The ice fishing Montana boards are sponsored by:

Author Topic: to release or not to release  (Read 7680 times)

Offline PerchPounderMT

  • Team IceShanty Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 996
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #30 on: Feb 23, 2018, 11:31 AM »
There have been study's that show when an eye gets to an age that it produces less fry than it consumes,but what do they know. ;D
Dont ask

Online missoulafish

  • Team IceShantyholic
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,949
  • TēM HîPē FÿSh
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #31 on: Feb 23, 2018, 11:58 AM »
Uh huh....

Offline zwiggles

  • Team IceShanty Maniac
  • **
  • Posts: 1,365
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #32 on: Feb 23, 2018, 01:02 PM »
There have been study's that show when an eye gets to an age that it produces less fry than it consumes,but what do they know. ;D

Do you have links to back that up?

I can find ones which indicate a 24” fish will lay 130k eggs. http://www.perraultfallsarea.ca/did-you-know.html

And roughly 1300 fry. So a 24” walleye is eating ~4 walleye fry each and every day?

Offline Figure ate

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 213
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #33 on: Feb 23, 2018, 01:06 PM »
Theres plenty of info available on the studys done,as high as 20% in some cases.

In other words you made the figure up on the fly to suit your argument.

Offline Gone_fishing

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 112
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #34 on: Feb 23, 2018, 01:59 PM »
In other words you made the figure up on the fly to suit your argument.

A quick google search will give you plenty of studies and articles to sift through on the topic. I mostly catch and release (unless they're perch they taste too good haha) but I think a lot of anglers are blissfully ignorant of the fact that some fish you release will die. Mortality rates can be largely affected numerous conditions, such as handling techniques, tackle, whether you "played the fish out" bringing him in...etc. Properly handled fish have very high survival rates. I think if people who complain about someone keeping a big fish truly cared about releasing big fish and it having the best possible odds at survival they wouldn't be pulling them out of the water for their photo prior to releasing. Enough of my soap box I'm ready to get back to fishing!

Offline MatCat

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 321
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #35 on: Feb 23, 2018, 02:47 PM »
There are lots of strong feelings on this topic for both sides.  I never claimed to be a catch and release fisherman, I am however a proponent of selective harvest.  I'll never begrudge someone who catches a trophy and wants to mount it, but I see these pictures or even when I'm out fishing piles of frozen fish laying on the ice, not just one or two, but thirty or forty, and they have several 8,9,10 pounders in there.  I fish around here and some days catch few, other days pound the fish, but the average is like 14", then I go not 100 miles north to Canada, and not just one particular lake, but 7-8 different lakes and catch 60-100 and my average size is 22".  These are not catch an release lakes either, just reasonable management.  Any of our lakes could be like that, but it's a management thing.  Our regulations are set up with a generous possession limit and no size limit, it's not a coincidence that our fishing is poorer.  I know a lot of people see a limit as a daily goal and we never stop to think about whether we "can" keep that many, but "should" we keep that many.  It starts with the angler, us, if we are satisfied with how the fishing is, then no problem, but I know what it could be and therefore am not.  On another note, there is tons of studies and information out there on c&r mortality and egg viability in older bigger fish, to summarize everything I've read on the subject:
10% mortality for catch and release of trout is about standard, as far as warm water fish are concerned there is less than 2% when caught and released in general, which includes cutting line on deep embedded hooks, and up to 10% mortality when water is over 70 degrees, or if you dig the hook out of a gut hooked fish.  They are just hardier species.
Older fish will produce more viable eggs than a younger fish, just due to sheer number of eggs, yes, the percentage is lower, but a 30" fish will have twice the eggs as a 20" fish, and even 10-12 pound walleyes will hatch over 80% of there eggs in good conditions.  Not making any numbers up here.  I love fishing, love eating fish, love everything about fish, just wish there was a little more common sense out there, our fisheries could be amazing instead of just mediocre.

