LAKE GEORGE BS THREAD

[mikerudy]

Dang man. I'm glad you're alright.
I'm guessing it is the same hole that I found over the weekend. Someone opened it up driving over the crack with a quad.
If so, I had that hole marked with a tipup with the flag standing up Sunday evening. Someone must have taken the tipup. I posted a few pages back. I had found the tipup after everyone left. Told my kid he could have it. Just to tell him when we were walking off that we need to leave it behind to mark the hole. He was mad at me until I explained it might save someone from getting wet or killed. It grinds my gears that someone took it when it was pretty clear why it was put there. 
I'm really sorry you got wet man, but glad you're here to warn the rest of us.

Sounds like the Flag must have fell in, just glad no one had a bad misfortune.

Mike

[Barebow]

Capt JJ, my old fishing partner worked for old man Elsworth, then jamie over 27 years ago, then Jeff at the Peace Pipe before it was 307.  I grew up in Elsworth's, and I am almost 58.  DEC biologist figured out the most of the salmon were sterile from inbreeding so long, they began  stocking different strains to see if they could turn the spawning around with the few that may not be sterile.  Oh, they did spawn in the lake, even back in the 70's we would see then in the creeks and around the mouths of brooks in the fall.  After all, they have been there since the glaciers receded, and cut them off from the ocean.  They are called "LandLocked Salmon" because of the glaciers, but are basically Atlantic salmon that learned to spawn and live without returning to the ocean in freshwater lakes and streams....My Great grandfather watched them spawn in the 40's when he was the caretaker of the Wiawaka.  see my other post...He also ran the lake George private trout hatchery on rte. 9 just about where the BBQ joint is off exit 21....Barebow

[SSmokinn SS]

That pressure crack at PK is there every year, however, there are 2 there this year and now with the snow, they will be hard to find. Glad you got out ok, hopefully it doesnt happen again to anyone else. I saw the tipup there in the crack last sunday afternoon on my way off the ice. I thought it was a great idea. Whoever finds the pressure cracks again first, should mark them somehow with a 2x4 or something.

[step2jimi]

Hate to interrupt the bio talk but what am I gonna do on Saturday with all this snow. Im a walker man, no wheeler or sled for this guy iv got hooves and that's it. As I was snowblowing the driveway tonight I got to thinking "man this thing is powerful I bet it could pull my sled". Might be willing to pay someone to pull my sled out for me. They wouldn't even have to bring me out, Just my crap. Im starting to think I built my smitty sled wrong because everyone talks about how great it goes through deep snow and mine doesn't. Doesn't sit on top like everyone sais it just sinks in and is a bear to move. Eh, either way ill be out there again Saturday. Thinking about going somewhere Iv never been before. Can anyone tell me where I can or if I can access in Hague. Iv been studying navionics maps and found a spot I want to try but don't know where to access.

[Barebow]

Hague boat launch!!

[SSmokinn SS]

Hate to interrupt the bio talk but what am I gonna do on Saturday with all this snow. Im a walker man, no wheeler or sled for this guy iv got hooves and that's it. As I was snowblowing the driveway tonight I got to thinking "man this thing is powerful I bet it could pull my sled". Might be willing to pay someone to pull my sled out for me. They wouldn't even have to bring me out, Just my crap. Im starting to think I built my smitty sled wrong because everyone talks about how great it goes through deep snow and mine doesn't. Doesn't sit on top like everyone sais it just sinks in and is a bear to move. Eh, either way ill be out there again Saturday. Thinking about going somewhere Iv never been before. Can anyone tell me where I can or if I can access in Hague. Iv been studying navionics maps and found a spot I want to try but don't know where to access.

I have a polaris 6x6 that has a cargo dump body. I will need to register it to bring it on the lake, but it goes through that snow when in 6x6 mode like nothing. The problem is, its so long I dont think it would fit on my truck. Granted, this doesnt help you for saturday, but my best advice is maybe pack lighter and carry everything and bring a back pack. Thats what me and steve are going to do sunday, if you are still in? How far of a walk is it to your spot sunday?

[MikeVT]

Hague boat launch!!

X2 - town park right the the intersection of 9n and 8.  Trudge out about 200 yds and you'll be in prime laker water.  Just beware of where Hague Brook comes in, can get a little soft there.  If you see a group of guys in the middle of the lake, that is the sunken island, guys will be fishing that for perch.  Good Luck.

[Mayne, J]

Thank you bearbow for confirming ll salmon have bread in lg for a long time. The reason there were more charters in the past was because there where more fish creating the market. But in order to resstablish a heathy population of salmon witch can successfully reproduce in the system a keeper salmon of,18 in realy shuld not be kept an left to breed. That in combonation with culing the laker population  and the new genetics that have ben introduced from Maine culd bring  back the salmon to lg like it was in the past.i wuld just like to see the salmon go from what is considered a put an take fishery and have it become at least a semi self sustainable fishery and it can be done if ppl put the practices the biologist sugest into afect

[wiredstone]

Hague sounds right to me too. I am headed out this morning. I will give a report later today. Good luck and stay safe pout there

[wec]

Nice laker EJ, must have been fun out there.

