Author Topic: Clam Thermal Material?  (Read 11397 times)

Offline zimmerDN

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Clam Thermal Material?
« on: Oct 26, 2009, 07:55 PM »
How will it improve my experience out on the ice other than not having to crank the heater up full blast?  Is it really worth $100 more? 

The $300 price tag is very attractive for the Nanook 2 person.

Offline Skipper

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #1 on: Oct 26, 2009, 07:57 PM »
The thermal cap not only keeps you warmer, but reduces the amount of condensation dripping on your head. I am thinking real hard about trading my Voyager for a Voyager TCX

Offline zimmerDN

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #2 on: Oct 26, 2009, 08:01 PM »
So the shanty doesn't vent properly through the top?  Has this thermal material been proven can confirmed by users from previous years?

I am curious to know.  Thanks for answer.

Offline Skipper

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #3 on: Oct 26, 2009, 08:07 PM »
When it is -10F you can open all the vents and it will still drip. as long as the interior temp of the shack is 50 degrees warmer than the outside temp, she is gonna drip. This has been true of all shacks I have owned, Shappell, Clam, and homade. The Thermal cap shacks are new for this year, but I have fished out of similar quilted shacks from Canvas Craft. The quilting ends the drip. If you do not fish in super cold temps with your heater running on high, you may never run into "the drip".

Offline Mainedog

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #4 on: Oct 26, 2009, 09:17 PM »
Interesting Skipper.

I have suffered from condensation/rain inside my DX3000, DX4000, my Rover, and one of my home-made shacks.
The one home made shack that didn't drip had a wood stove in it.  I've considered ways to put a small
wood stove inside a portable but don't think it's worth the effort or safe.  I have fished out of a Shappell 6000 and haven't suffered from the "drip" with the heater running.  Maybe because this shack has no floor and so doesn't get warm enough inside, or maybe because it has such good ventilation (which I think is the case).
So, to answer the poster's original question, is the thermal fabric worth it?  It wouldn't be for me if it added $100 to the cost of my 6000 since I am plenty warm inside it with my Buddy (but I dress for the weather too and don't like it too hot inside a shelter).  Nor would I like the extra weight or bulk that I suspect it would add.
Anyway, I just wanted to provide my positive feedback on the 6000.

MD

Offline zimmerDN

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #5 on: Oct 26, 2009, 09:44 PM »
So I am assuming you've tried all the tricks to remove condensation from above your head.

Is the slanted roof not enough to help condensation drain and collect at the lowest point of the shanty (away from the seat / person)?  Would spraying it help?

I've no problem paying the extra $100 if does get rid of the problem completely that can't be otherwise remedied by other means. 

Does it keep the shack a lot warmer?  Maybe the heat loss reduction will pay for the extra material cost from propane saved.

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #6 on: Oct 27, 2009, 05:02 AM »
I have a Frabill R-TEC from last year.  It has the Thinsulate insulated fabric and it is a warm, comfortable experience on the ice.  No dripping is one benefit.  No fabric flapping in the wind.  I don't regret paying the extra cash at all.  I heat with a standard (one bottle) buddy on low most of the time.

Offline michianafisherman

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #7 on: Oct 27, 2009, 05:26 AM »
When it is -10F you can open all the vents and it will still drip. as long as the interior temp of the shack is 50 degrees warmer than the outside temp, she is gonna drip. This has been true of all shacks I have owned, Shappell, Clam, and homade. The Thermal cap shacks are new for this year, but I have fished out of similar quilted shacks from Canvas Craft. The quilting ends the drip. If you do not fish in super cold temps with your heater running on high, you may never run into "the drip".
My homemade shanty has never dripped. I use R-Board. My theory is that when you are heating a shanty with the warm air from your source, the air floats around and touches all of the objects in your shanty including your walls. Depending on how cold the objects are determines how fast the warm air will cool down. With the tarp type shanty the air hits the material and starts to cool down fast. If you put your hand on the shanty it never really warms up. With the R-Board, you can put your hand on the walls and your hand will warm up. In other words when the air hits the walls it doesn't take the heat from the air. With a two mantle lantern I can get up to 80 degrees when it is 16 degrees out side. I have loaned my extra shanty to some friends the have a Heater Buddy and they about cooked themselves. They had to leave the door halfway open.
So to answer the question if more insulation is better, or worth it, I would say yes!
HELD HOSTAGE BY PHOTOBUCKET

Offline toddyrotten

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #8 on: Oct 27, 2009, 06:50 AM »
I think they have a pill or a shot to cure "the drip". ;D

Offline Skipper

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #9 on: Oct 27, 2009, 04:52 PM »
I think they have a pill or a shot to cure "the drip". ;D

You have experince with this? :o

Think of an ice cold beer bottle on a hot summer day. It is all condensating and dripping, even outside with the breeze blowing. It is the same thing with a tarp ice shack, only it is hot on the inside and cold on the outside. Ventilation does no good as long as the air outside the shack is below the dew point for the humidity level inside of the shack. Just like dew on the grass in the morning, the moisture in the air forms droplets when a certain temprature is met. There are two ways to combat this, dont use a heater or insulate. :-\

Offline Wiener

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #10 on: Oct 28, 2009, 12:28 PM »
Skipper,

I posted this same answer in the General Topics, but I emailed claim last spring.

