Flasher vs Non Flasher Fish Finder

[fcfcadd]

I am in the market for a portable fish finder this ice fishing this season however I DO NOT want a flasher. I do not want to go into why I don't want a flasher type fish finder so please don't ask. Can anyone suggest a good fish finder for under $200. I'm leaning towards the Lowrance X4 or X4 pro. I want to be able to plug this into my atv while searching for fish or use it running on batteries while in the new Quick Fish 6 I got.

[bee]

Give serious thought to the the Showdown Troller.

[fcfcadd]

I was just told about that one today by a co-worker as well. I will look at that one as well. I was told by Lowrance that the x-4 does not work in shallow water but the x-4 pro does, but neither come with the ice transducer and the lcd screens will start slowing down in prolonged exposure to below freezing temps. Does this happen to all lcd fish finders or only to those that are not designed for ice fishing?

[filetandrelease]

I was just told about that one today by a co-worker as well. I will look at that one as well. I was told by Lowrance that the x-4 does not work in shallow water but the x-4 pro does, but neither come with the ice transducer and the lcd screens will start slowing down in prolonged exposure to below freezing temps. Does this happen to all lcd fish finders or only to those that are not designed for ice fishing?

look up lowrance they make two 4's and a 5, in the ice machine that replaces the 67c , and i own 2 a 67c and i have fished it in subzero weather it is now 4 years old and i have a hds 5 X and have fished it in subzero weather better look at the specs because some of there units were tested to -20 and worked just fine ,better check the lowrance web site all the info you need is right there , good luck 

[fcfcadd]

I actually called lowrance today and the lady told me about the lcd's on the x4 and x4-pro not working all that well in prolonged exposure to sub freezing temps. She said after about 4 or 5 hours they will start showing the effects. I did not ask about any of there other models. The Elite-4x Ice pack looks ok. Just about $100 over my budget though.

[bee]

The troller has a built in heater if needed. It can be used with a external power source if you want to.

[fcfcadd]

But does the troller only show in flasher mode or does it do show like a open water fish finder? From what I am seeing is it's just a small hand held flasher, and I like I stated in the beginning. I don't want a flasher. Lowrance said their fish finders work on ice. You just have to buy the ice transducer if your not buying a dedicated ice fish finder. How ever the ice machines do show both flasher and open water type of display. I'm assuming the hummingbirds and the marcums do the same except for that troller.

[filetandrelease]

true but you can take a skimmer trans ducer and rig it for ice fishing , even the ones on my boat have graph plus flasher , or you could make a bracket for the ice ducer for the boat , i understand your plight with your dollar figure , been there my friend , but it is like buying a sportster and 2 years later out going it and getting a Electra glide that you will keep for a long time , hope you find something in your budget range 

[fcfcadd]

Don't have a boat. This will is for ice fishing only. I've got some time before I get a chance to go out and ice fish this season so I'll keep shopping around. Maybe one will come up for sale somewhere.

[filetandrelease]

let us know what you decide , and by the way how long does the ice last that is a factor also

[IDbasser]

I take my lowrance x510c off the bow of my bass boat in the winter and put it in the ice power packs for ice fishing.  I use the flasher mode, and it has a ice machine mode.  works really good, has a split screen zoom on the flasher.  I found the power pack at sportsmans warehouse for $80.  It was way cheaper than buying a whole new flasher.  The pack had everything I needed, I just had put the head unit and bracket in it.

[fcfcadd]

Ice here lasts from mid to late December until about march is all. I fish for trout and walleye is all.

[Pequod1]

Although I have and use the hummingbird ice 55, I also have set up a very cheap portable Piranha Max for an occasional buddy to use. I simply rigged up the transducer to an old wood tip up with electical tape. I was surprized at how well it works. The screen stays brite and marks almost as well as anything else out there. You can easily see perch and walleyes, and even the jig if you tweek it. All this for under a $100.

[fcfcadd]

Was that the original transducer that came with the Piranha for open water?

[Kevin23]

How cold do you really fish, outside? Are you really going to fish outside for 5 hours in -20 real temps? Any of those you listed will work, but after you buy the ice ducer, a 12v sla battery, and a base to put the unit on, you are going to be $90-150 more.. might as well buy the ice set-up.

I'd say buy the ice set-up and then wire in an accessory port (cig lighter) to your ATV if it doesnt have one, then put a male pug on your flasher, and a female on your battery. Then you can switch from battery to ATV in literally a couple seconds.

[fcfcadd]

Your probably right there. Depends on if we even get cold enough weather to ice fish on.