[TC5]

hay Barbow was your bodes name ray.

[mike304]

Fished Roger's Rock Monday and had a good day, but fishing on Modays has its drawbacks. Fish307 bait is all gone (at least the last 2 weeks), Outdoorsman is closed and Crossroads doesn't open til 7 (though the bait was perfect sizes). Its hard for me to get bait the day before, hopefully one of these places step up a little. Their employees are all very nice but we all don't fish on Saturday and Sunday

Have ya tried Nenec's in Warrensburg? They also sell bait.

[Barebow]

TC5, Yes!  Ray McCauley, still trying to get him out fishing this year, his work hours and mine conflict though, hope to be soon filling a pail with him....Barebow!!   

[bluemountainlaker]

headin out in a few for some laker action! ill bee off pk somewhere. if ya see a big dude in a brown suite come say hi.

[MJB518]

headin out in a few for some laker action! ill bee off pk somewhere. if ya see a big dude in a brown suite come say hi.

Be careful. I fell in yesterday off PK.

[bluemountainlaker]

I will deff be carefull! im going out just south of pk. my buddy has a camp there.

[Icemark247]

^ Good luck man im just hoping to meet some of you out there when i get up!

[bluemountainlaker]

thanks!

[adksmitty]

A lot of snow in the bays. Tough walking and pulling. Out on main lake , less snow , wind drifts. Still tough on your body if towing a shanty. Did mange to get a few hook up's yesterday . And in the bay , the perch bite was good too.

[combsey]

Hey blue witch buddy is just south of pk?    Does he have lake access?   

[bassinbrian_on_ice]

Now if all you guys with machines can pack down trails for all us walkers ... that would be greeeaaatttttt      Thank you

[butch76]

If so, I had that hole marked with a tipup with the flag standing up Sunday evening. Someone must have taken the tipup. I posted a few pages back. I had found the tipup after everyone left. Told my kid he could have it. Just to tell him when we were walking off that we need to leave it behind to mark the hole. He was mad at me until I explained it might save someone from getting wet or killed. It grinds my gears that someone took it when it was pretty clear why it was put there. 
I'm really sorry you got wet man, but glad you're here to warn the rest of us.

A tip up might not be the best way to warn people though.  Someone could want to check out a lone tip up, not to mention take it themselves.  Just my thought.

[step2jimi]

Now if all you guys with machines can pack down trails for all us walkers ... that would be greeeaaatttttt      Thank you

Im with brian. Gonna be hard for us walkers but ill be there.

[prchslyr]

A tip up might not be the best way to warn people though.  Someone could want to check out a lone tip up, not to mention take it themselves.  Just my thought.

You're totally right. It was all I thought up on the spot. 
Hopefully someone stands some sticks up around it. if not, I will the next time I can get out.

[JJ]

Capt JJ, my old fishing partner worked for old man Elsworth, then jamie over 27 years ago, then Jeff at the Peace Pipe before it was 307.  I grew up in Elsworth's, and I am almost 58.  DEC biologist figured out the most of the salmon were sterile from inbreeding so long, they began  stocking different strains to see if they could turn the spawning around with the few that may not be sterile.  Oh, they did spawn in the lake, even back in the 70's we would see then in the creeks and around the mouths of brooks in the fall.  After all, they have been there since the glaciers receded, and cut them off from the ocean.  They are called "LandLocked Salmon" because of the glaciers, but are basically Atlantic salmon that learned to spawn and live without returning to the ocean in freshwater lakes and streams....My Great grandfather watched them spawn in the 40's when he was the caretaker of the Wiawaka.  see my other post...He also ran the lake George private trout hatchery on rte. 9 just about where the BBQ joint is off exit 21....Barebow

I know Ray, but what does knowing him or the Ellsworths have to do with salmon reproduction in LG? I knew them, too. I have spoken with several biologists about LG salmon over the years. I studied biology in college and one of my professors was Carl George, he wrote a book titled: The Fishes of the Lake George Watershed. I also have many papers and articles on the LG fishery, including the Angler Diary Cooperator Summaries going back to 1994.

Never heard of the salmon becoming sterile at the hatchery, if that was the case how are the able to get enough salmon to stock? I do believe inbreeding has caused issues with survival of the stocked fish, that's one reason why they started adding Sebago strain; unfortunately since then the salmon have done even worse.

