Rod weights, reel sizing, and target species

[Splattypus]

What constitutes the differences in rod lengths (UL, L, ML, M... etc)? How does that correspond to rod lengths?

Reel sizes, what do the numbers mean? How does that correspond to the length of line and min/max line tests?

Then how do you determine what rod and what reel to pair for a best pairing in targeting the different species?

What general rules of thumb do you disregard for personal preference, comfort, certain performance, etc?

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I've got a general understanding, but still get a little lost in the details when I start digging in. I can regurgitate what I've read and heard, but don't truly understand why these things are

[slipperybob]

There's is a rather broad range for each and then there's personal preference.  Few to almost none would be able to just pick out their preference from the get go.  It's almost a personal experience and a personal learning curve.

In general panfish as in crappies and bluegills gets mostly UL to L powered rods.  I would put perch right up with panfish.  Now for walleyes, I would go with ML to M powered rods, as since it depends on year class and actual body of water.  I think right around 19" plus walleyes tend to get decent weight and a M powered rod would work better.  Then again when the bite is finicky dropping down to a ML rod may suit that situation better.  To me, when a crappie or perch starts to hit 13" plus they basically get a ML or even M powered rod to go with as well.

For reels, one just needs to get familiar with the brand sizing designation.  For example Shimano goes from small 500, 1000, 2000, 2500, 3000, 4000 sized is about medium heavy.  Pfleuger goes from small 20, 25, 30, 35, 40 sized medium heavy.  This is all relative to freshwater spinning reels.

Then again forget everything about what you're targeting and trying to catch cuz it's sort of is the wrong direction to pick out a rod and reel for.  As for myself there is one hard rule of thumb for rod and reel and it's the actual lure weight that I will be using.  That's far more important for me to get the right feel to work my lure when I'm jigging it.  Too heavy a lure for the rod and it begins to feel mushy and the jigging motion is over worked.  Too light of a lure on the rod and it begins to feel nonexistent and the jigging motion is lost to nothingness. 

As for performance, that's all personal preference.  I am happy to use my Shakespeare Ugly Ice combo, but currently I much rather prefer to use my Shimano Reels and my custom Thorne Bros. rods.  I didn't just make that jump.  It took years of moving up from my rods and reels in ever more expensive equipment.  I've only settled on a custom rod only after I figured out what I was looking for, and it took more than a one time custom rod to figure that out.  It took several tries too.  In the end, I am mostly bait casting set up.  I have to be even more discerning because I prefer to not have a spiral wrap line guides.  So the actual rod, needs to be in the performance zone of without blank torsion twist.  That's a very niche category.

[Splattypus]

Very informative write up, thank you slipperybob.

You have some kind of relative/Ballpark estimation for weights of jigs, what you like for panfish at certain depths, etc.

I'll readily admit all my life I've been bad about paying attention to weights, and general eyeball physical size of lures (and just add more weight if I need more sink)

Not that I'll undertake the expense anytime soon, but I'd love a chance to spend some time watching my jigging on camera and see how my action actually is. The nature 9f ice fishing and presentations is far unlike any technique I ever learned in fishing, and it obviously makes a difference.

I think I'm also going to have to start paying a little closer to my gear. I started with minimal investment to get a feel for it, I'm soundly addicted, so it's probably time to upgrade a little more

[slipperybob]

My weights of lures are all over the board.  There have been times when I go with very light weights of like 1/128th oz. to even 1/500th oz. of which is no more than a hook and tiny fly bead.  On the large size for panfish I'd say 1/4 oz. for blue gills and at most 1/2 oz. for crappies.  Most of the time it's within the 1/8th oz. to 1/32nd oz. weight depending on lure type.  Depth varies depending on actual body of water so anywhere from around 10' to typical 20' of depth. 

If I'm smelt fishing, I maybe trying to catch smelt from about 5' under me to as much at 80' down under.  I did once pulled a crappie from about 75' down thinking it was a smelt.  The smelt I catch ice fishing typically varies from about 6" to as much as 12" long.  Haven't seen a 12" long smelt in like forever though since more people learn about smelt ice fishing.  9" long would be consider the large size currently.