Offline PerchPounderMT

  • Team IceShanty Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 996
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #36 on: Feb 23, 2018, 04:08 PM »
Figure 8,learn how to use google or stop trolling for an argument,your choice.  ::)
Mat
"Our regulations are set up with a generous possession limit and no size limit"
There are size limits on the waters I fish and there are plenty of published studys that show much higher mortality rates.
Dont ask

Offline MatCat

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 321
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #37 on: Feb 23, 2018, 04:44 PM »
Figure 8,learn how to use google or stop trolling for an argument,your choice.  ::)
Mat
"Our regulations are set up with a generous possession limit and no size limit"
There are size limits on the waters I fish and there are plenty of published studys that show much higher mortality rates.
Only four waters in the state have a size limit, Canyon ferry, hauser, holter, and lake Helena,  which are all a moot point because you can keep even more fish out of each one of those.  I am well aware of our regulations, I was just stating that there is sufficient evidence that we could have better, more productive fisheries if we took a cue from our friends just across the border.  Not trying to troll or start a fight, just looking for better fishing for everyone now and in the future.

Offline hoofer

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 284
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #38 on: Feb 23, 2018, 05:48 PM »
if your going to mount the large fish you catch go for it! they do not come around that that much.as for eating i rather keep smaller fish.the real big fish (walleyes , northern pike etc) get those little black veins in the meat that just do not look good. i have let some big walleye and northern go in hopes another fisher person has the same joy in catching them as i did. the mortality rate of released fish depends on what you are using ,bait higher lures lower.nothing to back up the last statement but common sense.bait swallow,lures lip.
fish till it hurts then fish some more

Offline chartreusealltheway

  • IceShanty Rookie
  • **
  • Posts: 18
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #39 on: Feb 23, 2018, 11:21 PM »
haaa  haaaaa haa.  this is unbelievable.  the origin of fishing is to eat fish. end of story. people that have turned it into a sport of catch and release are the worst criminals to the planet earth in my opinion. If you catch a monster, so be it.  on a side note... I have to laugh when people are talking about mechanisms that drop fish back down to the bottom of the lake before there bladder burst.  haa haaa haaaaa. you guys are rediculous and don't understand what it is to clean a fish no matter how small it is. DEAL WITH IT.  if you catch a small fish than you spend more time cleaning and enjoying the fresh flesh. if by chance you land the big one...clean it, eat it and you don't have to fish for a few more months. common guys. get with it.

Online missoulafish

  • Team IceShantyholic
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,949
  • TēM HîPē FÿSh
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #40 on: Feb 23, 2018, 11:41 PM »
Speaking of trolls I think we have a winner  here in chartreuse....move along Cheif.

Offline mtcommonwalleyeguy

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 172
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #41 on: Feb 24, 2018, 12:18 AM »
Speaking of trolls I think we have a winner  here in chartreuse....move along Cheif.

+1

Offline deadstick81

  • IceShanty Rookie
  • **
  • Posts: 51
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #42 on: Feb 24, 2018, 01:04 AM »
I like to eat fish. we only get ice for x amounts of months in the state .  I’ve dropped the bomb on back to back 20# pike spearing  if anyone  says they wouldn’t  reality check u would

Offline chartreusealltheway

  • IceShanty Rookie
  • **
  • Posts: 18
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #43 on: Feb 24, 2018, 09:50 AM »
I don't believe I'm glutenous, if going fishing a couple times a year and catching only 3 or 4 for a meal or two is then I'm no longer fishing along side people that take pride in there catch.  releasing a fish at the expense that it may die is ridiculous when it could feed you and sustain you till you go out next time, its better then a store bought fish which gill nets kill more than I care to know.  I value the life of the fish that feeds my family and the skin and bones that go into my garden to bring up fresh produce.  living off the land is incredible to me.  that being said, if the law says release a fish, then I do, and if the law says you can catch 50 i don't, I only catch what I can handle and store and eat . I'm astonished that my views aren't shared more, as these where the ways not to long ago.  confession though.  I've released a 15lb 34.5 inch walleye back into canyon ferry.  only fought for 5 seconds, caught in 4 ft of water below the boat and netted instantly.  neither of us could physically fish anymore after seeing such a monster so we laughed and went home. Its hard not knowing what happened to that fish, I hope it paid off though.

Offline fridayfish

  • IceShanty Rookie
  • **
  • Posts: 65
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #44 on: Feb 24, 2018, 02:33 PM »
its not trolling to share your opinion on a controversial topic. posting one in the first place is more of an act of trolling. chartreuse makes some good points.