I am well aware of them being called landlocked salmon , some got trapped when the glaciers receded, but they were never naturally in LG. Some salmon may have been trapped in LG when the glaciers receded, but they didn't survive or adapt here, probably due to insufficient spawning waters. They didn't "learn" to spawn, fish aren't that smart. They adapted and eventually evolved to spawn, yet they needed flowing water, they don't successfully spawn in lakes. They may go through the motions of spawning in the Fall, that instinct that has evolved into them causes them to attempt spawning. We used to go up to Norowal Marina in November and watch the salmon swimming around right in the deep hole at the boat launch trying to spawn. They were stocked there and naturally imprinted on that spot, and by nature they return to the stream/river where they hatched, in this case the boat launch was the closest thing.

According to the DEC: "Atlantics were historically found in Lake Ontario, the St. Lawrence River, Lake Champlain, and in many of their tributaries", they weren't in many lakes, LG included. In Maine they ended up only in lakes within river systems, again, they need flowing water to spawn: "Prior to 1868, landlocked salmon populations occurred in only four river basins in Maine: the St. Croix, including West Grand Lake in Washington County; the Union, including Green Lake in Hancock County; the Penobscot, including Sebec Lake in Piscataquis County; and the Presumpscot, including Sebago Lake in Cumberland County."(From Maine F&W)

That is an interesting story about your grandfather, but not sure is proves much scientifically, it is anecdotal evidence. You stated: "the perch and sunfish moved in immediately after the spawn and ate all the fry they could catch". That doesn't make sense, salmon spawn in gravelly riffle sections of streams and rivers, burying the eggs. The eggs spend the winter and hatch the following Spring, then the fry hatch and swim up out of the gravel. They then become parr and spend a year or more in the stream/river growing into smolts; which will then move to the open water and grow very rapidly. The perch and sunfish may have moved in and eaten the eggs?

A few years ago a biologist from the US Fish & Wildlife Service came to LG, they had grant money to improve fish spawning habitat in the LG basin. I accompanied her and the DEC biologist along with people from WC Soil & Conservation to check out the suitability of several LG tributaries, it was determined that they were not suitable for salmon spawning.

Here's an article about LG salmon written by a friend of mine: http://www.lgfa.org/articles/landlock-salmon.htm

[JJ]

Thank you bearbow for confirming ll salmon have bread in lg for a long time. The reason there were more charters in the past was because there where more fish creating the market. But in order to resstablish a heathy population of salmon witch can successfully reproduce in the system a keeper salmon of,18 in realy shuld not be kept an left to breed. That in combonation with culing the laker population  and the new genetics that have ben introduced from Maine culd bring  back the salmon to lg like it was in the past.i wuld just like to see the salmon go from what is considered a put an take fishery and have it become at least a semi self sustainable fishery and it can be done if ppl put the practices the biologist sugest into afect

The salmon have not successfully BRED in sufficient numbers in LG ever, after being stocked for over 120 years, that should tell you something about suitable spawning habitat. It will always be a put and take salmon fishery.

As for the charter business, the fish don't make up the "market", customers do and there aren't as many as there used to be; charters are more expensive now and expenses for charter businesses are high on LG, like dock fees. The real reason the number is down is many guides stopped guiding and few new ones have replaced them.

[fishyfishes]

Beware at pilots knob people. I fell through this afternoon on my walk back to the vehicle. On the way out I noticed a mountain dew bottle off the edge of a pressure crack. I stayed a good distance away from it (roughly 100ft) took a step and went through about 2in of slush. Realized thats not good and went to step to the side to walk away and went in. It happened really quick. I was able to get right out without much trouble. The ice did not break around me as I was getting back on top. I went in to about my abdomen. There were other guys in shanties close by that I wanted to walk out and warn but I was soaked and the only thing on my mind was to get to the car and warm up.  Please be careful people. With the snow blown all around im sure its nearly impossible to see these bad spots.

I know there is a big pressure ridge that comes off of Elizabeth Island and heads across the lake.

[Chase88]

That's an interesting article on the salmon. The high rate of fish surviving in the fall compared to the spring proves to me that the strain of salmon will survive in Lake George and that more survive when they are stocked when the predators are in deep water and they are of a larger size. I would like to see the spring stocking done in the creeks not because they need to be up in the creek for a year and half but it would break up the tendency to swim in circles in large schools just like the rest of the bait fish. If they are put in the streams they would work there way out in smaller amounts and hopefully be a little more street wise. There are lot less predators up in the creeks then there are in the main lake. Hopefully they would not be coming out in the lake until late June or July when the majority of predator fish have gone deeper. When Ernie Lantiene was the biologist for this area that is where they were stocked and it seemed to work quite well. That was in the late 70's and early 80's.

[bigredonice]

I would like to see the spring stocking done in the creeks

they've been doing that on the Lake Champlain tribs for years, and (from the DEC biologist I talked to a few years ago) not getting nearly the return from those particular fish as the ones that get stocked in the lake proper...

[Chase88]

Champlain has some natural reproduction and its an ocean compared to Lake George. There is no place on Lake George where you can dump those salmon in without being in the lake trout or bass.  Champlain has a lot of deep water where in the spring the lake trout are close to shore and the middle is barren.