lithium ion shuttle issue

[Fireman81]

Hey everyone I am new to this site so I dont know if this is where I should post this or not.   I bought a Lithium Ion Shuttle at the end of last years ice fishing season and charged it like the manual said to and then put it back in the pail and stored it away for the summer.   I went to take it fishing this past weekend and it will only charge to 83% and i get approx 5 hrs out of it.   Has anyone had an issue like this?   Any info is much appreciated.
Thanks

[Unclegillhunter]

You could post it in the electronic child forum in the equipment forum. One thing I will say is it is best to put a charge on the battery once a month if it is unused for that period. I have my batteries on a maintenance charge all the time. Don’t know if this would cause the battery to not come to full charge or not?
Keep it safe! JDL

[3300]

welcome to the shanty!

so it's stuck at 83%?
what happens when you leave it charging for a few hours?
you are leaving it shut off while charging?
they have a break in period, so keep charging it and it will be break in and take a better charge and give a longer run time.
you can turn on the light and sonar to discharge it faster, then top charge it some more. you can do this at home with out using the sonar, just turn it on and let it run the battery down to about 50% or so and then charge it. then repeat a few times.

a lot of people don't put their topic in the right place. there a lot of them posted here about sonar  https://www.iceshanty.com/ice_fishing/index.php?board=32.0 and then the proper place is here https://www.iceshanty.com/ice_fishing/index.php?board=74.0

[Fireman81]

No its not stuck at 83% thats just what it shows after i take it off of the charger.   Within 5 hrs or so it is down so far that it shuts off

[Fireman81]

To answer your question 3300 I am leaving it off during the charging.      The light on the charger shows green like it is charged and when I take it off of the charger and turn it on it shows 83%

[dcmod25]

are you using the correct charger for a lithium battery?

[Fireman81]

I am using the charger that came with the shuttle.   I will try to run it down a few times and charge it back up to see what happens.   I have a trip to Winnie in two weeks and I will not be a happy camper if I have $1000 invested in something that only works for 5 hrs.   Went to call Marcum this morning but they are closed until after the first so I will go with 3300's advice first I guess.   

[3300]

could be a bad charger, but try to break them in first to double check. also, i don't use the back light over 50% for long. the back light eats batteries. most times i have mine turned down to 10% and can see it just fine. in the sun if you wear sunglasses it can be tough to see. removing the snow sheild helps with the weird polarized colors you get from it.

while your breaking in the battery, you can mess with the back light to see how the battery reacts. the shuttle is about 225$.
a trick one could do is get the plug that fits their charge port and run another battery to it like the amped outdoor lithium sitting behind the sonar. never have had to do that. you should get around 20+ hours on 10% back light or more. might have been 28 hours at 10% and 21 at 50%.

[Fireman81]

Thanks for the info 3300.   I will try turning down the backlight and running it down and recharging for a few cycles to see if it does any better.   I love my Lx7 and bought the shuttle to get more battery life out of it but between the two I have alot of money invested in them to only have the short amount of time that I got on the ice last weekend.   I will try your advice and keep you posted on what I find out. 
Thanks again guys

[3300]

no problem. you'll be ok for your trip if marcum has to warranty your shuttle you'll still be good.

another option is to pick up the amped outdoors 12amp battery and charger for about half of what you have into your shuttle and could use that in the stock shuttle. i have one i use for in a ammo box lantern and power source for lighting led strips.
https://ampedoutdoors.com/collections/lifepo4-battery/products/12v-12ah-lifepo4-lithium
this will fit your stock shuttle.

if you live any where in southern lower michigan or northern indiana i could help you out better with my charger. pm if you wanna try to figure it out with my charger.

[Ranger619]

Thanks for the info 3300.   I will try turning down the backlight and running it down and recharging for a few cycles to see if it does any better.   I love my Lx7 and bought the shuttle to get more battery life out of it but between the two I have alot of money invested in them to only have the short amount of time that I got on the ice last weekend.   I will try your advice and keep you posted on what I find out. 
Thanks again guys

Fireman I ran a Shuttle for 1 year and 1 month because that’s all it lasted. There’s no break in period for a Lithium battery in the Shuttle if there was it would be in the instructions which it isn’t. I contacted Marcum about my unit going dead after 4-5 hrs on the ice and they told me if it was over a year old I’d have to pay to have a new battery installed by them (150.00) my unit was 1 year and a month old. I tried to buy a replacement battery on my own but was told by numerous battery outlets that the battery Marcum uses is a custom size only for them. So I went another route I purchase a Vexilar Pro Pack and made my own shuttle. Do a search on here and many pics of guys doing it will come up. Also maybe call Marcum and explain your problem maybe they’ll help you out. It’s to bad because I really liked my Shuttle. Glenn

[filetandrelease]

 I got mine in July , pulled it out in late DEC charged it , and ran it for 3 days and had 33% left
 

[3300]

bought mine the first day they hit the market. runs like it did brand new. if i had one that wasn't performing well i wouldn't wait over a year to get help. most people look up how long a warranty is before buying something. that's why i buy certain brands and not others.

there is a break in period and they don't have to mention it.

[Vex-Um]

I just got mine brand new, and it will only charge to 63% very disappointing.

Marcum hasn't answered their phone either or returned my messages.