Offline SirCranksalot

  • Team IceShanty Maniac
  • **
  • Posts: 1,652
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #45 on: Feb 24, 2018, 02:45 PM »
I think maybe he just got back from his overseas diplomatic posting! ;D
Keep yer stick on the ice!

Offline hoofer

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 284
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #46 on: Feb 24, 2018, 03:00 PM »
chartreuse , not to long ago we had more and bigger fish and less fisher persons.
fish till it hurts then fish some more

Offline SpitzoMT

  • Team IceShanty Maniac
  • **
  • Posts: 4,462
  • FLX-28 Ultra Pack
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #47 on: Feb 24, 2018, 10:35 PM »
people that have turned it into a sport of catch and release are the worst criminals to the planet earth in my opinion.

Wow.....Inane comment of the season right there.....I don't eat fish, family doesn't eat fish & friends don't eat fish.....Sooooo.....I guess I'll cease my catch n' release "criminal to planet earth" ways & refrain from fishing altogether.....NOT !!
        

Online missoulafish

  • Team IceShantyholic
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,949
  • TēM HîPē FÿSh
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #48 on: Feb 25, 2018, 10:39 AM »
And then he praised him self for what he was criticizing everyone for.... :cookoo: :cookoo:

Offline MNinMT

  • IceShanty Rookie
  • **
  • Posts: 17
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #49 on: Feb 25, 2018, 10:43 AM »
Wow.....Inane comment of the season right there.....I don't eat fish, family doesn't eat fish & friends don't eat fish.....Sooooo.....I guess I'll cease my catch n' release "criminal to planet earth" ways & refrain from fishing altogether.....NOT !!

+1.

What's wrong with catch and release exactly?

Because that's what they do on tv? Or because the fish may die?

I caught a tagged fish once that had been caught 8 times in a 6 year span. Mortality after release definitely depends on several factors. Use best judgment. Keep what you want to eat and don't waste. Nothing wrong with that and there's certainly nothing wrong with catch and release fishing. Not a criminal act anyway...

Offline chartreusealltheway

  • IceShanty Rookie
  • **
  • Posts: 18
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #50 on: Feb 25, 2018, 12:26 PM »
I must admit I was a little dramatic there, but catch and keepers get hammered all the time so I thought I'd punch back.  I used to catch and release quite often, especially the summer fly season. But I've read allot of articles and have changed my mind.  The number of catch and releasers is on the rise and catch and keepers are fighting for the right to keep fish.  If I catch and keep 1 trout it's better than catch and releasing 30, from the trouts perspective of course and mortality data on summer fishing rivers. This in my mind must be similar when releasing iced fish, frozen gills, holes in the lip, busted bladders, etc.

Offline Icephishwyo

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 345
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #51 on: Feb 25, 2018, 12:33 PM »
Walleye grant me the serenity to accept the things I can not change
The courage to change the things I can
And wisdom to know the difference  ;D

Offline coldcreekchris

  • Team IceShanty Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 805
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #52 on: Feb 26, 2018, 01:45 AM »
Take only what you need....I fish more for substenance..than sport...but am selective and keep a fraction what I catch.....when I see....one guy posing with 20 lbs of filets...I wonder a bit...hopefully all is shared and consumed....we can all have our opinions on catch and release....but the real issue is whether their is respect and gratitude for the creature taken...some are conscious others blind....and that is up to one's perception..and that's another story...the sin...is when fish/meat is wasted...and if you are releasing..and u are doing it in a conscious matter...it's one thing..and if you are eating and being selective...and consciously releasing...it's one thing...never understood trophy...why have a mount of the biggest thing killed?..a lion..giraffe...elepha nt...Kodiak or 25 lb pike or 6 lb smallie...I get that many on this site desire to have these trophies on their walls..or in their photos...but others are not that way...I personally would rather have those monster bulls in the woods..and those huge old fish in the waters....many of us here are expert hunters..we can take at will... But we choose to be selective...or not at all....to take just cause you can....?..sigh...

Offline Born Late

  • Team IceShanty Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 808
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #53 on: Feb 26, 2018, 09:11 AM »
One of the interesting and recurring thoughts in this thread is the apparent belief by some that if something is legal, it’s therefore ethical. There are plenty of examples in (or missing from) MT regs that allow for legal practices I (and maybe you) don’t consider ethical.