You can buy the insulated cap canvas for your voyager,  or get the Thermal X canvas.

I was told it would fit a voyager.

Also,  You might want to look into the Fan / light that Clam came out with.
I think that buy circulating the air, it may get rid of some of the condensation.

I completely agree with you.   It really sucks to have water dripping down your neck while fishing.


Wiener

Offline mbart

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #11 on: Nov 05, 2009, 08:02 PM »
do a search for reflectix

Offline phredder

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #12 on: Dec 30, 2009, 11:13 PM »
Last year I fished in a 4 man ice cube (6 x 6 x 6 foot) heated with a 12,000 BTU sunflower propane heater.  On most days outside air temperature was cold enough that dripping water from the ceiling was for the most part not a problem, however, after a day of fishing the inside walls/ceiling would be lined with a thick coat of frost and ice.  This year I traded up for a Clam Command Post, roughly 12 x 6 x 6 feet and made of similar material, maybe slightly thicker.   I also traded up to a 30,000 BTU vented propane space heater--garage sale find.  The heater is about 2.5 cubic feet in size and is vented straight through the roof with a 3 inch double walled stove pipe.  Consequently, the bi-product of burned propane, water, exits the tent through the stove pipe and the walls/ceiling of the tent remain relatively frost free, even in temperatures of -20 celius (roughly -5 F).  The heater gives off enough heat that the tent floor of bare-naked-ice  begins to melt.  Even with the evaporation of the wet floor there hasn't yet been an issue humidity in the shelter.

Mike.

Offline CMMahy

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #13 on: Dec 31, 2009, 11:33 AM »
I've just recently installed Reflectix insulation on the ceiling of my 1 man Fish Trap Pro, and after heating the tent with and without the insulation, here's what I've found. Condensation and frost does build on the inside of the tent, the stuff on the ceiling does tend to drip down. The insulation on the roof provides a bit of a thermal break, keeping the condensation and frost from forming overhead. The condensation comes from just plain old breathing, as well as a by product of burning propane. Keeping one vent open helps let some of it out, but here's what the inside of the tent looks like at -34c with a regular Mr Buddy going full blast for 4 hours, even with a vent open:



See all the thick frost on the walls and ceiling? It was partially melting and dripping on the area over top of the heater, even in those fridgid temps.

I added the insulation, now NO condensation forms over head, and no drips. The walls still get wet however.





It helps keep the heat in as well, I don't run the heater as much or as high now. If you can afford the thermal model, by all means go for it. If you can't, buy the non-thermal and buy some reflectix, not as neat and clean, but cheaper and works as well. I think it cost me less than $40 for the 1 man (2'x10' roll of insulation and 1 roll of special tape.) Using a fan may keep some condensation from forming, but all that moist air is still circulating inside the tent, and there's all that cold, tent material for it to come in contact with. Adding insulation in any form eliminates areas for the condensation to form.

Good Luck
A bad day of fishing beats anything else I'd be doing today.....

Offline Wiener

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #14 on: Jan 01, 2010, 09:28 AM »
Nice job!!

And a nice Walleye too.

Glad to see you found a fix.


Wiener

Offline mealworm

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #15 on: Jan 01, 2010, 11:03 PM »
i can't believe how much frost was built up in your shanty, my clam scout never gets that bad maybe a little on the walls

Offline tightliner3

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #16 on: Jan 02, 2010, 09:33 AM »
 How did you get the insulation to stay in place, am thinking about doing the same thing.  Would velcro work?

Offline Wiener

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #17 on: Jan 02, 2010, 04:38 PM »
Looks like he sandwiched it between the poles and the fabric.

Wiener

Offline CMMahy

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #18 on: Jan 03, 2010, 04:50 PM »
Thanks!
I just squeezed it above the hoops, but I cut slits to pass the velcro loops through and now it's not going anywhere. I reinforced the cuts with the foil tape, and it seems to be holding. I've set up and taken it down several times and it hasn't moved or shifted.

Quote
i can't believe how much frost was built up in your shanty, my clam scout never gets that bad maybe a little on the walls

That was an extreme case, the morning started at -34c (not counting wind chill) and only warmed up as high as -28c, I kept my Mr Buddy Heater running on high the whole time. The tent is pretty much new and has the blackout coating on the inside, which makes it pretty air tight and doesn't let much of the moisture out.
A bad day of fishing beats anything else I'd be doing today.....

Offline 98600xc

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #19 on: Jan 21, 2010, 06:04 PM »
the thermal canvas is totally worth it.  I bought a clam base camp thermal this year and it is awesome.  I can run my buddy heater on low when it is in the teens fahrenheit.

Offline solar

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #20 on: Feb 19, 2010, 10:29 PM »
I have a Clam Thermal Base Camp. No matter how cold, I never, ever have had condensation. I run a Buddy heater, and it works very well. I was out today in gale force winds, the worst I ever experienced. I hadn't realized how bad it was. I thought the frame might give, it was that rough, I even had to go out at one point and re-adjust the tie down cords to the ice anchors, fierce. Taking it down was like wrestling with a huge blue angry square kite. Generally, I keep the two vent tabs open, I run a small Clam fan hanging off the inside and all works very well.

