fish and then pull it in. If you're using these hooks on a rod and reel just start reeling with no jerk. Once you get the hang of them you'll be amazed at how well they work and your catch ratio will go way up.

This is some of my collection of circle hooks:

(Image removed from quote.)

From 1/0 - 12/0, you would be surprised at how small of a fish can hook itself on a 3/0 circle. The 3/0 is what I'd use to target Pike (depending on the size of the bait) and the little 1/0 would be for Perch, Crappie, and small Walleye with minnows.

I put 2/0 daiichi circle hooks on half of my tipups last year and I am definitely a fan. Landing rate is the same as my tipups rigged with trebles, but every pike and bass I catch on the circle is hooked perfectly in the corner of the mouth.  But you definitely can't forget and try to set the hook, miss the fish every time!

Offline WalleyeCrawl10

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #20 on: Jan 12, 2012, 01:39 PM »
Ok Guys! Enough of the witty banter. lol I went down to the bait shop and found me some circle hooks made by Gamakatsu. I got the size 4 which I thought were a good size for Walleyes. I'll give a try and let you know what I think about em.  ;D
The Green Hornet Strikes Again! Caught my Limit....I see you only snagged one.

Two fish are on there, bonehead. And you know damn well that I throw back what I'm not gonna eat.

Oh yeah, like that 40 pound Musky your always yapping about, it's a shame nobody ever see's you with these monsters!

Offline DaveW731

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #21 on: Jan 12, 2012, 02:44 PM »
Circle hooks are great!  I am sure you will be happy with the results.  I have them on all of my tipups.

It is interesting to me that many of the posts talk about pulling the hook totally out of the fish's mouth if they tried to set the hook by jerking it.  My problem was the exact opposite.  When I forgot what I was doing and set the hook, it actually buried itself in the fish's gut, just like a treble.  Only difference is that because of the design, it was even harder to dislodge than a treble was.   

Regardless, the lesson is the same DO NOT "SET" THE HOOK!
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Offline bmxfreak361

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #22 on: Jan 12, 2012, 02:49 PM »
i wish i could find the article, it was on fishinformer.com or some other site like that and it was all about it. i guess most hooks dont rust. which makes sense because none of my hooks are rusty. they hurt if left in, cant heal and can catch onto food and make them not want to eat. i may be wrong but thats what i remember. youtube how to take a gut hook out, i think they have a nice one for bass.

also circles are awesome for pout, but never liked them for ice fishing. i use size 6 for ice, probably too small for circles. i dont use any trebles, unless they are on a lure.

Offline privateeyes

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #23 on: Jan 12, 2012, 09:09 PM »
This is a great thread, I tried circles for open water trout in reservoirs I fish upstate and guess I used them wrong because I would try to set the circle hook and so failed hooking up more so I went back to standard hooks. I'm going to try circle hooks from now on both ice and open. I much rather not harm any fish unless I intend knocking it out and filleting it.  I feel much when I release fish unharmed without sharp point hooks in the gullet.

Offline Chris Raymond

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #24 on: Jan 13, 2012, 06:59 AM »
One thing to keep in mind with "circle" hooks is the hook type, not brand necessarily, itself.  I started out using Octopus circles with high expectations and had so-so results.  I then switched over to Kahle circles with medium expectations and ended up having great results.  The hook angles and straight eyes of the Kahles simply created fewer, if not eliminated, situations where the hooks were setting in the gullet instead of the corner of the mouth.  My flag to hook-up ratio has remained as high...I don't miss many flags.  I typically use lighter than normal choloro for the fish that I chase.  Just my perspective. 
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Offline GCD

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #25 on: Jan 13, 2012, 07:31 AM »
One thing to keep in mind with "circle" hooks is the hook type, not brand necessarily, itself.  I started out using Octopus circles with high expectations and had so-so results.  I then switched over to Kahle circles with medium expectations and ended up having great results.  The hook angles and straight eyes of the Kahles simply created fewer, if not eliminated situations, where the hooks were setting in the gullet instead of the corner of the mouth.  My flag to hook-up ratio has remained as high...I don't miss many flags.  I typically use lighter than normal choloro for the fish that I chase.  Just my perspective.

The Octopus hooks will pull straight like they're supposed to do if you fasten it to your line with a snell not which requires a leader. The Kahle is the right hook for tying directly.
Give a man a fish and you'll feed him for a day, give him a religion and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish... author unknown


Offline esox_xtm

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #26 on: Jan 13, 2012, 08:24 AM »
Circles are an option that I have used with mixed success. Design is important. those circles with an offset design can still hook up well inside the mouth at times.

My solution was borrowed from the bass fraternity. On a fish with a smaller mouth and very tiny hooks it is usually a two man process unless you a bit practiced. I slip a forceps through the gill and lock onto the shaft of the hook You may need to pull on the line a bit to expose very deeply hooked hooks. Once locked on, turn the forceps to tip the hook upside down and pop it right out. Try this a couple of time and you will be amazed.

Additionally, with modern hook manufacture, most hooks either don't or resist rusting. Even in those stomach juices.

Check this video for the technique used on bass. Again, I always leave the line attached, it is useful for getting those very tiny, deeply swallowed hooks to come out at least enough to grab the shank. Plus I generally don't have to retie.............

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RGTL9RBG2s

Or this In-Fish article: http://archives.in-fisherman.com/content/through-gill-hook-removal

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Offline coldsteel

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #27 on: Jan 13, 2012, 09:17 AM »
Esox that is a great techinique I have seen my buddy do it many times and it just amazes me how it works
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Offline stevek

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #28 on: Jan 13, 2012, 09:31 AM »
Circles are an option that I have used with mixed success. Design is important. those circles with an offset design can still hook up well inside the mouth at times.

My solution was borrowed from the bass fraternity. On a fish with a smaller mouth and very tiny hooks it is usually a two man process unless you a bit practiced. I slip a forceps through the gill and lock onto the shaft of the hook You may need to pull on the line a bit to expose very deeply hooked hooks. Once locked on, turn the forceps to tip the hook upside down and pop it right out. Try this a couple of time and you will be amazed.

Additionally, with modern hook manufacture, most hooks either don't or resist rusting. Even in those stomach juices.

Check this video for the technique used on bass. Again, I always leave the line attached, it is useful for getting those very tiny, deeply swallowed hooks to come out at least enough to grab the shank. Plus I generally don't have to retie.............

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RGTL9RBG2s

Or this In-Fish article: http://archives.in-fisherman.com/content/through-gill-hook-removal

/mike


I use this technique as well and it works extremely well. Even if the hook looks gone down the throat it is usually visible from the gill plate. Have done it on fish as small as perch. Good forceps help a lot with this.
                       

Offline bpfohler

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Re: Fish Swallowing Hooks?
« Reply #29 on: Jan 13, 2012, 09:15 PM »
  Great technique,  use it when trout fishing on the rare ocassion one is swallowed.

 



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