[Homewrecker]

I understand why you do not want a flasher. me too !
I was looking for a 5 x pro in my area ,but no one cared the pro ,the pro has much more  power .
 I ended up buying a LX7  . I see my self being on the sonar screen 

[stripernut]

As I have posted before; I do not understand why so many people are stuck on just a couple brands, when a well known brand has every thing you need and more FOR LESS MONEY!!!;

I found the Garmin 300C Fish Finder to have all the features that I was looking for; Color with a high pixel count, a gain that lets me see tiny jigs in 40+ feet of water, a split screen with ZOOM, a flasher screen if I want it, but best of all, all for about $200.00.  It does not come or have available from Garmin an “Ice Transducer”, but Ice Shanty is full of ways to get around that. Now that I have used it a number of times, I can say that it performed very well. NO lag what so ever.  I did not get to try it around other user, so I can not speak about interference, but for me that is not a problem. I use 2 rechargeable 6 volt batteries ($20 total) in series for a total of 9 amps (cheaper than 1, 7 amp 12 volt battery). I tested the batteries for about 18 hour in two days and still had not gotten the batteries below 11.5 volts (unit works down to 10 volts). The dual beam is great and helpful split screen zoom!
It would not be the right unit for every one, but it has almost all the features of units selling for twice the money and will work even better for open water use.
Specs;

Display size, WxH:    2.1" x 2.8", 3.5" diagonal
Display resolution, WxH:    240 x 320 pixels
Display type:    QVGA
Weight:    9.6 oz (272 g)
Waterproof:    yes (IPX7)
Features and Benefits:
Audible alarms:    yes
Dual-beam sonar capable :    yes
Split-screen zoom:    yes
Ultrascroll® (displays fish targets at higher boat speeds):    yes
Fish Symbol ID (helps identify fish targets):    yes
AutoGain Technology (minimizes clutter, maximizes targets):    yes
Whiteline (indicates hard or soft bottom):    yes
Adjustable depth line (measures depth of underwater objects):    yes
Bottom lock (shows return from the bottom up):    yes
Water temperature log and graph:    yes
Water temperature sensor included:    yes
Water speed capable (displays speed on water):    yes

Frequency:    80/200 kHz (dual beam)
Transmit power:    Dual Beam, 150 W (RMS), 1,200 Watts (peak to peak)
Voltage range:    10-20 VDC
Maximum depth:    900 ft (dual beam)
Cone angle:    45° or 15° (dual beam)
One of the reasons for the long posting is to point out that there are many choices, not just the same ones most other anglers are using.
Tight Line!

[fcfcadd]

My mother-in-law has an older Eagle Cudda 300, not the portable one but the regular one. Would this one work for what I want to do?

[Homewrecker]

I used an old cuda 242 fishing in100ft of water and it worked . You need to shut off the fish ID  and turn up the senitivity.
This way you will not be seeing those fake fish on the screen that could be anything .
What you should see is you hook going down , because it is a scrolling graph that never stops you will see a line right across the screen  as you move your hook down the line will move down .
 fish will show up like a falling star  or a metor with a tail  but moving towards your hook.
 
You can use the same transducer from the boat just mounted it on some wood as it must be level in the water.
If your dept gauge is acting up your tranducer is no good normaly goes bad if left on the boat in weather lower than -25 c
good luck

[fcfcadd]

The good thing is this has never been mounted on anything and is still in the box. How do I power it up? I have a spare battery for my atv, will that work or do I need something bigger like a car battery? Next question is can I use this as a form of depth finder by placing the transducer on top of the ice with some water and have it tell me how deep it is without having to drill a hole kind of like the showdown troller 2.0?

[Fisherman 1]

A spare 12volt ATV battery will do fine, add a 3 amp fuse on the red wire.   You can "cheat" by putting the transducer on the ice, pour a wee bit of salt water around it so there's no open air space below the face of the transducer.   Again, if the ice is full of bubbles or porous then it may not work too well.  Clear new black ice works the best.

[CatskillsFisher]

I use my H bird flasher all year long...works awesome on the boat and awesome on the ice...

[Moonman]

The good thing is this has never been mounted on anything and is still in the box. How do I power it up? I have a spare battery for my atv, will that work or do I need something bigger like a car battery? Next question is can I use this as a form of depth finder by placing the transducer on top of the ice with some water and have it tell me how deep it is without having to drill a hole kind of like the showdown troller 2.0?

The answer to all your questions is yes, yes, yes! Your ATV battery will work fine. All you need is a 12v source so any 12v battery will work. Bigger batteries just have more amps and last longer but are heavy. Would you also use this summer fishing? If so, you could even consider using it with AA batteries. It is dead easy and VERY cheap. Would make the whole thing very portable. If you want to know how to do this, just let me know and I will post it. I did this with my finder, a Garmin Echo 100. The finder is was only 80.00 Canadian $ and works great. I got it for canoe tripping/fishing because it was so small and light, with lots of features. It is rigged to read straight through the hull of my cedar strip canoe. One set of AA's lasts me all summer on several canoe trips. I mention this just to give you some ideas and to let you know, lots of things can work and be customized to your exact needs. If its a new in the box, then I'm sure there is already a fuse inline on the power cord so you are covered there.

