Saw a guy with acloverleaf trap...put it right on bottom which 6-8 feet deep... he caught a lot..with dog food,cheapest he could find. Another guy on a mill pond, 10 feet deep...located shimers with flasher...cut big hole for a 5 foot square pull up net which he would put on bottom...thow in pieces of bread....wait 10 or 15 min then pull up fast and he got a lot of golden shiners some 8 inches long. The most important thing is you have to know where they are.