YOU are the only one who can decide if the ice is safe enough for you.

Online missoulafish

  • Team IceShantyholic
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,949
  • TēM HîPē FÿSh
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #54 on: Feb 26, 2018, 09:41 AM »
Agree 100% Dave.

“Ethical behavior is doing the right thing when no one else is watching- even when doing the wrong thing is legal.”

― Aldo Leopold

Offline Duke22

  • IceShanty Rookie
  • **
  • Posts: 13
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #55 on: Feb 26, 2018, 09:44 AM »
IMO, this has been one of the more, if not THE most interesting topics I have read on this forum.  I have a great amount of respect for all fisherman, and their reasons for keeping and/or releasing (this, of course does not include those who cross the line of the law).  Years ago, I had an experience with a walleye fishermen getting angry about keeping walleye that they felt they should be released, and to be quite honest, their argument, at the time, was something that had never crossed my mind, and also made a lot of sense.  I have enjoyed reading everyone's opinion on this topic, however, over the years I have developed a mindset that hasn't been expressed here yet.  I DO considered myself a trophy fisherman/hunter.  I have had a lot of success with big bulls/bucks/fish throughout the years.  Where I have become different with fishing though, is that I do not have to keep a fish to enjoy it.  I have literally fished multiple days on multiple trips, and only kept the fish that I felt would not survive, and have never let a piece of meat go to waste.  If by chance I caught a trophy, pictures are taken and the fish is back in the water as soon as possible.  While hunting, I have set standards of the quality of animal that I would like to harvest, and if three or four years pass without seeing that type of animal, I am very content to go without.  I simply enjoy being in the mountains, on the ice, or on the lake in the summer.  I enjoy watching others succeed, fill the freezer if needed/wanted, or take pride in a big fish that they wish to keep.  I enjoy the thrill of not knowing what is one the other end of the line, or what is over the next ridge. In other words, I enjoys hunting WAY more that killing, and I enjoy fishing WAY more than catching.  To judge someone that has different motivations is ignorant.  I am fortunate enough to have a freezer full of beef every year, but also thoroughly enjoy eating fish/elk.  Who am I to place judgment on the guy that needs to kill two cow elk a year and keep every fish he can legally keep to feed his family??  Who am I to judge the guy that loves putting mounts on the wall??  In my opinion, there is an off setting group of people that have differing methods/ways that make fishing fun.  Until the FWP places lower limits or places a slot on a fishery, we should simply respect the people that are playing by the rules/laws, and criticize only those who are not.

Offline hoofer

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 284
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #56 on: Feb 26, 2018, 09:52 AM »
well said snitch#8 we here are not judges. you do what you do i do what i do (within the law of course) i do not pass judgement on anyone lest i be judged.
fish till it hurts then fish some more

Offline gf hardwater guy

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 282
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #57 on: Feb 26, 2018, 10:07 AM »
Ditto. One thing that I do know is that we are never going to be able to come to a consensus to this topic. One thing to keep in mind is the varying ages of those on this site. I for one came from a depression era family where nothing went to waste and nothing went back into the water. Doesn't mean that is the way I am, but I can tell you that if my father, who would have been 88 today if he was still with us, was involved with the hunting or fishing trip, nothing would be let go to grow up. I think as a general rule the younger generations are much more tolerant of catch and release or letting the animal go to grow up another year or two. Doesn't mean its a good thing or a bad thing as long as a person is functioning within the limits of the laws that are established for us to follow. If you wish to change the laws/Rules, then run for political office and be part of the solution.

 

Offline hoofer

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 284
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #58 on: Feb 26, 2018, 10:21 AM »
gf hard water guy you really dont  want to run for office do you? just think of all the names and such you will be called.
fish till it hurts then fish some more

Offline gf hardwater guy

  • Team IceShanty Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 282
Re: to release or not to release
« Reply #59 on: Feb 26, 2018, 12:01 PM »
Not on either of our lives hoofer. Not enough money in the world for that kind of headache. Probably more than a few people out there that would come out of the woodwork if my true identity was revealed in a campaign of this nature as well. :)

 



Iceshanty | MyFishFinder | MyHuntingForum
Contact | Disclaimer | Privacypolicy | Sponsor
© 1996- Iceshanty.com
All Rights Reserved.