ANY transducer will read through the ice. I use the water in the bag trick. Lots of ways to rig the transducer to sit in the fishing hole when set up. Search on this site, but its simple to rig a stick etc with the transducer clamped/taped/tied on it. Save your money and use your mother in law's finder. see how it works - you can always shell out for something else afterwards, but lots of guys are using older model LCD's and are putting fish on the ice with 'em.

Moonman.

[fcfcadd]

Thanks for the advice Moonman. I think I will give this one a try first and see if I can at least see some fish or see how deep it is. The quicker I can find fish or find structure or find drop offs and what not without having to drill tons of holes will make the fishing all that more fun and enjoyable. especially with the kids. As far as using it summer fishing no because I don't own a boat. Dad has that all covered so this is just for ice fishing only. I'd like to know how to gett it to run on AA's? The other thought I had was to see if I could hook it up to a cigerette lighter adapter and plug it into my atv while it's running and use it that way as well?

[Moonman]

To get your finder (any finder) to run on AA's you just have to supply the required volts, which for most finders is 12v, but with a range from approx 10-18 or so volts. The specific voltage range will be listed in the technical specs of the manual, most of which can be found online.

Each AA battery provides 1.5v. That means you need 8 AA batteries to get 12 volts (8 x 1.5 = 12). Now you can manually wire in series/solder these batteries together to do this, but that's a hassle. Radio shack or any local electronics store will sell a battery pack holder for about 2.00. Just put your batteries in and connect the wires from your finder and you are done. Here is a picture of mine:

Note, you can also get a 10 battery holder, which will give you 15v and more/longer lasting power.
I placed the battery pack in a water tight food container from Walmart. Its about 2.5" x 2.5" x 3.5". I made a hole in the side to run the wires through then siliconed it. This small little package weighs next to nothing and will power my unit for several trips. Power consumption varies depending on your unit. Again the specs will tell you this. B&W = less power consumption, color = more power consumption, etc etc. The main thing I want from my finder is depth to find structure etc. The bonus is the detail it shows - I can easily see fish, my lure jigging up and down soft/hard bottom transitions etc etc.

Moonman.

[fcfcadd]

Thank you for the advice Moonman and Fisherman 1. Here is my completed project ready to try out tomorrow. I can plug it in either to the battery, to the AA's, or even into the lighter of any atv or vehicle.



The completed collection:
Eagle Cudda 300 - Borrowed from mother-in-law since she doesn't have a boat and no use for this = $0
Spare ATV battery - $100 bucks new but since I already had this one $0
AA 8 battery pack - Radio Shack = $2.29
12V Car adapter - Radio Shack = $9.99
2 sets of Conductor cables - Radio Shack - $6.99 ea. = $13.98
Tumbler W/ Straw (Cup) - Dollar Tree = $1.00
Foam and wood = $0
Total invested = $27.26



I took and drilled the ends off a 9V battery and then soldiered then onto the wire so It can be removable.



I bought this cup from the dollar store that has a seal on the top and a hole already in it from the straw, then added some indoor plumbing water line foam so it was a tighter fit.



I made this L shape for the transducer. I will change this later on but for now this is what I had laying around the house.



Everything except for the transducer holder fights inside a field utility box that is also water tight. Any thoughts or suggestions on any changes would be greatly appreciated. Once again I'd like to thank Moonman and Fisherman 1 for there advice on all of this. Hopes this helps others save a few hundred bucks on fish finders for hard water by using there open water rigs from their boats and hook them up for winter use. For under $30 bucks you too can have a very portable fish finder.

[Fisherman 1]

  Nice work.  The only thing you might want to tweak is the "L" wood bracket,  it might want to float in the hole, maybe you can keep it down by setting the end of the green fish finder box on top for now.    I made some by using 1/4" threaded rod, each piece just long enough to fit inside the box, about 10" long.  Then depending on the ice thickness, you can adjust the length to get the transducer just below the ice surface.  You can get "coupling nuts"  to connect each piece together.  Use a piece of aluminum bar about 10" long, drill a 1/4" hole, put the threaded rod through it and add a wingnut.  For the bottom attachment for the transducer to the rod, I'm sure you can figure something out.  Cheers.

[fcfcadd]

Got to try it out yesterday and your right the L shape wanted to float so going to make a change on that for sure. As for the finder its self it read depth and I could not figure out how to get it tweaked enough to get it to read right. I've got some more learning to do on that. Question, do I point the transducer away from the hole or towards the hole?

[Fishrmn]

I had a friend who wanted to point the oval shaped end of the transducer down.  It doesn't work that way.  Imagine the transducer like a boat.  The 'pointed' end being the bow, and the oval end as the stern.  You've got a 'high speed' transducer designed to be attached to the stern of a boat, but it will work fine if it's oriented correctly in the water.  Anything buoyant used to hold the transducer will float up and make it tough to keep it where you want it.  Metal, or PVC works, but don't cap the PVC or it's full of air and tends to float.