Anyway for rods again, it's all preference but there are a few types to cover a lot. 

For sure one needs at least an UL fiberglass type of rod for all things finicky situation.  Typical length of around 24" to 28" long.  20 some years ago I bought an Shakespeare Cajun UL fiberglass rod for less than $10 on sale.  I think a comparable one on the cheap and effective side is a Beaver Dam Custom Noodle rod and comes with a reel seat.  I paid like 12$ on sale for that one like 10 yrs ago.

A L or ML rod in graphite would fulfill about 90% of one's jigging needs for multispecies.  L power for my lure weights of 1/8th oz to 1/64th.  ML power for my lure weights of 1/4 oz. to 1/32nd oz. mostly.  Typical length I prefer in this are 28" to 32" long.  In fact I prefer 32" lengths just because I prefer reel seats with about 4" grip handles on them.  (Keeping in mind I actually use a bait casting reel set up).  There's so many good cheap rods out there, one just merely have to pick one.  In my opinion St. Croix ML rod is the standard that all other rods should be measured against.  It just gets the job done very well although the prices have gone way up.

Medium powered or heavier rods, I almost don't use them.  Unless I know I'm looking for big fish.  Can go with low price rod and still be very well performing.  A 36" Medium powered Ugly Stick Dock Runner is less than $15.

And then...there's everything else hybrid, custom made, different, power noodles, quick tip, etc.,...rods out there one just has to see just exactly what one want's.  Even short youth rods can be very good when utilized for ice fishing. 

[Splattypus]

Very enlightening, thank you again. Reassuring to see I'm naturally sticking within the average ranges on weights in there. I'll be curious to see how I feel as I expand my rod collection. For some reason I can't explain, I've been eyeballing a lot of 28-32" rods, they just look like they've got a comfortable fit and good action. And most of my jig or spoon collect is between 1/32oz and 1/8oz, target species being primarily panfish and the adventurous bass/pike/walleye. Would love to go after some lunker trout or really any species, just don't generally know where to find them.

What is it about the baitcasting reel that you prefer, that isnt replicated by an I line, or how do you feel it's different 9ver a quality spinning reel?

[slipperybob]

What a bait casting reel can do...over the current inline drop reels

- finesse adjustment to lower depth of lure by thumbing the spool
- finesse adjustment to raising the lure by thumbing the spool
- if you're a line watcher - it's easier to detect an up bite when the line slacks up because the line is above rod blank as oppose to being below on a spinning reel set up.  Just like your old pegged fishing rods.
- profile wise, bait caster takes up less room in a bucket and less line tangle among set ups.

...over spinning reels.  With everything from above and...
- A smoother drag
- and adjustment at finger tip makes a world of difference when you suddenly hook up with an unexpected big fish.
- A straight line tug of war with fish keeps a steady rod and more consistent line pressure leverage
- quick depth adjustments by simply depressing the clutch release thumb bar
- reduced line twists - from a straighter line from spool to lure

I do not miss that pulsating feel of spinning reel set up at all when reeling up.  Feels like I'm cheating when I'm fish fighting on a bait caster.  It makes it almost too easy for pan fishing.  It's about fair challenge against catfish and pikes, but I'm under the impression that I'm icing them so much faster in half the time.  I use to think the fish were fighting hard but the smooth operation of tug of war on a bait casting reel has proven that has never been the case.

When I pull up a fish out of the ice hole and need to give some slack line to pull hook off of fish.  Just a quick release of the thumb bar.  Never have to worry about a big fish flopping and dancing with your rod or a loaded rod tip release.

If you fish outside on a cross wind, you never have to worry about the wind taking your line from the reel on the initial drop.