Offline WANNAKETCHUM

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #21 on: Mar 04, 2010, 02:30 AM »
I bought the Clam Nanook (full thermal) unit just recently so it hasn't seen any extreme temps as our ice is on it's way out. However, this past weekend the Mrs. and I fished out of it and I kept feeling the walls to see if there was any condensation and they were dry. It wasn't very cold out....maybe the low twenties and we fished into the evening with just a Coleman lantern for heat and it was really cozy inside....WK

 
Give your son a fish, and he will eat for a day.....teach your son to fish and eventually he'll end up kicking your @ss every time you fish together!!!

Offline nybrowndawg

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #22 on: Feb 08, 2011, 10:47 PM »
I have a non-thermal Yukon.  I recently purchased from Clam Corp an OEM design Thermal Cap that installs inside of my Yukon.  It was explained to me by their customer service that it goes over the poles and has slits that allow the velcro fasteners to slip through and wrap around the poles.  It doesn't show this on their website but I was ordering the RPS system for releasing the buttons on the poles and when she asked me if there was anything else I wanted to order, I said that if there was an aftermarket thermal cap for my Yukon that I would surely buy it.  It was like $35 bucks.  Would be trying it this weekend when I get to fish but it's going to be in the mid 30's. Probably won't need it in those temps

Offline WANNAKETCHUM

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #23 on: Feb 10, 2011, 09:33 AM »
If the RPS system for releasing the buttons on the poles is something you purchased, then I hate to be the bearer of bad news friend but you wasted your money. Those plastic clip-type things that go on the poles and are supposed to help you push the buttons in are JUNK >:( >:(. I ended up taking mine right off and throwing them down in the bottom of the sled. They won't stay in place or stay on the poles and in the time spent #%&$#@%& with them, you can have your shanty collapsed and be ready to go. I thought of taping them in place, but decided I would better off in the long run to just leave them off.......WK
Give your son a fish, and he will eat for a day.....teach your son to fish and eventually he'll end up kicking your @ss every time you fish together!!!

Offline nybrowndawg

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #24 on: Feb 10, 2011, 01:44 PM »
Clam informed me of the need to fasten with electrical tape.  I have a better tape that is stronger and doesn't have a nasty adhesive to get on anything so I'll be taping my set on.  I have a friend with then and he used electrical tape and is very happy with them.  I'll post my results Saturday after I get off the ice

Offline wesson4

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #25 on: Feb 10, 2011, 02:20 PM »
I have the Clam base camp thermal. and i also run the mr big buddy heater in it. I know in PA it doesn't get much below zero, but ive had my clam out over 30 times this winter and only 4 times did it frost the whole inside of the shanty. But not once has it ever started to drip. The winds are the only thing that has ever showed signs of dripping, but they to will usually frost.

I have a Clam Thermal Base Camp. No matter how cold, I never, ever have had condensation. I run a Buddy heater, and it works very well. I was out today in gale force winds, the worst I ever experienced. I hadn't realized how bad it was. I thought the frame might give, it was that rough, I even had to go out at one point and re-adjust the tie down cords to the ice anchors, fierce. Taking it down was like wrestling with a huge blue angry square kite. Generally, I keep the two vent tabs open, I run a small Clam fan hanging off the inside and all works very well.
also was just wondering if the fella that posted this had snow to pack around the bottom flap of the shanty?? I had mine out in the beginning of the year with 40-50mph winds with no snow anywhere...lets just say my shanty didn't last 10min. broke 3 of the poles and snapped 2 of the ice anchor ropes. maybe others have learned the same way or not but if there is high winds and NO snow my shanty will be at home. but must say CLAM customer service was great.

Offline nybrowndawg

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #26 on: Feb 14, 2011, 12:55 PM »
Received the thermal cap for my Yukon.  Very nice addition to my shack to give it the boost of a thermal cap.  I liked it so much I just ordered one for my Pro.  29 bucks to turn my pro into a thermal cap pro.

Offline zen_grasshopper

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #27 on: Feb 16, 2011, 02:32 PM »
I would say they are worth the few extra bucks.  I picked up a Clam Scout TC for this season and I was out a few weeks ago when the temp was -25 F with -40 or so wind chill.  The sides of the Scout were completely frosted over and after about 5 hours I could see a bit of frost forming on the thermal cap.  During the time I was out, I only had one drip from the roof, but I think that was because I was screwing around and knocking all the frost off the sides. 

Now it is 48 degrees and I wish I was on the ice instead of being at work!

Offline nybrowndawg

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Re: Clam Thermal Material?
« Reply #28 on: Feb 17, 2011, 12:58 PM »
The thermal cap came for my Pro today.  I installed it with no problems.  This is the way to go.  It's form fitted for the model, the slits for the velcro to come through are sewn nicely and it fits perfectly.  Customer service at clam wondered why they don't sell more.  Because they don't advertise that they are available.  So I'm going to start a new thread to anounce that they are available.

 



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