[slipperybob]

Lithion Ion batteries don't have a break in period but they do need to be waken up.  Almost every electronics I've had that used rechargeable lithium ions have had this sort of break in period to say.  It was that way for my Motorolla Phone, FRS radios, Canon Cameras.  At brand new often the batteries don't take up a full charge cycle.  After a few uses, then the batteries take on the full charge.  Not sure if it's luck of the draw or what.  For one thing if one doesn't really pay attention to it, probably would be easily overlooked.  I have to Lithium Shuttle with M1's and they both needed a few uses before they the battery gauge would charge up to 100%.  The first few times or so they were stuck at 87% and 89%.  Mine are now at either 99% or 100% on the display gauge. 

[Ranger619]

bought mine the first day they hit the market. runs like it did brand new. if i had one that wasn't performing well i wouldn't wait over a year to get help. most people look up how long a warranty is before buying something. that's why i buy certain brands and not others.

there is a break in period and they don't have to mention it.

That’s great 3300 what do you do when it quits all of a sudden after a year then ? And I guess I’m like “most” people I read the warranty.

[Agronomist_at_IA]

Hey everyone I am new to this site so I dont know if this is where I should post this or not.   I bought a Lithium Ion Shuttle at the end of last years ice fishing season and charged it like the manual said to and then put it back in the pail and stored it away for the summer.   I went to take it fishing this past weekend and it will only charge to 83% and i get approx 5 hrs out of it.   Has anyone had an issue like this?   Any info is much appreciated.
Thanks

I had a Milwaukee 4ah lithium battery that worked great. Then all of a sudden it wouldn't charge. I put it on the charger ran it down, tried everything. Was just about to toss the battery then remembered an old trick I read that could bring batteries back to life.

I simply took the battery off the charger, and laid it directly on the concrete in my basement at about 65*F. Left it for a few days, then stuck it back on my charger. To my suprise it charged and has been working great for the last month.

[Bigassbassman]

Pretty sure this is a known issue with Marcum.  Sorry to hear.  Someone on the Colorado board has been having very similar issues, and second year in a row he returned the shuttle to Marcum for a replacement.  Sucks to hear.

[3300]

some good reading https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries, but doesn't include the battery marcum used in their shuttle. i've read batteries deteriorate even when not in use. i'd like marcum to explain how long their batteries have sat in these shuttles unused and how they care for them or if they care for them or if they put new stock in them or what they do to ensure end user gets fresh batteries. it's starting to sound like they had a bunch of them built years ago and are still using those  and are near end of life or past that when sold. they better step up if that's the case.

Marcum Shuttle
Compact, lightweight, powered by a 12-volt 12-amp hour Lithium ION polymer battery, extend your unit’s continuous run time up to 40 hours, for Marcum M-Series, LX-6s & LX-7 sonar systems

they told me their 40 hour claim was with a flasher.

[slipperybob]

note: 100% charge on the fuel gauge may be a lie. 

[3300]

i'll post this in equipment section and maybe make it a sticky because more and more of us are using these batteries now.
since i brought it up, here's more on the end of life information for lithium ion:

Nothing you can do safely to the battery regarding charging practices will "train" the battery to last longer or provide more runtime. It will only hold as much charge as it can based on what it was designed to hold and its stage of life, such as how old it is, how many times it's been charged and how aggressively it has been charged/discharged during it's time while in service. It will never hold more than it could immediately after manufacture and will lose capacity slowly over time, even if not used or charged. It will have lost the ability to hold a full rated capacity charge very shortly after being put into service, and in about 2 years will have lost enough capacity to be deemed as "end of life", which is about 20% of rated initial capacity lost, or the ability to hold only 80% of the initial rated capacity. Even a brand new battery if left on a shelf will be considered "end of life" after about 2-3 years due to its reduced capacity to hold a charge.

The only reason any recommendation has been made regarding draining a Lithium Ion battery is to reset the capacity level flags so it more accurately represents the battery levels at any given time. It is as said above completely protected during charging by a highly engineered charging system that shuts down charging to prevent overcharging. Draining the battery to 0% is never recommended by those who are giving proper advice. The phone shuts down at 0% to protect the battery from deep-discharge and potential permanent damage to the battery. This is a fail-safe mechanism as well, similar to the overcharge protection.

Getting the most from your battery depends on what you need it to do. If you are looking for the longest runtime with each charge so you can be away from any power source for extended periods, then charging with power off to 100% will maximize that charge, but it will add stress to the battery if done frequently and will shorten its lifespan. If you're looking to extend the life of the battery and are much less concerned about long breaks away from a power source, then charging more frequently and in partial charge cycles through the middle range of capacity rather than full charges is better. Charging from 30% to 70% and using in that range, rather than 5% to 100% and using in that range is less stressful on the battery chemistry.

The reasons are that Lithium Ion batteries prefer not to be kept at high voltage levels (at or near full charge), for long periods of time, but instead prefer to be held at near 50% instead. Also Lithium Ion batteries do not like to be deeply discharged either, such as 0% to 5%, and would much rather be charged once levels of 10% to 15% are reached. Both practices will add months or more to the overall lifespan of the battery.

[Ranger619]

Fireman I ran a Shuttle for 1 year and 1 month because that’s all it lasted. There’s no break in period for a Lithium battery in the Shuttle if there was it would be in the instructions which it isn’t. I contacted Marcum about my unit going dead after 4-5 hrs on the ice and they told me if it was over a year old I’d have to pay to have a new battery installed by them (150.00) my unit was 1 year and a month old. I tried to buy a replacement battery on my own but was told by numerous battery outlets that the battery Marcum uses is a custom size only for them. So I went another route I purchase a Vexilar Pro Pack and made my own shuttle. Do a search on here and many pics of guys doing it will come up. Also maybe call Marcum and explain your problem maybe they’ll help you out. It’s to bad because I really liked my Shuttle. Glenn

Here you go Randy