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If I'm actively fishing a two rod system and the fish are biting.  After unhooking a fish, I can deploy the other baitcasting reel and watch the lure drop on the flasher.  All the while jigging on the other rod.  It only takes a little finger to turn the handle to engage the clutch when the lure reaches the right depth.  It's more cumbersome on a spinning reel and I usually have to put the other rod down.  As it usually takes two hands to be able to flip the bail on a spinning reel.  In most cases, the lure usually hits bottom before I can flip the bail and now I need to reel the lure up to the right zone.  With roaming fish, those few seconds is often the difference between another hooked fish.  Especially with hole hopping.  I can deploy the other bait casting rod, single handed.  With the other rod in hand and fish pulled out of the hole.  I can either unhook fish or simply set that rod down.  It's less complicated compared to a two spinning rod system.  And it works for me.

[Splattypus]

Very compelling arguments for the bait caster.  It's been decades since I've tried a bait caster, and never could get the hang of it, spent more time fixing the bird's nest in the spool than actually fishing. But I've been considering picking up one for open water and trying to learn again. Sounds like it makes a great piece of equipment on hard water too, in skilled hands

[Walks on Water]

Very nice write-up on b/c reels, slipperybob.

I started using round ones for river fishing. Then I bought a couple low-profile ones to practice casting and really enjoyed them, the casting, the drag, the adaptability.
Then I realized they are a beefed-up version of an inline reel and decided to try them on the ice this year. I love the controlled drop.
I hadn't thought about easier fights until you wrote it, but I've caught a few pike in the 70 cm range and was surprised at how easily I was able to control them. We'll see how they perform when I get something big.

I was talking to one of the fishing store guys I know and he mentioned that he knows a number of people that use Daiwa Millionaires for lake trout.

[slipperybob]

The learning curve with the bait casters and the bird's nest of memories.    There's that on ice fishing too, when one hasn't gotten used to the feathering the spool on lure deployment.  As since the initial lure drop often speeds the spool up faster than after the lure hits the water and starts to sink.  Or if one is used to wrist flick the rod on the lure drop like on spinning reels, it's a disaster for baitcasting reels since again the spool speed is faster than the line pull speed and line tangles are waiting to happen.

If one uses like standard round reels of like the trolling reels with the clicking bait feeder engaged.  It works in place of a rattle reel, in a dead stick fashion bait feeder set up.  I had one set up for that purpose but it was such a rare thing for me to use I just benched it.  Hadn't camped out enough to bring that out, but always available as another option.  Aside I still have my fly reels for that purpose if ever a need arises for it too.  Something about a rude awakening to a rattling sound from a reel but rewarding effect.

[sploke]

The learning curve with the bait casters and the bird's nest of memories.    There's that on ice fishing too, when one hasn't gotten used to the feathering the spool on lure deployment.  As since the initial lure drop often speeds the spool up faster than after the lure hits the water and starts to sink.  Or if one is used to wrist flick the rod on the lure drop like on spinning reels, it's a disaster for baitcasting reels since again the spool speed is faster than the line pull speed and line tangles are waiting to happen.

If one uses like standard round reels of like the trolling reels with the clicking bait feeder engaged.  It works in place of a rattle reel, in a dead stick fashion bait feeder set up.  I had one set up for that purpose but it was such a rare thing for me to use I just benched it.  Hadn't camped out enough to bring that out, but always available as another option.  Aside I still have my fly reels for that purpose if ever a need arises for it too.  Something about a rude awakening to a rattling sound from a reel but rewarding effect.

What's your preferred baitcasting reel to match with a L/ML ice rod?

[slipperybob]

What's your preferred baitcasting reel to match with a L/ML ice rod?

Since I've gotten both the Curado BFS and Scorpion BFS, the Scorpion BFS wins hands down.  They are both very similar but the Scorpion just has a little bit more precision tolerance built into it.  It is a discontinued model, so second party sales is pretty much the most probable way to obtain one.  My Shimano Chronarch 50mg has been with me for about twenty years and that one is paired with a Thorne Bros. Panfish Sweetheart which is about the equivalent of a L power rod.